Buying Privately

[wooslehunter]

After searching the brokers for some time I may have found what I'm looking for privately.

Does anyone have any advice about buying privately. Much brain-washing from the brokers leads me to believe that they will do all of the contracts and legal stuff.

Is there actually much to this?

Any help appreciated.

Dave

 

[wayneA]

I too am interested in this.

I wonder if it's possible to pay a broker/someone to just do the 'conveancy'(sp?) etc.

Only problem is that you end up paying the bill that the seller would normaly pick-up in the broker's comission. It's maybe worth asking the seller to pay the 'conveancy'(sp?) bill if they want a sale, as I would guess that it would be alot cheaper than 8%+ broker commission.

Just a few thoughts

Wayne

 

[sailbadthesinner]

the rya do a booklet that is a guide to buying boats
i would start with that
if you join you can also get free advice
get the boat surveyed would be a start
lots of advice on this board on surveyors
do a search on the forum or i am sure people will reccomend
good luck

This isn't an office, its hell with strip lighting

 

[davel]

You might find<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.rya.org.uk/shop/ryabooks/default.asp?itemId=233993&continue=/shop/ryabooks/default.asp?shopKeyword=buying&shopCategory=0> this RYA booklet </A> worth buying.

It's also worth giving them a call if you have a specific question. I've always found them helpful myself.

Dave L.

 

[warrior40]

I know that brokers will do conveyancing for a smallish one off fee, I know that Dickies have done this before for someone I know of. They paid a 1 off £300 fee.
The best thing to do, which I have done before, a number of times, is to ring the RYA and get them to send you a copy of an agreement called
'Agreement for the sale of a second hand boat. '
You can fill your part in as the buyer / transferee and the vendor/transferer can be asked to fill in his part. It can form a legal ( I think) contract provided all the bits are completed correctly.
There will obviously always have be a degree of trust between people on these occasions though.

 

[stubate]

you can download this form off the rya internet site, they also do an article on buying privately that you can download.
the problem arises when you hand over the dosh and take something that could be belonging to a mortgage company.
you need to see all the previous bills of sale and the rya advises you to check with the leading mortgage houses advertising in the back of the magazines.
if you buy off a broker they do all this for you and if it all goes pear shaped the law says that if you have bought in good faith off a well known co that you are in pretty good shape as far as ownership goes, just imagine buying privately a boat owned by a mortgage co with a bill of sale off a rascal owner that isnt worth the paper its printed on !!

 

[gjeffery]

The broker may be useful in ensuring title, otherwise I am not sure what brokers actually do for their 8 per cent. You pay for the survey however you buy, and by buying privately, you release that margin for the seller to haggle with. I suspect that the buyer pays indirectly for much of the broker's commission. Completing the contract appears to be formulaistic - and I suspect that a solicitor might do this (if necessary) for less than the brokers fee.

 

[Joe_Cole]

I bought my boat using the RYA contract and it seemed fair and reasonable to both the seller and myself. If I were buying again I would be happy to use it again, and suspicious of somebody who wanted to sell using anything else.

The only slight worry is if the boat is subject to an HP agreement (i.e. the seller is not entitled to sell it) and he is pulling a fast one. But, I don't suppose that you'ld be any better off if a broker were selling, they seem to want their money, but take no responsibility for anything. I'ld get a solicitor involved if I were concerned about this. In my case I wasn't worried, the seller was OK.

Joe

 

[JamesS]

Re: Buying Privately - VAT Paid?

Amongst the paperwork already mentioned - don't forget you will need proof that VAT has been paid. No problem on a fairly new boat but if its an older vessel and has had several owners this can be tricky.

For much older vessels, pre 1/1/1985 and were in the EC on 31/12/1992, it mat be 'deemed' that VAT has been paid.

A useful publication is 'UK Guide for Yachts' available from HM Customs & Excise on 0845 010 9000.

Cheers

 

[alan54]

iv`e just sold privetly and glad i did.
stay well away from brokers once they get their teeth into you they want their bit of flesh.
just make sure the boat has no debt on it the standard rya bill of sale form covers this. of course a survey may be needed unless you are very good at looking at boats your self
good luck

 

[martinb]

One disadvantage of buying privately that I found was the interfacing directly with the seller. Through a brooker I felt free to make much reduced (realistic) offers for boats. When I bought my boat privately, despite knowing the boat had been on the market for a long time, I felt unable to haggle freely because I didn't want to offend the seller - whom I admired and liked. However, the fact that the seller isn't parting with a pound of flesh in commision should make the private price more realistic any way I guess.

Martin

 

[chrisD]

Re: Buying Privately - VAT Paid?

If the boat is on the Part 1 register is that proof that VAT was paid?

 

[david_e]

1 Find out the history of the boat and track through the paperwork to see if it all stacks up. A careful owner will have receipts, log book etc.

2 ask them about the use the boat has had, ask them if it has been grounded at all or damaged in an accident.

3 Find out why they are selling and what they are buying, people either sell lemons or upgrade, generally. (they could just be getting out)

4 Have you been for a test sail, checked the motor, given the boat a good check out?

5 Is there an inventory of what is included in the sale?

6 Make your offer, subject to survey and contract -


When you are satisfied that it all stacks up, instruct a surveyor. They will help you with the paperwork and you can also take guidance from the RYA, if you are a member. Their appproach is belt and braces so be prepared to instruct your own solicitor or a marine specialist because that is what they will advise you to do.

7 Your receipt from the seller should include their declaration that the boat is theirs to sell, free from lien and any finance charges. You should have their original receipt which will give an idea if it was on finance or not.

8 Try and be there when you pay/take delivery so you can let people in the area, Marina, yards etc know that it is yours.

9 Take your time and be careful, and don't forget your insurance.

 

[pandroid]

Re: Buying Privately - VAT Paid?

<If the boat is on the Part 1 register is that proof that VAT was paid?>

No. Part 1 does not record VAT status.

 

[mhouse]

Re: Buying Privately - VAT Paid?

I am looking at a private sale in France. Hopefully with the saving I can pay a broker to act on my behalf . The cost saving on the boat should easily pay for their bills. Anybody had any experience of this ?

 

[JamesS]

Re: Buying Privately - VAT Paid?

I don't think it does. When I was dealing with a broker earlier this year they needed a bill showing VAT had been paid.

I understand from them that much of their working day is spent chaing down VAT queries.

Do get gold of the HM Customs document mentioned above - full of useful info.

Cheers.