rustybarge
Active member
Present company excepted.......
I will play the devils advocate here: it's estate agents , bankers, second hand car sales men, insurance salesmen and boat brokers who are the scrapings of the barrel; not the customer.
Disillusioned with costly timewasters
- Thread starter jonic
- Start date
Present company excepted.......
I will play the devils advocate here: it's estate agents , bankers, second hand car sales men, insurance salesmen and boat brokers who are the scrapings of the barrel; not the customer.
Babylon
Well-known member
On the other hand... I recall, back in the 80s, taking my dad to view a one-bed flat I wished to buy as my first home. As we were leaving he explained to me that the vendor wasn't actually interested in selling - that he just liked people coming to admire his flat. I didn't know at the time how he knew, but the Old Man was spot on! The agent eventually told me that the guy rejected every offer he was made. Tw@t.
Babylon
Well-known member
Codswallop.
jonic
Well-known member
All right I'll play devils advocate too....
Present company excepted :encouragement: or not, to call boat brokers scrapings of the barrel is pretty unfair for you in particular at the moment, especially considering the amount of sound advice that has been freely given to you by a number of brokers on the liveaboard forum over the last few days in your quest to purchase a boat in Florida.
Should they perhaps send you an invoice now they know what you really think of them?
You have had free visa advice, tax advice, registration advice and free boat advice from those scrapings of the barrel.
Sounds like you just want a lot of free knowledge and stuff to me - get back in the barrel!
:encouragement:
rogerball0
N/A
'kin prat!
rotrax
Well-known member
Well rustybarge-that told you!
On the contrary to the OP, First Mate and I turned up at a well known upper Hamble Brokers, 40k in our pockets.
We had arranged to see a Dehler 36.
We were on time to the minute, were liquid and were looking to buy.
The Broker-a well known personality-threw me the keys and said " Third one along the elevated walkway. I have to go-I have a real prospect elsewhere-just put the keys on my desk when you are finished. "
I would never have purchased that boat through him, even if it had not been a totally worn out hard raced example.
First Mate and I treated spotty teenagers with 500 quid in their pockets who wanted a mo-ped better than that. Everyone was a potential purchaser, and common courtesy and politeness cost nothing.
I spoke with Jonic about possibly selling our current boat a while ago.
He took the trouble to get back to me as soon as he could, and gave good advice.
When I told First Mate she went ballistic....................................
Women-who understands 'em eh?
On the contrary to the OP, First Mate and I turned up at a well known upper Hamble Brokers, 40k in our pockets.
We had arranged to see a Dehler 36.
We were on time to the minute, were liquid and were looking to buy.
The Broker-a well known personality-threw me the keys and said " Third one along the elevated walkway. I have to go-I have a real prospect elsewhere-just put the keys on my desk when you are finished. "
I would never have purchased that boat through him, even if it had not been a totally worn out hard raced example.
First Mate and I treated spotty teenagers with 500 quid in their pockets who wanted a mo-ped better than that. Everyone was a potential purchaser, and common courtesy and politeness cost nothing.
I spoke with Jonic about possibly selling our current boat a while ago.
He took the trouble to get back to me as soon as he could, and gave good advice.
When I told First Mate she went ballistic....................................
Women-who understands 'em eh?
chinita
Well-known member
All right I'll play devils advocate too....
Present company excepted :encouragement: or not, to call boat brokers scrapings of the barrel is pretty unfair for you in particular at the moment, especially considering the amount of sound advice that has been freely given to you by a number of brokers on the liveaboard forum over the last few days in your quest to purchase a boat in Florida.
Should they perhaps send you an invoice now they know what you really think of them?
You have had free visa advice, tax advice, registration advice and free boat advice from those scrapings of the barrel.
Sounds like you just want a lot of free knowledge and stuff to me - get back in the barrel!
...and a massive plus one.
This joker has been touting all sorts of bizarre ideas over the past couple of years.
He is an unmitigated wnaker.
rustybarge
Active member
Chav alert.....!
rustybarge
Active member
You are related to a prat, or are you one yourself?
AndrewB
Well-known member
Jonic, you have to see it from the customer's point of view too. You'd think that in a real buyer's market the buyer would be king, able to swan around, demand huge discounts and make outrageous conditions.
Unfortunately it doesn't turn out like this. The market is down because buyers are squeezed as well. We can afford to spend less*. This simply doesn't register with a great many would-be sellers, who want to set their asking price close to where it might have been a few years back. This puts brokers in the difficult position of trying to attract buyers to look at boats with unrealistic price tags, and I'm afraid that in some cases the result has been to over-hype what they are selling.
