Fairline 43 Owners

[MapisM]

I,d be looking closer to home for a sporty car if I was you .
Try wondering about in Modena if that fails Sant Agata .
You make decent sports cars as well as boats :encouragement:

Don’t give Mrs Merkel more excuses to lend more €€€ , s to your Gov

This idea that Mutti is the lender of all Eurozone Countries is sick to say the least, don't get me started on that. :disgust:

Anyway, for decent sport cars, I can look even closer.
For instance, I would definitely fancy an SZ (aka "the monster").
Probably better than most bonds, as an investment - not to mention compared to boats....! :encouragement:

 

[Orthop]

Has it got teak side decks ?
Remember I’ve seen them fitted .

Are all the teak decks fitted in this way, what about the other brands? Does anybody know? In my case these holes (from the screws to fix the teak ) were the reason for the rain water entry in my the engine room...http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?529735-interesting-way-how-water-gets-into-the-boat

 

[kashurst]

Brixham south Devon

Best of luck getting the leak sorted, worst case blather the hull window joint with duck tape to keep the rain out over the winter, beautiful boat by the way.

 

[jfm]

Are all the teak decks fitted in this way, what about the other brands? Does anybody know? In my case these holes (from the screws to fix the teak ) were the reason for the rain water entry in my the engine room...http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?529735-interesting-way-how-water-gets-into-the-boat

No, absolutely not. Mine (solid teak not veneer) were glued on then vacuum bagged to press them down, with zero screw holes.

 

[jfm]

Reliable sources tell me the dealer tried to fix this but thought better to ask the factory so a factory team has been to the boat to fix it and have indeed fixed it. Boat is in SW uk. OP has disappeared from this thread but seems there is some storm in teacup-age here imho.

 

[MapisM]

(solid teak not veneer) were glued on then vacuum bagged to press them down, with zero screw holes.

Leaving aside screws, which I don't think any half decent yard use anymore, your pics made me curious about another thing.

As I understand, they glued on the deck several pre-made panels, not each single teak plank separately.
Therefore, I guess - but I'm asking because it's impossible to tell from your pics - that those panels were built with a marine plywood support underneath, to which the teak planks are pre-glued.
So, there is actually a plywood layer, in between the GRP deck and the teak planks.
Much better than using either teak plywood or screws of course, but not as good as the traditional installation with single teak planks imho, because over time moisture can attack and eventually rot the plywood "trapped" between the teak and the GRP.

Otoh, if my assumption wouldn't be correct, i.e. those panels are built with teak planks only and no plywood support, I'd be curious to hear how such large and heavy panels are held together before glueing them to the deck, because I can't imagine how solid teak planks with just some Sika 291 or TDS 440 sealant in between each of them can withstand transport, handling and fitting.

 

[jfm]

There’s no plywood. The planks are solid teak. On the back of the panel there is a super thin layer of Grp to hold the panel together. This is how Wattsons and others make decks these days. It’s a very good solution.

 

[wakeup]

The deck looks great JFM, but what strikes me is that the middle joints aren't staggered but very neatly aligned. Is that usual? Or are those joints sitting under fixed furniture.

 

[MapisM]

There’s no plywood. The planks are solid teak. On the back of the panel there is a super thin layer of Grp to hold the panel together. This is how Wattsons and others make decks these days. It’s a very good solution.

Yup, better than plywood as a substrate probably, but I wonder what happens when the teak planks are due for replacement.
I mean, according to Wattsons website, "a properly maintained teak deck should still be in a good condition after 10 years, however, due to the differing environmental conditions the craft can be subjected to around the world this can vary".
In non-mktg wording, I read that as ...life expectancy is 10 years, possibly more if you take care (whatever that means?), but could also be less.
Now, with solid teak only, and also with solid teak on plywood panels, removing all the wood and come back to the bare moulded deck is a proper PITA job (and you probably remember why I know!), but feasible.
Otoh, once the thin GRP layer is vacuum glued on the deck, I suppose it becomes practically impossible to strip it without damaging also the GRP underneath, unless there's anything I'm missing?

 

[MapisM]

The deck looks great JFM, but what strikes me is that the middle joints aren't staggered but very neatly aligned. Is that usual? Or are those joints sitting under fixed furniture.

My guess (which I'll happily swallow if jfm will not confirm) is that the seam along the joints between the panels was yet to be made when the pic was taken, but will be there in the finished job.
I can't imagine how they could pre-build also the seam which joins two panels, in fact.

