Considering a Cat

[SiteSurfer]

Hi all (again).. due to my daughters appalling sea sickness which she is convinced is caused by the rolling movement - I am considering an older catamaran.

I'm not convinced I like the idea but the wife is absolutely agog with the idea that they don't heel, have lots of space and appear much more stable than our (very slow and stable) triple keeler. My youngest daughter (who's the only member of the crew who has helming aptitude) at 12 yrs old is also very very keen on the idea.

I'm somewhat nonplussed about the idea - mainly the mooring, berthing and general size of the things - when considering the cost of space in UK Marinas.

Do they really work in the UK (and especially the Solent) as I can't claim to have seen too many of them on our (albeit short) travels, I welcome anecdotes - ideas and wisdom from the forum. I don't recall seeing a single one visiting any Marina (apart from the ones berthed long term there).

Is the cost worth the stability? I'm looking at the cheaper end of the market (around 20K tops).

 

[fergie_mac66]

Depends on the conditions.Wind ,tide waves

The wind blew up to a 7 in the following hour

 

[fergie_mac66]

We try to avoid marinas , use anchor or beach , No problems manoeuvring with twin engined or outboard, close quarters manoeuvring the outboard links to rudder's and we do 360 degrees on spot without to much trouble

 

[SiteSurfer]

I can understand that - I'm just trying to see whether my families concept of a cat being the golden bullet for the sailing woes is the answer

 

[NormanB]

Charter first and get daughter onboard for trial. (maybe Canaries).

Otherwise could be an expensive and fruitless purchase.

If she is really motion sensitive nothing short of 45,000 tons, stabilisers and a very calm day may solve the problem.

 

[SiteSurfer]

We had considered that, but felt that it was unlikely that we would be able to charter a 30 year old cat

 

[fergie_mac66]

We find it suitable for our needs, we are not in a hurry and are quite happy to motorsail to keep SOG up,
yes can be bouncy but in most condition
we sail level with no roll.Some conditions occasionally cause a rocking motion, a change of course cures, or if
anchored we put a shear line on .
Living conditions are more civilized at anchor,we have space and we like to see out and watch the world go by.Half boats
tend to put you down below . We like both cats and half a boat's they just give a different outlook.A few weeks on a cat,
with a lack of heel at sea is definitely less tiring.The dog house helps though as does sailing in carpet slippers

 

[alahol2]

We spent 5 years in a trimaran (Telstar 26) and 13 in a catamaran (Iroquois IIA) around the Solent. Both our boys grew up from a couple of months old in that time. For kids, there is no boat better than a cat. They can sit inside if it's cold a do a jigsaw on the table (the wife can join them). They can see exactly what's going on all around. They can lie on the trampoline and watch the sea. The boat can be beached and they can climb off a dig for worms. They may even want to steer occasionally.
We crossed the channel several times in both of the multis usually to Normandy where the minimal draft can be an advantage.
The down side(?) is that marinas can become expensive. We virtually never used them except when on holiday. Winter storage and maintenance time is the other big(ger) expense.
Both were powered by outboards so we sailed most of the time and anchored or went up on the beach. The boats lived on a swinging mooring in Portsmouth harbour.
If you can get past the difficulties both your daughter and your wife will thank you.

 

[William_H]

Yes I think your crew have rose coloured glasses re a cat. The cat will pitch just as any monohull and roll in a similar way especially with a beam on large swell. The cat takes on the angle of the approaching or retreating wave face. Certainly they don't heel like a lead mine (monohull) but a mono once heeled might actually roll with waves less. I think this depends on whether and how much they rely on form stability versus what I call pendulum stability of a deep heavy keel. The latter tends to keep the boat flat regardless of the angle of the water it floats in. However of course pendulum stability does not come in until you get a fair bit of heel. Might suggest a deep long keel boat would roll less. (but I doubt it).
Indeed the only way to reduce motion in a boat I fear is mass lots of weight and size.
As said try to get some sailing in on a cat to see if it does suit the crew if not buy a caravan . olewill

 

[ex-Gladys]

As a seasickness sufferer, a cat doesn't make much difference. Right it doesn't heel or roll, but if running down wind, then one hull lifts and rides before the other, leading to a corkscrew type motion, and the same upwind... All my large cat sailing has been done on "classic" cats, Iroquois 1 and the 42' Martyn Smith Comanche look alike that he built between 67 and 81...

 

[RichardS]

When underway our cat does roll from side to side a bit in heavy seas but most of the motion is bow/stern pitching although it all depends upon the course being followed, of course. Whether bow/stern pitching is more or less seasickness inducing than beam/beam rolling, I know not.

Where a cat is definitely a lot more stable is at anchor. If getting seasick at anchor is an issue, then a cat is probably the solution to that particular circumstance.

Neither me, nor any of my crew, have ever been seasick on our cat although we might just be seasick resistant.

Richard

 

[fergie_mac66]

Cats definitely don't roll as far as monos downwind , they heel a little but more by wave motion than weight of wind in sail, reefed appropriately.
Cups stop on the table with drinks rarely move even when bouncy
The real boon is at anchor, deck , cockpit space, the light and view in accommodation are definitely family friendly.We spend more time on a trip with family , more time
anchored ,moored , beached than at sea.

 

[SiteSurfer]

As said try to get some sailing in on a cat to see if it does suit the crew if not buy a caravan . olewill

Please no! The subject of motor homes has cropped up more than once.

