CQR anchors.

[GHA]

That's an interesting theory.

Maybe something in it. Churned up anchorages have long been though of as making an anchor's life more difficult, if you have a hook that isn't very good in the first place then that's just making things worse. Getting a decent hook is a way out if you spend much time anchored.

 

[JumbleDuck]

That's an interesting theory.

Thanks. The only place I have had problems with plough anchors - twice; one CQR copy, one CQR - is Ardinamir. Both times there was a fluctuating SW wind and a strong NW-SE tide, resulting in the anchor slowly walking back as it set to the wind, reset to the tide, reset to the wind, reset to the tide and so on. It's also, by West Coast standards, a very popular anchorage and probably the second busiest after Puilladobhran, so perhaps the bottom is just too loose for effective CQRing.

 

[zoidberg]

'On the one hand; on the other hand....'

The one time I cursed my CQR was the time I needed it most. We'd been traipsing around the Inner Isles, including the well-known kelp bed off the wee kirk at Canna and the shifting sands at the head of Loch Scresort/Rum. It had been gey hot, and we headed east into Loch Nevis and Inverie..... for I had need of a beer or three at The Old Forge, the most remote pub on the mainland.

For some reason we sought to drop the hook right in front of the pub - there were rustbucket workboats over to the left as I recall - and I went well in. The damn thing wouldn't hold! Four times I lifted and laid, sweating and swearing. It was well past 9:00pm now, the sun was slipping fast towards the horizon and so were my hopes of a cool, refreshing 'swalley'. My prayers were just not being answered, so I think I made a pact with the devil, for on the fifth attempt the blerry thing stuck.

Not enough for a night stop, not enough to cope with 'full astern' - but enough for us to pile into the waiting dinghy and race shorewards.

Yes, we got a pint in, each. "Just the one, Mrs Wembley!" for they were closing early and heading off on some fish-cage boats for a ceilidh somewhere.

Forlorn, we had a very early night.....

 

[Mark-1]

Could it be that they really don't like seabeds churned up by constant anchoring but are fine in more virgin territory?

I don't really buy that because vast numbers of boats in busy areas are still using CQRs/OGAs and they seem to be manage fine anchored en masse alongside boats with much more modern designs.

 

[GHA]

I don't really buy that because vast numbers of boats in busy areas are still using CQRs/OGAs and they seem to be manage fine anchored en masse alongside boats with much more modern designs.

Don't round the busier areas don't vast numbers of boats in busy areas run away from the anchorages to marinas should the wind get above a gentle breeze....
But not the cruisers who generally have no choice but also generally go for a decent sized new gen...cos they know better

 

[grandpaboat]

Into the third season with my Rocna I can only sing it's praises. Yes it was a considerable investment and only justified after bouncing my CQR over rocks and bending it. On the occasions that my genuine CQR dragged it would be in thick weed. Notable times being Canna harbour and Badcall bay where we awoke one morning alongside a work boat on a mooring.
On weighing the Rocna this summer after a night if 50 knot gusts in Loch Pooltiel it was almost completely choked in weed, however I hadn't dragged at all.

 

[Poignard]

Don't round the busier areas don't vast numbers of boats in busy areas run away from the anchorages to marinas should the wind get above a gentle breeze....
But not the cruisers who generally have no choice but also generally go for a decent sized new gen...cos they know better

I think I am fast approaching an age where I am more likely to run from a marina which is full to an anchorage!

Not always though, there are no marinas in Hoedic or Houat (fancy thouat!) for example. Or the delightful islands and bays on the Brittany coast, wherein we hume do dwell. Being at anchor in a beautiful setting (get it?) gives great pleasure.

 

[Zagato]

So where does the panel stand of Fortress (NGA) V Danforth (OGA)? They're identical in terms of design, but the Danforth is way heavier due to the chosen material. A case of an NGA that *must* be worse performing than the OGA. (Although I lust after a fortress because I value my spine more than I value my boat...)

Since we're admitting to our own priors I have a battered Danforth copy which holds brilliantly (but is a nightmare to handle) and a 2kg Bruce copy "lunch hook" which is a doddle to handle and usually holds ok. I find if I don't plan to sleep I value ease of handling *way* above holding power so the Danforth copy is overnight only and the mini-fake-Bruce splashes over the side all the time.

I find it quite amusing that many of the people down wind and tide of me have spent £££££s on posh anchors. So I can be solidly placed in the "good enough is good enough" school of anchoring. Apropos of nothing:

I have a 7kg and 10KG Danforth, both replicas and the former used many times and apart from the 7kg not setting due to a stone being jammed between the flukes and another time I think just did not set due to seaweed, it has been very reliable despite one chart saying they are at the lower scale of setting reliability but have good holding. I bought an FX7 Fortress with 6mm chain as recommended off a mate and tried it twice, once in Newton Creek the other at Pilsey island both times with a decent current flowing. It would not set presumably because it was sailing in the water. The warden at Newton Creek said I needed a heavier chain which I though defeated the object of a light anchor, my chain spec was suggested by Fortress themselves and I only had a little Drascombe. My mate tried adjusting it and testing it but he could not get it to set on numerous occasions so sold it to me. After I bought it I rember him moaning about it at rallies!!

I would like an anchor with one point to give it more chance perhaps to dig in amongst sea weed. I find the Danforth very tricky to handle, it will bite me one day so would like a Rocna. It will set better by all accounts on first deployment and is easier to handle. I am keeping the 7kg Danforth as a kedge as it does different sea beds to the Rocna apparently.

