CQR anchors.

[GHA]

I don't think anyone is claiming that the genuine CQR is the epitome of anchors, just that they are perfectly good enough for the circumstances in which most of us yachtsmen are likely to find ourselves.

Most of you yachtsmen aren't cruisers then

 

[PetiteFleur]

My first boat a Vivacity 20 had a genuine CQR - anchored of Burnham one year, blew up to F6 overnight and I couldn't lift it in the morning, had to wait for the tide to rise and when the stem was almost underwater and me bouncing on the stern it eventually released. Can't remember what I had on the Halcyon 23, probably another CQR. Next boat a Jaguar 27 had a look-a-like cqr which worked. Current boat had a copy CQR which was useless, regularly used the Fortress 23 which worked well, then bought a Manson Supreme and it's excellent - always sets well first time.

 

[Mark-1]

So where does the panel stand of Fortress (NGA) V Danforth (OGA)? They're identical in terms of design, but the Danforth is way heavier due to the chosen material. A case of an NGA that *must* be worse performing than the OGA. (Although I lust after a fortress because I value my spine more than I value my boat...)

Since we're admitting to our own priors I have a battered Danforth copy which holds brilliantly (but is a nightmare to handle) and a 2kg Bruce copy "lunch hook" which is a doddle to handle and usually holds ok. I find if I don't plan to sleep I value ease of handling *way* above holding power so the Danforth copy is overnight only and the mini-fake-Bruce splashes over the side all the time.

I find it quite amusing that many of the people down wind and tide of me have spent £££££s on posh anchors. So I can be solidly placed in the "good enough is good enough" school of anchoring. Apropos of nothing:

 

[jordanbasset]

Talking about cheap and expensive anchors, the Kobra 2 I bought was about half the price of a genuine CQR

 

[GHA]

Right on cue ,,,

 

[Boathook]

In Newton Creek, that's just about enough for a Snappie. What do the big boys use?

I use a 15kg rocna at Newtown that works fine for me. I was happy with my danforth until I bent the shank ......
There was a thread about it a few years ago as well.

 

[JumbleDuck]

I don't think many people are claiming that a CQR won't hold a boat most of the time, but it takes a special sort of stubbornness to ignore the clear improvements that have been made over several decades. Modern anchors are clearly better than a CQR from any objective use.

I am sure you're right, but my CQR is good enough for my purposes, and that's really all I care about. Similarly, my scruffy old Berlingo is good enough for my driving purposes; sure a nice new car would be better in almost every way, but when you're starting from "good enough", "better" isn't necessary.

Would I buy a new CQR? Certainly not. There are far better things for the money. Would I throw away the CQR I have and buy a new anchor? Certainly not. I have better things to do with the money.

 

[JumbleDuck]

There is no mileage in over analyzing the metaphor. The facts are well established. The CQR is surpassed in every way by NGA.

Testing the CQR today is pointless beyond whimsical interest. Justifying the CQR is simply an acceptance of an inadequate design.

Every week I drive - twice - past a house with an old Enterprise (or maybe it's a Wayfarer) on a trailer in the front drive. Modern dinghies are better in every conceivable way (whichever one it is) and yet the owner clings to the past. Presumably it's good enough ...

For sone sailors the type of sailing they do and the security in anchoring that they need, a CQR will be satisfactory. For others it will not be. If there was not a need for improved anchors, NGA’s would not have been developed.

Almost right. It's not the need that generates new products, it's the demand, and that is only loosely connected to need. Let's face it, the entire leisure marine industry, almost, survives by selling people things they don't need.

 

[Poignard]

[...]. Let's face it, the entire leisure marine industry, almost, survives by selling people things they don't need.

A lot of it based on fear.

Fear of not being able to find your way around, fear of drowning, fear of your anchor dragging, fear of being cold, fear of not being clean, fear of being behind the times, fear of not looking smart in the marina bistro ...........

 

[Mark-1]

Every week I drive - twice - past a house with an old Enterprise (or maybe it's a Wayfarer) on a trailer in the front drive. Modern dinghies are better in every conceivable way (whichever one it is) and yet the owner clings to the past. Presumably it's good enough ...

That's a pretty good point. I'd be amazed if *anything* I own is the absolute best. My Anchors work well and wouldn't even make the top 1000 things I'd replace out of the endless list of 'not the best' stuff I own. (The wife's 10 years older than when I met her... ?)

I suspect anchor design has improved less over the last 60 years than almost anything else in sailing. Clothing, sails, electronics are in a different league. A 60yo anchor design on a boat wouldn't even warrant a mention.