 

[petem]

Yup, better than plywood as a substrate probably, but I wonder what happens when the teak planks are due for replacement.
I mean, according to Wattsons website, "a properly maintained teak deck should still be in a good condition after 10 years, however, due to the differing environmental conditions the craft can be subjected to around the world this can vary".
In non-mktg wording, I read that as ...life expectancy is 10 years, possibly more if you take care (whatever that means?), but could also be less.
Now, with solid teak only, and also with solid teak on plywood panels, removing all the wood and come back to the bare moulded deck is a proper PITA job (and you probably remember why I know!), but feasible.
Otoh, once the thin GRP layer is vacuum glued on the deck, I suppose it becomes practically impossible to strip it without damaging also the GRP underneath, unless there's anything I'm missing?

Remember that Wattsons also make the cheap mass market ply backed decks like I have (they supplied my replacement deck in 2017). It's these that I assume they are trying to manage expectations for. JFM's deck being solid teak should last much longer than 10 years I'd have thought. Even mine lasted 15 years in the damp UK.

 

[MapisM]

Mmm... maybe, but I believe that the temp excursion has also a lot to see with wear, and in the Med sun it's not unusual for teak to get hot to the point of not being able to stand barefoot on it.
And exposure to dampness of a boat deck is bound to be very high in a boat anywhere in the world, I reckon (if nothing else, at night time).

Anyhow, regardless of whether it can last 10 years or 15 (I very much doubt it can be more, unless you keep the boat sheltered for 11 months/year), my doubt remains the same.

 

[Portofino]

My guess (which I'll happily swallow if jfm will not confirm) is that the seam along the joints between the panels was yet to be made when the pic was taken, but will be there in the finished job.
I can't imagine how they could pre-build also the seam which joins two panels, in fact.

Wake up I take means the red line ......they ought to be staggered if I understood his post ?
You mean the thick yellow edged which obviously to me will be caulked in by hand , Infact by the vacuum cleaner you can see the groove .

picture hosting sites

The gold standard is individual pieces weighted down long enough with the surplus caulk cut off when set .Light sand .No backing and sufficiently thick enough or indeed wide enough.
But like gold it’s very expensive .
Also it nice to have a crown not a flat surface .
There may be a crown on that FB top if so it’s just looks flat .

1 saw a new Princess 56 ,s bathing platform after a PDI ( before the customer came ) replaced with the individual plank method.All in all two guys 2 weeks work with a 4 day drying gap .

The front deck on 75 Ft Itama are individual planked and curved near the bow to follow the lines .
Iirc €50 k option .Solid planks .
I asked in 2017 while stood on the top deck of a SL 140 about the teak and was told it all was individual planked , it was staggered too as per Wake up observation.

So what FL have done with JFM s is better than ply + thin veneer , but it’s not top draw there’s elements of production cost cutting .
I don’t know if there is a price threshold where ply + thin veneer goes to thin / medium planks on plastic backing, then ultimately to individual thicker planked teak .

Just to muddy the water I did notice a few family yards in Genoa like Portofino doing the gold standard thick individual planks on smaller boats say 30/50 ft ......but if you think about it the smaller you go the less time and materials and smaller surface area , to hand lay thick plank a 30 ft open boat .

And as said PeteM ....Watson’s do a lot of template teak , so interesting to find out which model , in other words how big some builders go shying away from hand laid thick individual planks .

 

[Portofino]

So here we have proper thick planks + shed loads of other skilled traditional wood work in teak .
So as said you don’t have to spend millions to get none templated teak .





Twin straight shaft and note the deep deadrise .....on the 38 all for £250 K + tax .

I bet no one in the U.K. has ever heard of the yard ?

 

[Orthop]

Reliable sources tell me the dealer tried to fix this but thought better to ask the factory so a factory team has been to the boat to fix it and have indeed fixed it. Boat is in SW uk. OP has disappeared from this thread but seems there is some storm in teacup-age here imho.

interesting would be what the problem was...

 

[MapisM]

I bet no one in the U.K. has ever heard of the yard ?

LOL, you like an easy win Porto, dontcha?
Outside the Naples area, I don't think there are more than a dozen of Italian boaters (if that!) who are aware of who Esposito is...

PS: as an aside, if we want to talk of "skilled traditional wood work", there's no place in the debate for frozen snot builders, regardless of how nicely they decorate their boats with teak.
It's when you build boats with no moulds at all, that boatbuilding skills must be in another league - though sadly, just a handful of these folks are still around.
And none of them work for big brands, obviously.

 

[jfm]

The deck looks great JFM, but what strikes me is that the middle joints aren't staggered but very neatly aligned. Is that usual? Or are those joints sitting under fixed furniture.

