Calling for help

[st599]

If I tell you that my location is 50°46'00.0"N 1°18'00.0"W, and yours is 50°46'00.0"N 1°17'00.0"W, you can instantly tell that we're pretty close.

Just mouse over the DSC Alert or DSC SART or DSC MOB on the plotter and get the exact distance and bearing.

 

[ylop]

Just mouse over the DSC Alert or DSC SART or DSC MOB on the plotter and get the exact distance and bearing.

Thats great if you have a suitable plotter connected to your VHF. Many people who might be quite helpful (eg ribs) won’t have that.

 

[DanTribe]

Hmm. My cunning scheme to simplify calling for assistance seems to have hit problems
.I've yet to suggest activating the EPIRB or burning a tar barrel or fly the ensign upside down
. Sorry folks but it was a genuine query.

 

[KevinV]

Hmm. My cunning scheme to simplify calling for assistance seems to have hit problems
.I've yet to suggest activating the EPIRB or burning a tar barrel or fly the ensign upside down
. Sorry folks but it was a genuine query.

I thought my way was pretty simple - stop the boat, then one keeps eyes on the casualty, another heads for the radio, hits the red button and follows the crib sheet - that's got to be do-able, surely?

 

[westhinder]

I've been told that and I'm sure it's true but in practice it seems to have the exact opposite effect. If morale on the calling vessel is important it would be much better to say "We've launched help to you.... Now, what is your favorite colour.". In practice it always feels like the questions are holding up the launch.

I always find it deeply upsetting having to listen to what seems endless formalistic questions beside the point before the Coastguard finally asks ‘what assistance do you require?’
On our boat the standing order is that after pressing the red button, the nature of the distress has to be communicated in the very first sentence after ‘Panpan’ or ‘Mayday’, before the position or anything else is mentioned.
If there is only one person aboard, which is so often the case, they have no time to answer questions about MMSI or wearing lifejackets, they have an emergency to attend to.

 

[Mark-1]

I always find it deeply upsetting having to listen to what seems endless formalistic questions beside the point before the Coastguard finally asks ‘what assistance do you require?’

Yeah, there is one particular incident that sticks in my mind and I find quite distressing to recall. You can hear the fear and frustration in the casualty.

 

[DanTribe]

I'm really curious about the SI clause - are they available online, and are you happy to link to them?

Found it, I didn't imagine it. Not actually in the SIs. Don't know how to link.
Burnham Week 2025, notice board, scroll down to competitor safety, item 2.
It all reads like it's the product of a committee meeting.

 

[flaming]

Found it, I didn't imagine it. Not actually in the SIs. Don't know how to link.
Burnham Week 2025, notice board, scroll down to competitor safety, item 2.
It all reads like it's the product of a committee meeting.

Does rather...

Most regatta documents I've ever seen essentially say "The skipper is responsible for their own boat at all times, just because we're starting a race doesn't mean you should race if it's outside of your own limits."

 

[flaming]

Nothing to stop one putting the ship's set on 16 and having a handheld on the regatta channel though.

You could do. But then normally at the time you're getting the course / start order etc the nav is sat at the chart table writing all down, so would want the main set tuned to the race frequency. Especially if it's at all windy and the boat is noisy.
Then you still have the issue that for the main set to be at all useful it has to be turned right up. Leaving the main set turned up high on 16 whilst racing and having a huge amount of superfluous chatter in my ear is not my idea of how to concentrate on the job in hand. I'm talking about ww/lw racing though this is completely different on passage racing.

 

[ylop]

I always find it deeply upsetting having to listen to what seems endless formalistic questions beside the point before the Coastguard finally asks ‘what assistance do you require?’

If there is only one person aboard, which is so often the case, they have no time to answer questions about MMSI or wearing lifejackets, they have an emergency to attend to.

Found it, I didn't imagine it. Not actually in the SIs. Don't know how to link.
Burnham Week 2025, notice board, scroll down to competitor safety, item 2.
It all reads like it's the product of a committee meeting.

The answer to your original Q seems to be on p2 of that document. I personally don’t think it’s great advice the bit in red seems to suggest they expect you to call the club on Ch72 first. That seems to be asking for delay/confusion.