 

[zoidberg]

I've sailed carbon layup boats just months out of the mould. I've sailed wooden boats, and lived in houses, 100 years old. My current boat is quite a lot younger than me, and my anchors much younger.

I'd like to think I've improved with age.

Could I possibly be right?

 

[zoidberg]

A lot of it based on fear.

Fear is nature's way of getting your attention. It's what happens next that matters.....

 

[Kukri]

I have a CQR. I’ve had CQRs for a very long time. Seriously:

- be really sure it is a genuine one

- keep an eye on wear on the pin. This happens faster if the anchor is stowed on the roller and allowed to flop from side to side. I take a light line from the fluke to the bulwark and belay it.

I plan to add a second anchor and windlass. But I will keep the CQR.

 

[Laminar Flow]

My test of a good anchor is will it hold in the anchorage at Dartmouth? Where I have seen many boats drag and drag on the turn of the tide. The CQR let me down many times. The Manson supreme has not dragged yet.

In this case the Kobra met the stipulated benchmark during our three day stay at Dartmouth last summer.

Almost right. It's not the need that generates new products, it's the demand, and that is only loosely connected to need. Let's face it, the entire leisure marine industry, almost, survives by selling people things they don't need.

I think that depends on how you define need and I am definitely not in the habit of buying things I do not need; unless you add boats in general to that equation.
I do, however, need my boat to stay in place when I drop the hook; it is after all the whole point of the exercise.
With some 60,000 miles to date, I do feel I've given the OGAs, and the CQR in particular, a fair shake, but my old back certainly doesn't need the continuing aggravation of hauling up and resetting the silly thing three times (in some cases) just to make it stick.

 

[NormanS]

In this case the Kobra met the stipulated benchmark during our three day stay at Dartmouth last summer.


I think that depends on how you define need and I am definitely not in the habit of buying things I do not need; unless you add boats in general to that equation.
I do, however, need my boat to stay in place when I drop the hook; it is after all the whole point of the exercise.
With some 60,000 miles to date, I do feel I've given the OGAs, and the CQR in particular, a fair shake, but my old back certainly doesn't need the continuing aggravation of hauling up and resetting the silly thing three times (in some cases) just to make it stick.

I would suggest that if you're having to do that more than very occasionally, you need to have a serious look at both your technique, and your choices of anchoring ground. It may be that the CQR doesn't suit the particular places where you sail, but generations of people have used genuine CQRs without issue. I used one for 30 years, for a total of about 3,000 nights at anchor.

 

[dom]

I suspect anchor design has improved less over the last 60 years than almost anything else in sailing. Clothing, sails, electronics are in a different league. A 60yo anchor design on a boat wouldn't even warrant a mention.

What?? You are forgetting the most important thing in sailing.....

New boat design which according to the MAB mob............ ?

 

[JumbleDuck]

With some 60,000 miles to date, I do feel I've given the OGAs, and the CQR in particular, a fair shake, but my old back certainly doesn't need the continuing aggravation of hauling up and resetting the silly thing three times (in some cases) just to make it stick.

As a matter of interest, did you buy a modern anchor half the weight of your CQR to get the same holding power and much faster setting from an anchor that's easier to handle?

 

[JumbleDuck]

I would suggest that if you're having to do that more than very occasionally, you need to have a serious look at both your technique, and your choices of anchoring ground. It may be that the CQR doesn't suit the particular places where you sail, but generations of people have used genuine CQRs without issue. I used one for 30 years, for a total of about 3,000 nights at anchor.

I have a very rough impression from this thread that most people who have problems with CQRs have them in the Solent and other busy areas of the south while most of us who find they work fine do so in less frequented anchorages. Could it be that they really don't like seabeds churned up by constant anchoring but are fine in more virgin territory?

 

[Poignard]

What?? You are forgetting the most important thing in sailing.....

New boat design which according to the MAB mob............ ?

.

The school of: "If it looks right, it is right"?

It seems hard to believe but what are nowadays regarded as outdated hull designs were, in their day, regarded as unacceptable to the "cod's head and mackerel tail" aficionados of the Victorian and Edwardian eras, who trusted only designs based on working boats.

What we now call "long-keelers" were not then.

A true long-keeler would have had a straight keel extending from a point not far aft of the stemhead to the rudder post.



I seem to remember Eric Hiscock, in one of his books, expressing mild concern about the lack of forefoot in yachts like mine.

 

[Poignard]

I have a very rough impression from this thread that most people who have problems with CQRs have them in the Solent and other busy areas of the south while most of us who find they work fine do so in less frequented anchorages. Could it be that they really don't like seabeds churned up by constant anchoring but are fine in more virgin territory?

That's an interesting theory.