 

[duncan99210]

I'm a confirmed monohull type person but I've just finished moving a cat from Lefkas to Barbados, so feel able to give an opinion...
The cat (Fontin Pajoit Belize) was much more stable than our monohull, with next to no heel except in the most extreme circumstances sliding down a wave face sideways. However, despite being 43 ft long, it did pitch a good deal more than our Bavaria 38 in similar seas: no idea why that should be but it did. The sideways element of movement was also less predictable and rhythmic than the monohull, leading to more staggering about the place when there was a bit of a sea running.
I'm not particularly susceptible to sea sickness but I did have a bout of it on the first leg of the trip but the weather was really quite nasty and we were taking water over the bows most waves, so not too surprising perhaps. However, if the objective of moving to a cat is to remove the sea sickness risk, I fear iprobably won't help. You might do better looking to using sea sickness medications, there are any number of them out there see if you can't find one to suit your daughter.
A final note downside is that the bridge deck can make them noisy in a sea way as the water slams up into the deck. We got used to it fairly quickly on the trip but it was very noisy!

 

[C08]

We have had a 27 ft cat (8M Catalac) for 13 years now and have never regretted the change from a twin keel 26Ft heavy monohull.
Pro for us
Big doghouse gives good standing shelter and enlarges standing area of cabin with main hatch open except in very wild weather.
No rolling at anchor
All round visibility from saloon table and nice sat in the fore cabin bed with a cup of tea
Flat stable platform is far less tiring under way, cooking is fine under way and sea sickness is almost totally reduced. I am quite susceptible and the difference to me is enormous.
Possibility of anyone over the side is very remote compared to a monohull.
Greater living space, storage space and room to fit davits for tender(ability to launch inflated dinghy ver quickly is also a safety aid) and fit wind generator and 2x80W solar panels on the wheelhouse roof.
Quick off the wind and fun to sail. Lift the outboard (power tilt) and another 3/4 knot what is not to like.On the wind motor sail or bear away a bit.
A brilliant family cruising vehicle with space for dogs, kids, bikes windsurfer etc.
Cons
Poor upwind performance-anyone switching from a skinny performance mono hull and where the sailing performance is important would not enjoy one of these older cats
A bit of slamming in some wind/sea state conditions but this is not too bad on this boat
Some, perhaps 20% of marinas charge extra for cats but most do not. The ones that do often charge 20-25% not the 50% of boat urban myth. Very easy to work around if this is a problem but as an 8M cat has the living accommodation of a 34ft monohull this is not too bad.
A cat can be a bit more difficult to handle in a tight marina but engine linked to steering helps or ideally twin engines are better.
More hull to anti foul and more boat to maintain.
Smaller cats mostly have sitting headroom in the saloon which takes a little getting used to, on our boat we have the main hatch open most of the time except in very wild weather this give standing in the cabin.
Overall
If performance sailing is important then an older budget cat is not for you but if stability,comfort, living and storage space, enhanced personal safety and reduced sea sickness are considerations then a cat may facilitate more sailing. We rarely have to don sailing jackets to sail being under a large wheelhouse.

There is a strange prejudice against multihulls. I think some sailors feel that not being able to point well or beat for hours somehow reflects badly on them?

 

[Mister E]

If you all come up to North Wales I can take you out on a 8meter Caralac. I an sure we can find a lumpy bit given a few days.

 

[RichardS]

Some, perhaps 20% of marinas charge extra for cats but most do not. The ones that do often charge 20-25% not the 50% of boat urban myth.
A cat can be a bit more difficult to handle in a tight marina but engine linked to steering helps or ideally twin engines are better.

I agree with everything you say CO8 .... but it should be said that if the 50% is an urban myth, it is an urban myth for the UK. If the OP brings his cat to Greece or Croatia then 50% is the minimum surcharge he will suffer. In Croatia it's more likely to be 100%. However, as you say, you need to compare these charges with a much longer equivalent monohull.

As for handling, with two engines a cat is in a different league to any monohull which doesn't have a bowthruster.

Richard

 

[Rivers & creeks]

Cats are fantastic - almost perfect family boats. Like a motorsailer the compromises are stark and visible, unlike an AWB where the compromises are blurred. Modern expensive large cats successfully re-blur the compromises

So you get fantastic beam in the accommodation but lose any use of the front 25%. You either have a stupid design like the Iroquois which will try to kill you or a 50/50 motorsailer like the Catalac or Heavenly Twins, both of which are immensely popular with families. You get low displacement so they only need small cheap engines but you get blown about in a marina and like a mobo you need speed through the water to maneuver unless you have twin inboards. You have space but if you use it to carry stuff you utterly wreck the handling - see that video above. They barely heel or roll but they can hobbyhorse a lot and some have a weird twitching corkscrew motion.

We had a cat and would have had another but big ones are disproportionately expensive and the youngsters in the family have come to deeply love a wheelhouse which dramatically improves the British weather! Your family will just love a cat, a nice big 9m Catalac or a twin double cabin Heavenly Twins will cost you about £12,000. Beware, there are some odd one-off or low volume designs in the cat world and they are to be avoided at all costs, stick to a cat that's sold a few hundred.

 

[SiteSurfer]

Some very interesting responses, I've been idly looking at some of the older cats and the Prout name crops up again and again - however I have to say, they are not as beautiful as a monohull...

 

[RichardS]

So you get fantastic beam in the accommodation but lose any use of the front 25%.

I'm not sure what that means? We have single berths in each bow which go right to the very front of the boat. Under the berth is a sealed flotation tank so it's only that lower section which is not usable.

Richard