 

[st599]

Does rather...

Most regatta documents I've ever seen essentially say "The skipper is responsible for their own boat at all times, just because we're starting a race doesn't mean you should race if it's outside of your own limits."

They're not meant to say that anymore - on the race officers' course I did, it was drummed in to us that even though RRS had something similar in, it was meaningless in the UK and EU. The organiser can't delegate their legal responsibility in that way.

 

[flaming]

The answer to your original Q seems to be on p2 of that document. I personally don’t think it’s great advice the bit in red seems to suggest they expect you to call the club on Ch72 first. That seems to be asking for delay/confusion.

Disagree.

Calling the club safety officer first means getting straight through to someone who

1. Is already afloat on a rib
2. Has good local knowledge as to where you might be based on rapid info like "in the mouth of the Roach"
3. Has almost certainly had pre event communication with the emergency services and agreed procedures etc

My suspicion is that you'd get a faster response that way.

 

[flaming]

They're not meant to say that anymore - on the race officers' course I did, it was drummed in to us that even though RRS had something similar in, it was meaningless in the UK and EU. The organiser can't delegate their legal responsibility in that way.

https://www.cowesweek.co.uk/web/download/2025/CW25-SafetyBooklet-1.pdf

Skipper’s responsibility to their crew
The safety of the boat and crew is the responsibility of both the skipper and the crew. Skippershave a duty of care to their crew and need to sail and race within the capabilities of crew and boat. This responsibility is enshrined in maritime law and a skipper can be prosecuted if the Maritime Coastguard Agency believe that a crew has had their lives endangered through the action or inaction of their skipper.In extreme cases this can result in a substantial fine or even a jail sentence.

For some, especially those with smaller, less seaworthy craft or with less experienced crew, this might on occasion mean that a cautious approach needs to be taken. For example, it might not be sensible for such a boat to carry their spinnaker downwind, especially in wind against tide conditions.There may also be occasions when a skipper decides that the conditions are too tough for them and that they should not race, even though other boats in their class are still competing. These are difficult but important decisions.Of course, if the Race Committee feels that the conditions are too extreme for one or more classes, they will cancel racing for those boats. However, this in no way implies that, if a race is started, any particular boat should herself start.

 

[Stemar]

I thought my way was pretty simple - stop the boat, then one keeps eyes on the casualty, another heads for the radio, hits the red button and follows the crib sheet - that's got to be do-able, surely?

Not always. If I go for an unscheduled swim, leaving a rather panicked Madame aboard, the best I can hope for is that she'll hit the red button and, maybe, keep me in sight.

 

[Pye_End]

I've entered a regatta and the SIs call for me to give a safety briefing. I will have young and fairly inexperienced crew who are phone savvy but not so used to VHF. Racing will be mostly inshore.
In case of medical emergency would you advise a 999 call or tell them to call the Coastguard?

If time is off the essence, then whatever the crew feels most comfortable with. Preference for VHF, but is crew not familiar then 999.

I've heard some recent calls when CG goes through a lengthy checklist before dispatching help. I'm not sure my youngsters have the patience.

I wouldn't worry about this. If crew should be otherwise busy then get them to tell the CG. Help, if necessary, will have had it's button pressed long before they have finished gathering information. Very easy to .miss the obvious' when stressed, so CG interaction is often more useful than you think.

 

[st599]

https://www.cowesweek.co.uk/web/download/2025/CW25-SafetyBooklet-1.pdf

Indeed. The race officer should have agreed his parameters for starting well in advance and written their daily risk assessment, and decision to race. They should then be constantly reviewing that decision and abandon if necessary. (This is now a requirement for all sailing activity run by RYA affiliates, training centres etc.)

But if something does go badly wrong, the organisers as well as the skipper will be being investigated and potentially prosecuted.

 

[flaming]

Indeed. The race officer should have agreed his parameters for starting well in advance and written their daily risk assessment, and decision to race. They should then be constantly reviewing that decision and abandon if necessary. (This is now a requirement for all sailing activity run by RYA affiliates, training centres etc.)

But if something does go badly wrong, the organisers as well as the skipper will be being investigated and potentially prosecuted.

