Haven't got a clue

[Guest]

Haven\'t got a clue

I have a question for all you experienced sailors, several actually. I have recently taken up sailing in a very minor way, that is I have done the RYA introduction to sailing course in a dinghy and got some hours in sailing Wayfarer on a local lake, pond really. I think I would be happier sailing a some kind of keel boat; and intend to do some more RYA courses, and join a club, if of course one will have me. I have been looking recently at various boats with a view to purchase, up to now I have looked over a Macwester Rowan, a Newbridge Navigator, and Hurley 22 and 20 to name but a few. My main problems are I know nothing about boats other than what I have read, I am on a limited budget because I relatively poor and very mean, and I am not sure what exactly I want from a boat except that it must be safe and reasonably easy to operate. I will probably sail somewhere between North Wales and Morecambe bay as I live in Manchester. I am so inexeperienced that I don't even know what I am asking. If anyone can tell me their experiences of learning to sail in what I must admit to as middle age, what I need in a boat or even what books to read I would be grateful.

Chris.

 

[Ohdrat]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

Really reccommend a hurley or a a folkboat / folksong..

I would also post this type of Q in the Practical Boat Owner forum or Scuttlebut.. lots of peeps with knowledge of good pocket cruisers

Ask Kim (forum administrator to move this thread to one of the above and you will probably be inundated with suggestions / advice)

 

[phanakapan]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

i too started to sail in middle age, and have NO budget. This is my sailing history, if it helps. I did a dayskipper theory course with the rya, which is a good way to meet other local sailors, I got to crew on various different yachts. I then did a day skipper practical course, then a flotilla in the ionian, so gaining experience.My local yacht club run a course introducing one to racing, in the hopes that they'll pick up more racers, and were very freindly- and every week was a different sort of yacht, so I gradually reconciled what I was reading about boats in the magazines with the real things. Finally, when doing a yachtmaster theory course, I met a group of people who all had a share in an old cheap folkboat to use for training purposes, bought a share and as its not used that much by the other members, I get to sail almost whenever my other commitments allow. I must admit that I was apprehensive to start that the yachting world was peopled by mega rich yellow-wellied grotty-yotties, but I have met with nothing but freindliness, help and enthusiasm and no snobbery. I would reccomend keeping some sort of dinghy sailing going, as theres nothing like being in charge of your own boat af whatever size, sometimes when your crewing you dont get to do all the jobs. Good luck-- I shall follow with interest your sailing career!

 

[Guest]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

A Hurley 22 with twin keels could be a wise choice for Moorcambe Bay as it is a solid forgiving craft and if you do get cought out with the tides in such a shallow area you can take the ground. I sail one on the other side (Lincs/Wash/Norfolk)where there is lots of sandbanks too.

 

[Decrepit_Mariner]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

My first boat was a Contessa 26 - a souped-up folkboat. I sailed in the Bristal Channel, which like Morecombe has large tides. Provided I took care not to go aground on a falling tide (not always entirely successful) she really looked after me.

I had to sell with great sadness.

My second boat was a Newbridge Navigator. This was OK ish, but not a patch on the Contessa. I was warned she sailed like a bath-tub. I think that description flattered her. She had the advnatgae that she could be trailed. Reefed early, she was OK up to about a force 5 - in a folkboat you'd just be getting going!

Boats with outboard engines offer a cheaper engine, easier to take home and work on. Generally a diesel inborad has a lot going for it. I would not rule out an outboard.

 

[Trevor_swfyc]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

The first thing to do is to decide if you can overcome your meaness, if you think you are poor now try owning a boat.
The costs are going up, insurance, winter storage, haulage, moorings, antifoul paint, repairs, new sails, general tendency to support chandlers and club membership it all adds up. Maybe £500 - £1000 a year, a lot more if you have to berth in a marina.
If this is putting you off sorry but it is better to be realistic. I would join a club with a dinghy and get your foot in the door, ear to the ground, get to know which boats are preferred in your area and why. Also you stand a good chance to crew once you are known in a club.
Whatever you decide take your time rather than regret it later.
Hope this was not to negative!
Trevor

 

[Guest]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

Try starting with an RYA Competent Crew course, Conwy School of Yachting are nice and friendly,that's where I started and had a great time.I then went on to do the Day Skipper theory and practical.
On a Comp.crew week you're not expected to know anything and yet you have a go at everything,living on-board the whole time.
Good luck

 

[Avocet]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

My wife and I weren't sure if we'd like sailing so we bought a tatty but sound Leisure 17 (about £750, nearly 10 years ago). We trailed it from Preston to Windermere and got reasonably proficient before venturing out on to the Wyre estuary. The Leisure was a fantstic little boat and we'd recommend one to anyone learning to sail. The only drawbacks were obvious -no space, no creature comforts and not much performance.

