Gas rage!

[rotrax]

I'm sure it works better in the med or for marina hoppers, but here in Blighty you'd get a couple of weeks where it would seem to work then the whole thing would fail and you'd have to run to the marina or start the generator. I've done the sums, it simply won't work in the UK.

FWIW 200W didn't quite keep up with normal sailing loads and the fridge on our trip, and that's with us also running the engine for 20 mins for hot water each morning. The 9 days at anchor were during a heat wave with zero cloud cover and the panels were in good sun.

First Mate and I have been out since May 22nd. We have 400W of solar, 440AH house bank based on 4 X 110AH Lifeline AGM's. Two fridges and a freezer running 24/7/365. Been in Ireland, South and North, round to Londonderry. Now in Peel, IOM. In the 3 months away, not much sun. The batteries are showing 12.8V in the morning, soon rising to float voltage as the day brightens.
We have used one gas bottle, 3.9 propane, easily sourced in Howth. The new one is still pretty full. We have two spare bottles.
We have a 8KW Genset, only been used for hot water, device charging or the microwave.
The batteries have not had the charger on since 12 May when I completed the Solar install, apart, of course, from the engine alternator when the engine is in use.
When sailing it more than keeps up. When motorsailing the Balmar 110Amp engine alternator's smart regulator shuts it down and the charging light comes on as the Solar is keeping the bank right up when motorsailing in the - rare - sunny days.

The Solar install is 2X 200 W rigid panels with an Epever 30W MPPT controller.

Well pleased with its performance in far from bright conditions.

 

[lustyd]

So...not cooking with electric then? If you're using gas I'm not sure what your point is, you have more solar and use more electric and your results are about the same as mine, except in Ireland the gas company is slightly more competent ?

 

[ProDave]

The point you are all missing, is if you refill your own at home, you always start a trip with full cylinders so unless it is a long trip, you probably don't need to refill.

Compare that to the proper way, you start a trip with at least one bottle only partly full so that could run out early in the trip forcing the need to refill en route.

I am a convert to home filling now from the 47Kg cylinders we have at home anyway.

 

[geem]

We use a refillable gas bottle. 89p per litre at the moment. If you have an lpg refill station nearby it's a great solution. Safefill do some nice but expensive gas bottles. All plastic and grp so no rusty rings on the deck.?

 

[capnsensible]

The point you are all missing, is if you refill your own at home, you always start a trip with full cylinders so unless it is a long trip, you probably don't need to refill.

Compare that to the proper way, you start a trip with at least one bottle only partly full so that could run out early in the trip forcing the need to refill en route.

I am a convert to home filling now from the 47Kg cylinders we have at home anyway.

What if you live on your boat?

 

[Graham376]

The 907 holds 2.75kg so I assume he either doesn't cook or has a lot of them. going by my usage that would probably be three or four

907 lasts us 3 weeks, refills around €17. No problems with supply.

 

[lustyd]

unless it is a long trip

Mine was 50 days this year so I needed to replace one half way or risk running out. Second half of the trip we weren't cooking as much as we wanted in case we ran out and ruined the trip. I won't be carrying a massive refill station bottle on board, hence the thread

 

[lustyd]

907 lasts us 3 weeks, refills around €17. No problems with supply.

so for the 7 weeks mentioned, 3-4 would be right. Concerto paid £45 so compared to £20 for 4-5 weeks on a 4.5KG butane that's quite poor value. At €17 I'd be less unhappy, but not even in that ballpark on the south coast, and no availability anyway.

 

[Concerto]

I obviously cook too much. I don't get 7 weeks out of a 7kg bottle.

I cook every day and try to be economical with how I cook.

 

[lustyd]

Only 30 mins for a Fray Bentos ? I have to say we'd have eaten better had we not feared the end of our gas supply. A morning cup of tea can make the day, no tea and we're spiraling towards mutiny

 

[capnsensible]

During the 22 years we lived aboard, a 4.5kg bottle would last us between 4 to 6 months, depending on where we were cruising.

Prices do seem on the steep side in Blighty.

Must add if we were in marinas.....a lot of the time....we used an electric kettle.

 

[dgadee]

Local gas supplier filled my 4.5kg butane botle with propane. Calor suppliers couldn't supply.

 

[Stemar]

Local gas supplier filled my 4.5kg butane botle with propane.

Is that allowed? Or even safe?

IIRC, they run at different pressures to your stove.

 

[dgadee]

Is that allowed? Or even safe?

IIRC, they run at different pressures to your stove.

They can both be used on the stove. He filled industrial gas bottles too, so I presume he knew what he was doing. I am sure it is not "allowed" but neither is home filling.

