Epoxy under varnish

geem

geem

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I understand you can apply a base layer of epoxy using a clear hardener to teak. You then varnish over it and you get a good finish. Has anybody any experience of this and can advise how it stands up to abuse? Would it be a good solution for the companionway teak? Ours always gets damaged by bikes and stuff being lifted out and dinging it. Any thoughts based on experience of this process would be welcome
 
Epoxy can make an excellent primer for varnish.

However . . .

The wood must be very dry and completely stable. Epoxy is very hard but doesn't like to span joints (that aren't glued with epoxy) and doesn't like to finish at arbitrary 'edges', like where a companionway coaming meets the cabin top etc. I've only had real success where it's been the finishing regime of boats built by wood-epoxy techniques. In other words where all the wood has been dry and stable, the joints are all epoxied solid and every bit of wood is totally encapsulated on all sides with epoxy. The varnish is then used as the finishing UV barrier coat for the parts left as brightwork.

In addition, although it is hard, tough and wear resistant, it's not immune to knocks which can either break the surface or the bruising can result to the epoxy eventually becoming detached from the substrate. That then brings us on the the final disadvantage of epoxy - it's really hard to make good and repair. It's hard to rub down and get a feather edge without the softer wood becoming dished and then blending in the epoxy patches are hard.

So all in all, I can't think of a worse way to finish a conventionally built companionway subject to bicycle abuse.
 
The best solution for teak is Epifanes Woodfinish. Specially formulated for Teak and Iroko. Can be Gloss or Matt. After the first thinned coat it can be added without any sanding if within the specified period. Woodfinish is good to tackle UV, is very hard wearing and can be patched very easily.
 
Floor varnish as recommended for heavy domestic use or commercial use such as hall floors in schools, village halls etc. Really tough, does not chip, and reasonably non slip. I use Ronseal but their are other brands available.
 
geem said:
I understand you can apply a base layer of epoxy using a clear hardener to teak. You then varnish over it and you get a good finish. Has anybody any experience of this and can advise how it stands up to abuse? Would it be a good solution for the companionway teak? Ours always gets damaged by bikes and stuff being lifted out and dinging it. Any thoughts based on experience of this process would be welcome
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Attach some 3mm clear acrylic sheet to the vulnerable areas. You can then easily replace this when you need to.
 
Tranona said:
Floor varnish as recommended for heavy domestic use or commercial use such as hall floors in schools, village halls etc. Really tough, does not chip, and reasonably non slip. I use Ronseal but their are other brands available.
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I used two-pack varnish on floors in Edinburgh 25 years ago and they are still fine. However, I was told on here that the stuff degrades fast in UV and so is suitable for indoors use only. Is yours exposed to the weather?
 
JumbleDuck said:
I used two-pack varnish on floors in Edinburgh 25 years ago and they are still fine. However, I was told on here that the stuff degrades fast in UV and so is suitable for indoors use only. Is yours exposed to the weather?
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Not on the boat. Redid the teak and holly sole boards. Just done a nice piece of pitch pine as a threshold inside a 2.6m wide French window/doors in the bedroom. Lots of light there but too early to say if it will affect the finish.
 
JumbleDuck said:
I used two-pack varnish on floors in Edinburgh 25 years ago and they are still fine. However, I was told on here that the stuff degrades fast in UV and so is suitable for indoors use only. Is yours exposed to the weather?
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Two-pack polyurethane varnish lasts well but once it does get scratched/dinged damp gets underneath in patches and then you find out just how hard work it is to get the remaining adhered areas off to revarnish. At least ordinary oil-based yacht varnish comes off fast and clean with hot air (or a blowlamp) and scraper. As others have said if you do expect a lot of abrasion a modern sealer wood finish type product might be better.
 
JumbleDuck said:
I used two-pack varnish on floors in Edinburgh 25 years ago and they are still fine. However, I was told on here that the stuff degrades fast in UV and so is suitable for indoors use only. Is yours exposed to the weather?
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Two-pack varnish is great for UV exposure and on top of epoxy (which is poor in UV) makes for a hard wearing and durable coating. This is the combination i have on my wooden mast. The two-pack varnish was last done 7 years ago and still looks good despite being constantly rubbed by the gaff saddle when sailing.

Www.solocoastalsailing.co.uk
 
I would recommend Everbuild traditional yacht varnish. Its very durable as it doesent crack, unlike Epifanes , and let water get underneath the varnish. 3 coats gives a great finish. No need to thin the first coat either. Its about £20 for 2.5 litres.
I got mine from Sealants and Tools Direct. I have no link. Just a happy customer
 
Concerto said:
Personally I would recommend a traditional varnish that soaks into the wood, rather than a brittle varnish that sticks to the wood. I would recommend http://www.letonkinoisvarnish.uk/varMain.html. It is easy to apply, and if damaged, you can retouch a small area.
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+1 Le Tonkinois (or other similar tung oil based traditional varnishes).

When I've experimented with varnishing, I did two pieces with Epoxy undercoat. It worked fine on one piece, but turned a wrinkly mess on the other and being epoxy it was very hard to sand off again. Application is tricky and subject to several possibly failure conditions. If you do it, make sure the epoxy is totally hardened through before varnishing over it.

I just stuck to plain Le Tonkinois and found it pretty amazing. I've also dinged and chipped some parts of the teak around the companionway, but unlike modern varnishes, it doesn't chip, and the wood is still protected from water ingress due to the deeply penetrated oils. To fix it, I just key with some 600 grit and apply more coats over, no stripping required.
 
Yngmar said:
+1 Le Tonkinois (or other similar tung oil based traditional varnishes).

When I've experimented with varnishing, I did two pieces with Epoxy undercoat. It worked fine on one piece, but turned a wrinkly mess on the other and being epoxy it was very hard to sand off again. Application is tricky and subject to several possibly failure conditions. If you do it, make sure the epoxy is totally hardened through before varnishing over it.

I just stuck to plain Le Tonkinois and found it pretty amazing. I've also dinged and chipped some parts of the teak around the companionway, but unlike modern varnishes, it doesn't chip, and the wood is still protected from water ingress due to the deeply penetrated oils. To fix it, I just key with some 600 grit and apply more coats over, no stripping required.
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The companionway was varnished with Le Tonkinois previuosly. It hasnt stood up to the strong UV here in the Caribbean. With the occational knocks it gets it was looking decidedly shabby. We have run out of it anyway so having to go for a PU varnish with high UV resistance. Not sure how it will suvive knocks bu hopefully it will suvive UV.
Thanks for all the advise
 
I have used standard West epoxy resin for a coating on mahogany, and on a teak deck laid on recessed GRP deck.
It needed 3 coats (as thick as possible without sagging) each sanded down 2 days after each coat. After a week I protected it with 2 coats of Epifanes extra UV protect.
It worked well for me in both cases.
 
My teak table is "made" with epoxy. The boards were tongue and grooved and then epoxyed and the surface coated in epoxy and then International 2 pot for UV protect. The finish is very tough and I have not had any issues.
 
My pal did his external woodwork with West system epoxy overcoated with PU varnish. After 3yrs during which time the boat hasn't even been launched, it looks a mess. Water has got under the epoxy somehow and it needs completely stripping off in some areas which isn't going to be easy. I think Woodskin would be much better or just traditional varnish as repairs with either are much less effort.
Personally I just use Ronsons yacht varnish.
 
I had a lot of trouble with the varnished washboards on our old Sadler 29. There were three of them, and the contact surfaces always got scuffed and the varnish would peel away. Eventually, I got fed up and just bunged some Araldite glue on the lightly sanded bare wood and varnished over that. The result was no more peeling varnish and much less maintenance. I haven't tried it on a wider surface though.
 
ghostlymoron said:
My pal did his external woodwork with West system epoxy overcoated with PU varnish. After 3yrs during which time the boat hasn't even been launched, it looks a mess. Water has got under the epoxy somehow and it needs completely stripping off in some areas which isn't going to be easy. I think Woodskin would be much better or just traditional varnish as repairs with either are much less effort.
Personally I just use Ronsons yacht varnish.
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it goes without saying that if you are going to coat a piece of timber with epoxy, then it needs to be 100% sealed.
 
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