I have two CQR's one a 25ib with it,s sales sticker still on it... never had a problem with them, I would like to sell to make space but have no idea what it is worth so cannot advertise it on here! Edit £25. Also

A 10KG Danforth

A genuine 5KG Bruce anchor

A Fishermans about 10KG never been used

A 8KG grapple anchor

Oh and a Fortress FX7, really good anchor, sets every time, it's as honest as the day is long guvner, bargain at.... all now in For Sale section.

 

[Kukri]

An heretical thought: if I ever go long term cruising I will certainly buy a serious new generation anchor. Along with a lot of other stuff! Meanwhile, cruising in home waters, the CQR is absolutely fine.

 

[Mark-1]

Don't round the busier areas don't vast numbers of boats in busy areas run away from the anchorages to marinas should the wind get above a gentle breeze....
But not the cruisers who generally have no choice but also generally go for a decent sized new gen...cos they know better

IME the busy anchorages are busier than quiet anchorages regardless of weather.

I spent a midwinter night at East Head in a gale once. I wasn't alone.

 

[GHA]

IME the busy anchorages are busier than quiet anchorages regardless of weather.

I spent a midwinter night at East Head in a gale once. I wasn't alone.

Sorry, don't believe you. The sort of weather that starts making anchors actually having to be good would have load of AWB's running for cover.
Irrelevant argument anyway, there isn't any significant doubt in the real world that new gens are way better than cqr's .

 

[Stemar]

The only head I want to be in during a midwinter gale is the King's Head.

 

[Mark-1]

The only head I want to be in during a midwinter gale is the King's Head.

I've done a lot of charter holidays to the West coast of Scotland in early spring so my perception of weather has been a bit (re)calibrated by that. ?

 

[sailaboutvic]

An heretical thought: if I ever go long term cruising I will certainly buy a serious new generation anchor. Along with a lot of other stuff! Meanwhile, cruising in home waters, the CQR is absolutely fine.

See guys I think this posting say quite a bit and I couldn't agree more .
Go back 35 years and my home waters was the muddy rivers and seas round Suffolk and Essex , anchoring most Friday till Sunday at worst F4 before any more and we heading for the local mooring buoy or marina ,
Me any my CQR where have a great love affair.
One years on and it was doing a great job stopping a bar door from dragging on the North coast of Spain.
If your CQR and your home ground suite each other , why on earth spend money on a NG anchor .
But don't expect to move around and get the same result .

 

[Laminar Flow]

As a matter of interest, did you buy a modern anchor half the weight of your CQR to get the same holding power and much faster setting from an anchor that's easier to handle?

A bit lighter, actually, but a size up from the one recommended for our length as we displace considerably more than a contemporary design. It was the aggressive setting of the new types that I found most attractive. Once set, my old CQRs would hold, mostly, but the relatively elaborate ritual to convince them to earn their living was getting a bit tiring.
I remember Hichcock suggesting that the CQR was less effective in the smaller sizes which would indicate that more weight, and at the tip where it counts, would be beneficial.

I have a very rough impression from this thread that most people who have problems with CQRs have them in the Solent and other busy areas of the south while most of us who find they work fine do so in less frequented anchorages. Could it be that they really don't like seabeds churned up by constant anchoring but are fine in more virgin territory?

Interesting, but I'm not sure the "prima noce" aspect holds water. Perhaps some of the more popular spots simply have poor holding, while exhibiting, above water, a geographical aspect that, treacherously , would suggest some degree of shelter.

 

[Poignard]

[...]I remember Hichcock suggesting that the CQR was less effective in the smaller sizes which would indicate that more weight, and at the tip where it counts, would be beneficial. [...]

'
Yes, he recommended a minimum weight of 35lb for a yacht of his size (then 30' LOA) so that the tip of the anchor would penetrate weed.

 

[Poignard]

An heretical thought: if I ever go long term cruising I will certainly buy a serious new generation anchor. Along with a lot of other stuff! Meanwhile, cruising in home waters, the CQR is absolutely fine.

'
Yes, good enough does not mean no good.

 

[Kukri]

'
Yes, he recommended a minimum weight of 35lb for a yacht of his size (then 30' LOA) so that the tip of the anchor would penetrate weed.

And circumnavigated twice in that boat with a pair of them. Tilman used a 75lbs CQR on his pilot cutters.

 

[Poignard]

And circumnavigated twice in that boat with a pair of them. Tilman used a 75lbs CQR on his pilot cutters.

'

Tut, tut! Bloody amateurs in manky old boats.

Good job there was no YBW Forum then, or they'd have had a roasting for their foolhardiness.

 

[Laminar Flow]

I would suggest that if you're having to do that more than very occasionally, you need to have a serious look at both your technique, and your choices of anchoring ground. It may be that the CQR doesn't suit the particular places where you sail, but generations of people have used genuine CQRs without issue. I used one for 30 years, for a total of about 3,000 nights at anchor.

Perhaps I am overly learning-resistant. However, much anchoring, and in many different places, weather and climes, has taught me an a abundant degree of weariness when it comes to trusting an anchor to keep my boat in place. This, unfortunately, interferes with my interest of visiting and exploring the shores of such places as I visit.
Every penny spent (and in the case of the Kobra, a relatively few) that gives me an edge to do so, and with a greater degree of insouciance, is well spent.