 

[oldgit]

Trials and Tribulations ...............bin going on about this for years, pre covid, pre Puntin, pre everything.
My gas locker was designed for 2 x 4.5kilo butane bottles. Would require major grinder surgery to accomodate anything bigger .

Live and boat probably with the most bottled gas users neck of the woods in anywhere in UK . Probably more gas in deep space. ?

The North Kent coast has probably got more boats + mobile/static caravans per square metre than anywhere else in the UK.
Spent hours on the internet/telephone trying to locate somebody/anybody with full 4.5 litre bottle of butane.
This ranged from little local garages by main highways, local plant hire companies, big posh marinas (MDL) to Calor Gas county outlets.
Nothing on offer except the number of increasingly dubious excuses/explanations.
Gave up and bought a bottle of 907 camping gas from a big camping gas outfit, cost more per millilitre than Chanel No 9.
Change of Tactic.
Bought a secondhand small "Empty rusty as hell" propane bottle off Gumtree at one end of the county, managed to find a single full bottle of propane on the Isle of Sheppey at a small caravan shop and promptly drove the 60 mile round trip to collect it. Could not help but notice a good selection of FULL FloGas bottles in the compound.
Quick swap of regulator leaving old one in gas box, just in case and put the kettle on.
Kept up the search for somebody to swap my empty 4.5k butane bottles for full ones.

More "trails" and Tribulations.
My BBQ runs of a 15K bottle of Butane.
Surely these are not suffering the same fate.
On my fourth phone call managed to discover a single bottle at a local plant hire shop, the manager suggest I pop/ run round immediatly as it would probably be gone by the morning.
That bottle is now feeling bit empty
Do know on the grapevine that a certain outlet just outside Leysdown does have some 15K butane hidden away.
Have heard one or whispers of one or two other little crises in the UK , probably just rumours mind .

 

[Draystone]

What do you call a normal yacht? Before we sold up in March we had an induction hob , electric kettle, microwave, fridge and a freezer running of 400ah lithium battery bank with 750w solar on a 42 foot .
We was full-time living on board , admit we was in the Med so plenty of sun shine.
If all you want to do is cook for the weekend trip and the odd holiday you manage with less solar and 400ah batteries bank.
The weight and size of 400ah Lithium bank is not much more then what most got with 200ah LA bank .
Actually on the 36 footer we got now I have one 240ah battery and a smaller starter battery and they weigh more and take up much more room then the 400ah bank.
Come winter the LA batteries will come out and replace again with another 400ah bank , the only thing is my array of solar will only be 200w.
As we only going to be cruising throught out the summer only , with a bit of luck this will see us ok.

Is that at 12V or 24V?

 

[sailaboutvic]

Is that at 12V or 24V?

12v system very rarely we dropped under 13v .
The point I was making and badly was .
Is all you want to do is cook and use normally boat stuff , a small solar array say 200w 400 lithium battery bank and a bit of management even in northern Europe it can be done .
We could sits on cloudy days with very little charge from the panels without having to worry and we was using a heck of a lots , the fridge and the freezer on it's only where running 27 /7 .
Many boat admittedly bigger then the OP boat run everything off their batteries.
I fully understand that people don't want the expense for just a weekend boat.

 

[Draystone]

12v system very rarely we dropped under 13v .
The point I was making and badly was .
Is all you want to do is cook and use normally boat stuff , a small solar array say 200w 400 lithium battery bank and a bit of management even in northern Europe it can be done .
We could sits on cloudy days with very little charge from the panels without having to worry,
Many boat admittedly bigger then the OP boat run everything off their batteries.
I fully understand that people don't want the expense for just a weekend boat.

Thanks.
I wanted to confirm the amount of energy storage capacity you have.

Very interesting.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Thanks.
I wanted to confirm the amount of energy storage capacity you have.

Very interesting.

On the boat we on now we have a new 240ah LA house and a 110LA starter ,
We got the normal navigation stuff plus fridge a small inverter to charge iPads phone and every morning battery low and a job to get it back up to fully charge , this is mostly because LA don't except a charge like lithium .
Winter job , build a new lithium bank for this boat .
In the long run being 6months liveaboard from 12months liveaboard it will pay for it self , it also mean we can go back to cooking on a induction hob

 

[The Q]

Up here in Norfolk Calor has also been also been in short supply which when you consider how many caravan sites and broads boats there are it's stupid.. A lot of houses are heated by Calor as well.... They've lost a lot of bottle gas Customers to Flo Gas who have a depot near Potter Heigham..

I'm on LPG for heating the house, used to be Shell gas, who sold out to Avanti and American and use all the usual tricks to get you to pay more..