We then bought an Evolution 22 - big mistake! more space - certainly. More prformance - OH YES!!!! (but only in flat water) On Windermere, it went like a scalded cat. On Morecambe bay, every wave that hit the boat moved it backwards 20 feet. It was an utterly horrid thing to sail in a chop.

Our third and current boat is a Cutlass 27 (like a Folkboat) a good, heavy, floating "Volvo" of a thing and by far the nicest boat we've ever sailed in lumpy water but unfortunately, very cramped below decks.

Although it seems tempting to have something that can take the ground because Morecambe bay is so shallow, we found that the sticky glutinous mud got EVERYWHERE when we dried out in the Evolution or the Leisure. The Cutlass can't dry out (well not easily) but at least we stay clean - only the tender got muddy.

Try as many boats as you can and then be prepared to change as your requirements change.

 

[paulrossall]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

I sailed dinghys on and off for years, not very well, and spent lots of time maintaining them. Then at age 45 went on an evening course for RYA Day Skipper Theory where I got lucky. The tutor was part of a sailing organisation/club who chartered yachts and I went for a Friday night to Sunday night sail from Hull to Bridlington and then to Grimsby in a Westerly Consort. This was a completely diferent world to sailing a dinghy! You were not worrying about turning upside down/getting wet. Sailing ie, what the wind was doing and balancing the sails was important, but so was navigation, the tides, other boats(very big boats) had to be considered. Also with 4 other people it was sociable, as opposed to being one or two of you in small boat for an hour or two. In last 5 years I have sailed on the East coast and have bought a Macwester 30 because it had plenty of room, is very well built, has a good inboard engine, has bilge keels and shallow draught and suits what I want to do today. A purist might say "it does not go up to wind very well" and quite right but then I turn my engine on. Point is you have to buy a boat that suits you, not every Tom, Dick and Harry who may be overopinionated as to what you should buy. Try to get to know some people who have boats and would take you with them for a trip. Go the paying route as well if you can afford it. I used to live in Manchester and suggest that North Wales and Cardigan Bay might be easier to sail than the Northern part of the Irish Sea. I would suggest you forget dinghys alltogether and concentrate on cruisers. Any more questions? Are you going to sail with wife/girlfriend/family or on your own? Good Luck Paul

 

[yachtcharisma]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

As others have said, everyone will do things differently, so don't take this as advise, just as other experiences! But I had sailed on week-long holidays on the Norfolk Broads as a child, then bought a Mirror dinghy on Lake Windermere. Sailed that there fairly extensively for a year - on my own, and, being a bit of a loner, basically "dinghy cruising" rather than racing. Moved down to Plymouth and brought the dinghy with me, so got some experience of sailing it on tidal waters basically around Plymouth Sound. After a year or so of that, did a "Day Skipper" course, sold the Mirror and bought a Corribee, 21 footer, which I'm still sailing now - although what was fairly generaous accomodation for one is becoming a little less so now I have a wife and 6-month old child!

If there are any lessons to be learned from that I guess you might think about the hiring a boat option - good chance to see if you really enjoy living on a boat and sailing something larger than a dinghy - provided you stay away from tidal waters you shouldn't have any trouble hiring one for a week on the basis of dinghy experience - Norfolk Broads would be the obvious choice, but I've also hired on Loch Ness (Scotland) and Lough Derg (Ireland). And don't ignore what a dinghy can teach you - if you get a "how to sail" book, and have a go at everything it mentions doing in a dinghy, you're quite well prepared when it comes to sailing something larger - I hove to, navigated, allowed for tides etc etc all in my Mirror - all things more commonly associated with "big-boat" sailing.

Hope that helps.

Cheers
Patrick

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Sailing a Corribee
vzone.virgin.net/patrick.fox
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[extravert]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

If you want to get some experience before taking the plunge you are welcome to do some crewing on my boat. I live in Chester and sail from Pwllheli in North Wales. There are plenty of boats like the other posters describe in Pwllheli. You'll have the opportunity to talk to some of the owners there and also see which ones are seriously sailed and which others never leave their berth (always a good sign).

 

[Guest]

Re: Haven\'t got a clue

I am 3 seasons on from where you are now. used to be a dinghy sailor/windsurfer. I wouldn't bother about competent crew if you already sail dinghies, I would recommend that you do Day Skipper Theory this winter, followed by Day Skipper practical next season. Any good sailing school will not let you do the Day Skipper Practical without having completing the theory first, because you will not have done tides/chart work/collision regs etc.

With regard to boat, I share a 22 Hurley, Fin keel, good boat to start with, heavy by today standards, but built as a real yacht not a floating caravan, great directional stability, not sure what the BK version is like. But they are all tough as old boots, hull thicker than newer yachts, didn't know enough about the strength of fibreglass when they built them, no too expensive to run, Plenty of standing rigging, can cope with a force 6 easily, not all todays 22' can. they have been use to cross the Atlantic/Pacific, so would be ok for Irish Sea, Plus they are like sailing a dinghy only slower.

What ever you choose, I'm sure you will enjoy it.