It's completely normal. Most s/yachts are specced with even not randon staggering. You can have random or different non random staggering if you want, but I wanted them as per the pic (I was focused on a theme of strong angular geometry throughout the boat). My deliberate choice. I assure you I examined the CAD files to the nth degree. If you want different you can have it; I got what I asked for .

 

[jfm]

Yup, better than plywood as a substrate probably, but I wonder what happens when the teak planks are due for replacement.
I mean, according to Wattsons website, "a properly maintained teak deck should still be in a good condition after 10 years, however, due to the differing environmental conditions the craft can be subjected to around the world this can vary".
In non-mktg wording, I read that as ...life expectancy is 10 years, possibly more if you take care (whatever that means?), but could also be less.
Now, with solid teak only, and also with solid teak on plywood panels, removing all the wood and come back to the bare moulded deck is a proper PITA job (and you probably remember why I know!), but feasible.
Otoh, once the thin GRP layer is vacuum glued on the deck, I suppose it becomes practically impossible to strip it without damaging also the GRP underneath, unless there's anything I'm missing?

First of all, they last way longer than 10 years.

Yes you are missing something. The grp layer is ultra thin. If you change the teak you can remove the GRP or leave it, depending on the depth you set your router to. It's a total non issue. You can, in say 12 years, change these decks for new and have a perfect job. The thickness of the .5mm grp layer is easily handled by the 1mm of polyurethane adhesive that your new deck will be attached with. There is just nothing to worry about

 

[jfm]

Answers inserted in blue below Porto

Wake up I take means the red line ......they ought to be staggered if I understood his post ? No they ought not. you can have staggered if you want on your nboat; I chose not staggered. Feel free to disagree with me, but its not an intrinsic criticism of my decks or fairline because I wanted it.


The gold standard is individual pieces weighted down long enough with the surplus caulk cut off when set .Light sand .No backing and sufficiently thick enough or indeed wide enough.
But like gold it’s very expensive . Agreed except for one thing: with the gold standard, the teak needs to be curved (and also notched into a king plank). As you're obsessed with itama, please note that itama do not do gold standard and never have. (Fairline don't either, though unlike itama 75 they do at least fit a king plank on foredeck)

Also it nice to have a crown not a flat surface .
There may be a crown on that FB top if so it’s just looks flat . You cant see in the pic. All my decks are crowned beautifully. I bet your itama 43 cockpit isn't crowned, though to be fair I guess it might be too small for crowning to be relevant.

The front deck on 75 Ft Itama are individual planked and curved near the bow to follow the lines .
Iirc €50 k option .Solid planks . The Itama decks are a disgrace. If I bought an itama 75 - totally awesome boat - I would never spec the hideous decks that itama fit. They are the cheapest ugliest waste of teak I can imafine. A proper deck - every decent super yacht ever built - has CURVED teak planks on the foredeck. Itama 75 has ugly straight planks. I know you love Itama, and so do I, but objectively the fore deck of itama 75 is a total cheapie sad disgrace and you should man up and admit it. If I order an itama 75 it will be built properly, not with the standard itama sh!tty specced decks. Porto, I know this is hard to grasp for you, but just because itama do something doesn't mean it is good.

I asked in 2017 while stood on the top deck of a SL 140 about the teak and was told it all was individual planked , Sure, that's easy if you fit straight ugly planks. But see the itama deck for what it its - an ugly PoS. it was staggered too as per Wake up observation. staggered if you want on my boat. I didn't want it so be sure that you're commenting on my taste not Fairline's build. I specced every detail of my boat - 500 line items of detailed nerdy non standard spec, including the teak detailing

So what FL have done with JFM s is better than ply + thin veneer , but it’s not top draw there’s elements of production cost cutting . Er, hang on: less cost cutting than itama 75 PoS fugly decks, but yes more cost cutting than Feadship.

I'm obviously expecting you to defend itama like a religion, teehee/yawn, while everyone else who cares about proper boat speccing looks at itama 75 teak and thinks no way I will ever own that PoS installation. Even though the itama 75 is otherwise an awesome boat and i totally love the base boat

 

[jfm]

My guess (which I'll happily swallow if jfm will not confirm) is that the seam along the joints between the panels was yet to be made when the pic was taken, but will be there in the finished job.
I can't imagine how they could pre-build also the seam which joins two panels, in fact.

Yes the caulk seams between adjacent panels were hand made in the boat build factory. Only way to do it. Using exactly the same caulk as used for the Watssons panels.