building a steel boat

[rkane]

Having spent the last week or so looking at various tahitianas (a 32'steel yacht) that are on the market, and having looked at the price of the used ones in England and the difficulties of importing one into the country from America, my husband and I are seriously considering building one ourselves. We'd have the hull constructed for us and have got a price for that, but at the moment everyone we speak to is trying to put us off doing it with horrific stories of costs etc. We're both aware of how much work & time will be involved - we've built our own home and have restored a 24' yacht, but does anyone have a rough idea of how much we should be allowing to fit out a solid, practical sea-boat (as opposed to one with every luxury available on it)? From the sums that we've done, we were thinking in terms of £20,000, possibly buying recon. engine / cabin heater etc. but would allow £10,000 extra in our budget. Is this completely unrealistic? Does anyone have any encouragement for us? I think we'll probably have a go at doing it anyway, but a few postive words from someone with experiene would be great!!

 

[Strathglass]

What's the hull going to cost to make ? Double that, then multiply between 4 and 5 and you will approach the real costs.
If you choose all the bits carefully, only buy when the price is right the only multiply by three, but that will take several years. I have almost finished a yacht, at 4 times the hull cost for the parts. It has taken over ten years to get all the bits and I have had no outside help.

Best of luck

Iain

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by iainsimpson on 01/02/2003 22:09 (server time).</FONT></P>

 

[rkane]

I'm hoping you mean the cost of building the hull ourselves - not having it built - otherwise we're talking £120 000 for a 32' boat, because we've been quoted between £15 - 20 000 to build the steel hull (which includes the cockpit and decks). i think I'd be wanting a bit of gold plating thrown in for that!!!

 

[snowleopard]

having built a couple of 39 footers (from scratch) i have a fair idea of the costs and time involved.

assume about 25% of the project is the hull, in terms of time and cost. for a 39 ft cat we took 3500 man hours and around £70k - fitted out for blue water. a similar boat professionally built took 7000 hours and cost around 3 times as much. it all depends on the quality of finish.

for the size you are talking about, costs are probably 2/3 of ours (our gear is light for our size, also a gps costs the same regardless of loa).

 

[Anchorite]

Re: Join the steel band

I think Snowleopard is over the top pricewise: I've been involved in 40 and 31 ft
steel boats: the price of the latter is nearer half the 40 footer as a DIY project.
Mast sails and motor are main items: after that it's time and personal competence
You can do anything with steel except stop it rusting: hull must be completely
painted outside and in before you start fitting-out. All stiffening members (tech
term) must be predrilled: deck must have a multitude of possible attachment
points (rarely on dwgs) to tie down liferaft, inflatable, mother-in-law, why).
If you go for a hull make sure the full set of finishing dwgs is included (as a guide,
and don't stray too far).
Feel free to PM if you want.

 

[Bladerunner]

Take a look at www.botenbank.nl lots of steel hulled yachts for sale at reasonable prices.

Tu ne quaesieris, scire nefas

 

[Altair]

I am in the process of refitting a steel 32', including new engine, sails, blasting & epoxying hull, galley, fridge, water system, wiring, cushions and more with costs coming in under my budget of £12K. I found "Steel Away" by LeCain Smith and Sheila Moir very useful in planning the refit. Worth reading.

 

[PaulJ]

The yard quoted me £23K +Vat to build my round bilged 39 footer and they later told me that they had somewhat under quoted (but that is all I paid!). By the time it was epoxy coated, with the engine in place (though not installed) and transported to my garden, it had cost about £40K and my guestimate is that by the time it reaches the water it will have cost the thick end of £80K. I have used a fair bit of Teak and done a reasonable job of it and so far it has taken me a bit over 5 years to fit out, I HOPE (no stronger than that) to get it in the water by late summer this year. Had I gone for a more "utility" fit-out I could have saved a little in both time and money.... but not THAT much.

I think your estimate of £10K for fitting out is a bit optimistic, even though the boat is a little smaller..... however spread over several years and lots of boat jumbles, maybe not totally unrealisitc.

If you want to discuss it further, I have PMd you with my phone number.

Best of Luck!

 

[bluevelvet]

I think your costs are very optomistic ,unless you enjoy building rather than sailing I suggest you take a look at two boats on the Leemarine.com website.First one is a Mason 32 steel hulled boat which appears very good value, the other is a Kingston 39 which is an alloy version of a Endurance 35.Both appear to be stout vessels but the downside is there location.Enjoy your search

 

[ean_p]

Difficult call....we bought the Kiss in holland all ready to go at a very good price...the insides having been made by the one and only owner.....so now we're changing a whole lump of them.....to make it suit us...but wouldn't you do that with any 12 to 13 year old boat.....couldn't contemplate a minimum of 5/6 years to build and fit out.....try over the water ...lots to see in the 30 to 40 foot range at some very good prices....one little tip if you go steel be very wary of wooden decks etc..no matter how good the sealent underneth is claimed to be...wood and steel do not mix!!!!....
p.s. really only posted this cos just got piccie of the Kiss on line

 

[adrianm]

It cost me £40k to have the basic hull and decks of my 16 metre boat built.

Current estimates are upwards of £250k to see it finished. Mine is a powerboat though so obviously a sailboat would be cheaper.

 

[dignity]

I've just completed a 46ft steel motor barge, without going into detail if you've estimated what it will cost to complete double what you've estimated. It is very surprising how things add up. Also stay away from second-hand equipment, it may seem cheaper at the time, but in my view it turns out to be false economy, and after all why build a nice new toy and fill it with second-hand equipment!