Of course, its not usually the broker but the buyer who travels long distances to view a yacht. A year ago I drove 200 miles to Plymouth to view two yachts that proved hopeless. The first, the seller was present who made quite clear that despite the run-down condition of the yacht he wasn't interested in any kind of offer. The second was so bad I'm afraid I walked off after a couple of minutes. The broker then accused me of being a time-waster. But really, he'd only lost an hour of his life while I'd lost a day, plus all the petrol.
I was as good as accused of being a time-waster twice more during a disheartening buying experience. But please don't think I am bad-mouthing brokers in general. They are caught in the middle of a difficult situation.
*To be honest, I don't think the present bad market is entirely a result of the economic situation. The baby-boomer generation who were so attracted to sailing, particularly cruising, is now working through and there are not so many who have the same dream to replace them. This is a reason why the present depressed second-hand market will persist until, eventually, the older yachts disappear and the market becomes smaller. And it also added, for a buyer like me, another incentive not to over-commit on a yacht.
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rustybarge
Active member
All right I'll play devils advocate too....
Present company excepted :encouragement: or not, to call boat brokers scrapings of the barrel is pretty unfair for you in particular at the moment, especially considering the amount of sound advice that has been freely given to you by a number of brokers on the liveaboard forum over the last few days in your quest to purchase a boat in Florida.
Should they perhaps send you an invoice now they know what you really think of them?
You have had free visa advice, tax advice, registration advice and free boat advice from those scrapings of the barrel.
Sounds like you just want a lot of free knowledge and stuff to me - get back in the barrel!
Just to keep the record straight, I did all the research on the internet which I actually quoted on that particular post.
Of course I thanked the contributors for all their help, after I had plainly displayed all the info; Although you are quite right that a retired boat broker [30 years retired] did give me lots of advise.
But hey, if we had to pay for advise on the forum, it would be a very quiet place indeed.
obmij
Active member
I'm the kind of guy who hates being hit in the face but likes ice cream. Always have been and always will be. In your position, I too would hate costly time-wasters but like easy sales.
But wait! Dealing with costly time-wasters is part of your job, as it is for everyone else with a product to sell or service to offer. If it was easy money then every charlie would do it and before long you'd be reducing your margins and locked in a race to the bottom.
How to mitigate against the costly time-waster is a problem we all face. My solution is to do business only in my immediate area. Anything outside of a 30 minute drive I don't bother with as the time wasting then becomes too costly.
But wait! Dealing with costly time-wasters is part of your job, as it is for everyone else with a product to sell or service to offer. If it was easy money then every charlie would do it and before long you'd be reducing your margins and locked in a race to the bottom.
How to mitigate against the costly time-waster is a problem we all face. My solution is to do business only in my immediate area. Anything outside of a 30 minute drive I don't bother with as the time wasting then becomes too costly.
jonic
Well-known member
Indeed but dealing with liars who were never going to buy something and knowingly put several groups of people out is not part of anyone's job.
A job is something you generally get paid for.
Not something you have to pay to do.
I don't mind travel at all.
In fact I enjoy it and I love long distance cruisers and the people who sail them.
But I hate liars who take advantage of the good nature of the good natured cruising yacht owner and their families.
Open letter - don't come and see any of my listings if you know you are wasting the owners time.
However if you have a genuine interest in following the dream you will be welcomed with open arms, given five star treatment and all the free advice you could want
A job is something you generally get paid for.
Not something you have to pay to do.
I don't mind travel at all.
In fact I enjoy it and I love long distance cruisers and the people who sail them.
But I hate liars who take advantage of the good nature of the good natured cruising yacht owner and their families.
Open letter - don't come and see any of my listings if you know you are wasting the owners time.
However if you have a genuine interest in following the dream you will be welcomed with open arms, given five star treatment and all the free advice you could want
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jonic
Well-known member
ahem...
And a very not retired broker even gave you pictures and videos :encouragement: tips on stay times, places to moor and the all important Skipper Bob tip.
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?393378-Buying-livaboard-in-Florida&p=4709059#post4709059
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?393378-Buying-livaboard-in-Florida&p=4709211#post4709211
Uricanejack
Well-known member
Once upon a time. When down on my luck. Between jobs. The only job I could find was selling encyclopedia. You get used to getting told to go forth and multiply. I wasted time. I had my time wasted. I. Real wasn't very good at it my heart wasn't in it. Odd thing was while I was crappy salesman . I was the top guy at trade shows.
I wasn't,the very skilled a qualifieing the prospect. I had the worst spot but I just pitched every one who would talk to me. All kinds the pros blew off.