Yes. All very true, but in my opinion it's leading to a culture of being overly cautious, especially with respect to strong winds.

We've had one event this year where they ran 1 race then sent us all home because "you all seem to be having some issues". We weren't. We were in our element planing downwind in 22 knots of breeze. One slightly iffy gybe, but no broaches etc, sailing basically as normal, relishing the chance to practice the heavy wind stuff.

It's a tricky one, but within the time I've been racing we used to start races with 30kts on the dial, and race quite happily. Now we don't, so people simply aren't used to sailing in proper breeze any more. As we saw that day... One competitor motored in with a kite wrapped round the rig, there were many broaches. We were one of the few boats that got round without any major issues, and honestly I really didn't think it was that windy, we were still on the full size kite. Didn't really mind that they canned it, as it confirmed we won the regatta, but I'd have been very miffed if we'd needed another good result to win overall.

I don't know how you get to a point where significant numbers of the fleet are not "having some issues" in 20-25 knots without being out there when there is a bit of breeze...

And it's a self fulfilling prophecy... If we never race inshore over about 20 knots, then why would I bother having reef points in my inshore main? And why would I bother having a usable small kite, or jib that can go upwind in 30 knots? And then when no boat has those sails.... Well, we can't race over 20 knots.

 

[capnsensible]

I'm not quite sure why some people want to overcomplicate a simple thing?

Got DSC? Press one button.

Not got DSC? Read out your mayday message from your instruction card you have thoughtfully placed next to the radio. Add position.

Personally, I always think that the more help you can give to the people you are calling to..err...help you, the better

Try this simple exercise. Say out loud a made up mayday call. Time how long it takes you to read it out slowly and clearly. 30, 40 seconds? It's that easy....if you practice. In my opinion.

 

[flaming]

I'm not quite sure why some people want to overcomplicate a simple thing?

Got DSC? Press one button.

Not got DSC? Read out your mayday message from your instruction card you have thoughtfully placed next to the radio. Add position.

Personally, I always think that the more help you can give to the people you are calling to..err...help you, the better

Try this simple exercise. Say out loud a made up mayday call. Time how long it takes you to read it out slowly and clearly. 30, 40 seconds? It's that easy....if you practice. In my opinion.

The issue is not how experienced offshore sailors call a mayday. The issue is what instructions can you give to inexperienced sailors that mean if you go over the side or are otherwise incapacitated they can get you the help that you need.

What, I think, has changed in recent years is that everyone owns a fantastically powerful communication and location device of their own. That is, in some ways, completely transformative from when only the navigator knew "ish" the position. Even the act of reading out GPS positions over the radio or phone is now negated.

Sure, there are limitations. having a signal is the obvious one, though a lot of phones will now revert to starlink in an emergency and allow you to call 999 / 112 etc. But to dismiss the potential power of the device that every one of your new crew own, and know how to use, is perhaps missing an opportunity.
Would I, personally, reach for my phone in a mayday situation on the boat? No.
Would I prefer that my non sailing mate I've taken out for the day uses the device he's familiar with to give the coastguard a position in a format that he understands and is accurate if I fall over the side rather than trying to communicate a lat/long that he's unfamiliar with, that he's reading from a chart plotter that he's unfamiliar with over the VHF that he's never used before ? Yes, probably. That sounds like it has a much higher chance of success in a high stress situation.

There are so many banana skins in a traditional mayday for the inexperienced in a high stress situation. The classics are not being on the right channel, being on low power, reading the position of the cursor on the chart plotter instead of the boat's position, forgetting to let go of the transmit button etc etc...

 

[Cariadco]

I've entered a regatta and the SIs call for me to give a safety briefing. I will have young and fairly inexperienced crew who are phone savvy but not so used to VHF. Racing will be mostly inshore.
In case of medical emergency would you advise a 999 call or tell them to call the Coastguard?
I've heard some recent calls when CG goes through a lengthy checklist before dispatching help. I'm not sure my youngsters have the patience.

To get the crew happy with the radio, go down the pontoon with your HandHeld or anywhere away from the boat, and call them say on channel 6, and have a good old practice on'Talking on the Radio'
It's how I got my Missus happy to use the Radio, as she was terrified before, and just froze up, on the Mic.