And the final statement, would I build another? No!

 

[richardandtracy]

Steel Spray

I built myself a 36 ft steel Spray for £13K. Total.

Hasn't got an engine yet, but that's coming along (£25 for a neighbour's ford diesel or a 2CV engine if I can source a design for a marine carb).

I'm prepared to live with a spartan environment. Basically the insides look like they've come from the 60's (ie a bit cheap!). However, I want a boat that's mine and money in the bank to live on, rather than have a posh boat and have to work hard to pay for it.

The design was £300 in 1990. I then re-drew the boat on CAD in 3D and wrote a program to develop the flat profiles from DXF polylines. The profiled plates cost £2500 blasted & primed. The rest came within the remaining 10K of the budget. I will say that I don't think it's possible to get a cheaper boat. I've cast all aluminium bits myself from scrap engine castings (and any other aluminium I can get for nothing). All machined bits have been done on my lathe & mill. A wooden mast was cheaper, so that's what I've got and so on. I don't really like electrics, but the masthead light has to be electric, so I made my own windmill alternator & so on. All other lights are home-made parafin lanterns. Sextant is home made, depthsounder is a lump of cast roofing lead on a string... Anchors all home made. I did buy [ouch] a Porta-Potti and a compass, though I could have made a compass if I'd thought enough about it.

The dingy (I'm currently making) should cost £40 including sails, oars and all fittings.

Basically, the fitting out cost 4x the hull cost. However, it depends on what level of luxury you want to put up with and how much your time is worth. I reckon Bruce Roberts was pretty much there when stating that assembling a hull kit takes 5-600 manhours. The rest takes a similar time - and it can be fun (occasionally).

In conclusion, how desparate are to to stay in the budget? You could spend 20K, or 30K if you wish. But it's just possible to spend 10K too.

Regards

Richard

 

[ccscott49]

Re: Steel Spray

Now you are what I call a real "practical boat owner", casting your own aluminium fittings! Did you make sand moulds first? Were you working and building at the same time, I'm amazed, I thought I did alot myself, but.............

 

[richardandtracy]

Re: Steel Spray

Greensand moulding was the method I used, take a look at www.backyardmetalcasting.com for a full run down on how to do it for next to nothing. I used charcoal as my furnace fuel, but site owner's using chip pan oil now (wish I'd thought of it!). I used timber from scrap pallets for the patterns, cutting and filling with plasticine as required. The greensand mix I used was ground up pettex cat litter (10% by volume - I used pettex as it's fullers earth) to building sand, mixed it up and then dampened the whole lot off until it kept a good shape when squeezed in the hand.

I live on a seam of brick clay (2 feet down) and used this along with cement and childrens white play sand as my refractory for the furnace. The furnace was made inside a bit of scrap stainless ducting, and the crucible was a section of 3" inside diameter steel tube with a 5mm blanking plate welded to one end. I can cast up to about 2lb with this furnace.

All in all, the furnace and moulding sand etc probably cost £3 (bearing in mind that bags of cat litter have more usual uses too - once I'd taken my share).

I do work. I'm a full time mechanical engineer, and have access to nice quantities of steel scrap for ballast and some occasional aluminium - but 6082 isn't great for casting, the best source is old car engines as the aluminium castings are usually equivalent to LM6. I also have 2 helpers (now aged 3 and 6) who have probably slowed the project more than any other single cause. It's taken 10 years to get the boat into a sailable condition. I can sail, but now need to learn to to sail properly without sinking anyone (ie look out!).

Regards

Richard

 

[tcm]

Re: Steel Spray

Hurrah! This is very resourceful. That colin scott thinks he is very DIY but I know for a fact he uses bought rope!

 

[ean_p]

Re: Steel Spray

I know it may sound daft but isn't it just simpler, easier and in the long run better to just work for a wage like every one else and then but the bits you need rather then reinventing the wheel.....you can earn a lot of money in ten years and with a dedicated savings regime you could save an awful lot too.....I rebuilt my house and half way through and committed I realised that icould do just that and have real builders etc do it in half the time I could for the money I could earn if not spending time time doing up the house.....or have i missed something...??

 

[Shanty]

Re: Steel Spray

Sounds a great project. it would be nice to see a write-up or two in PBO. This approach to boat owning doesn't seem to get much of a mention these days, which is a pity.

Kim, when you see this one, how about a gentle prod in the right quarter?

 

[richardandtracy]

Re: Steel Spray

Don't forget, it is fun too...

No, I'm not re-inventing the wheel. It's taught me a heck of a lot about how little technology is actually required to do a seemingly very technical job. In order to know how to do something easily, it's frequently necessary to learn how things are done in industry, then mentally strip out the fluff and take the technology back to basics. This is saleable knowledge and experience at a later date.

Why don't I let a builder do it? One word. Quality [of work]. I have certain standards, which I need to be able to guarantee. I can't guarantee that level of quality if somebody else does the work. The quality I demand is not that of an artizan, but it's better than work I've seen from many yards - and is acheivable by anybody who is reasonably competant (need I query some yards again...?).

Thirdly, why don't I work the hours God sends to pay for somebody else to do the work? I'm an engineer with 14 years experience. I get paid much less per hour than a yard charges. There aren't enough hours in the week for me to be able to afford to pay a yard. I know I'm in the wrong business, but money isn't everything.

Regards

Richard.