Just the numbers worked I pitched lots of poor prospects who turned out to be Byers.
Not the same as big ticket items like cars bots or houses. A lot of the guys I worked with were life time salesmen who had sold all sorts including big tickets especially used cars. It was a good life experience but I hated it.
Sales is a tough life. You have to have a thick skin and get used to rejection. Most people are time wasters. But you need to speak to lots of them to get to the prize.
When looking for a house I went to lots. Often was shown by agent houses above my budget. I bought above my budget.
I spent two years looking at bare lots with an agent before I bought one. I then had to sell in a hurry with the same agent. We had lots just looking.
I have never gone to a car lot intending to by a car. Most I walked away from. Some I left with a car.
I have bought 4 boats. 2 from people I knew on a hand shake
2 from a broker.
I looked at lots. Most probably thought I was a time waster. I often tried not to sound to ready. Just looking trying to figure out what I want. Most just gave me the keys.
Most were helpful. When they weren't I did not go back.
I liked a couple of boats my wife didn't,
I bought a bigger boat than I was looking for above my planned budget. Probably. Not in jonics league. At this time.
Put it down to part of life. Have a nice drink. If it's a nice boat at the right price. A Byer will come along. If you are increadbly lucky it will be the next prospect. More likely it will take a bunch. Some of those prospects might not by this boat but they might eventually. By another.
I wasn't,the very skilled a qualifieing the prospect. I had the worst spot but I just pitched every one who would talk to me. All kinds the pros blew off.
Just the numbers worked I pitched lots of poor prospects who turned out to be Byers.
Not the same as big ticket items like cars bots or houses. A lot of the guys I worked with were life time salesmen who had sold all sorts including big tickets especially used cars. It was a good life experience but I hated it.
Sales is a tough life. You have to have a thick skin and get used to rejection. Most people are time wasters. But you need to speak to lots of them to get to the prize.
When looking for a house I went to lots. Often was shown by agent houses above my budget. I bought above my budget.
I spent two years looking at bare lots with an agent before I bought one. I then had to sell in a hurry with the same agent. We had lots just looking.
I have never gone to a car lot intending to by a car. Most I walked away from. Some I left with a car.
I have bought 4 boats. 2 from people I knew on a hand shake
2 from a broker.
I looked at lots. Most probably thought I was a time waster. I often tried not to sound to ready. Just looking trying to figure out what I want. Most just gave me the keys.
Most were helpful. When they weren't I did not go back.
I liked a couple of boats my wife didn't,
I bought a bigger boat than I was looking for above my planned budget. Probably. Not in jonics league. At this time.
Put it down to part of life. Have a nice drink. If it's a nice boat at the right price. A Byer will come along. If you are increadbly lucky it will be the next prospect. More likely it will take a bunch. Some of those prospects might not by this boat but they might eventually. By another.
jonic
Well-known member
uricanejack
I have been in sales for 27 years 10 of which are in yacht sales and have met more timewasters than you can imagine and have a thicker skin than a rhino.
Just looking is fine.
But what I can't tolerate is someone who knows he is seriously upsetting a families holiday plans, has been well briefed on the situation but lies his *rse off to get what he wants because he is on holiday in the area and can't be *rsed to come at a more suitable time because he was not and is not ever going to buy the yacht because he doesn't even have the money.
I have been in sales for 27 years 10 of which are in yacht sales and have met more timewasters than you can imagine and have a thicker skin than a rhino.
Just looking is fine.
But what I can't tolerate is someone who knows he is seriously upsetting a families holiday plans, has been well briefed on the situation but lies his *rse off to get what he wants because he is on holiday in the area and can't be *rsed to come at a more suitable time because he was not and is not ever going to buy the yacht because he doesn't even have the money.
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Rowana
Two steps lower than the ships' cat
I'd be highly tempted to create and send them details of a wonderful mega-yacht at a bargain price, somewhere around Aberdeen !
There's a few yachts for sale in Peterhead! Not mega-yachts I'm afraid, but for sale none the less.
.
rustybarge
Active member
ahem...
And a very not retired broker even gave you pictures and videos :encouragement: tips on stay times, places to moor and the all important Skipper Bob tip.
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?393378-Buying-livaboard-in-Florida&p=4709059#post4709059
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?393378-Buying-livaboard-in-Florida&p=4709211#post4709211
Apologies for my oversight.
...and your advise was much appreciated.
jonic
Well-known member
Apologies for my oversight.
...and your advise was much appreciated.
You're welcome :encouragement:
SimbaDog
Active member
Daughter is an estate agent, be very afraid :nonchalance: