Botnia Targa 27.2/30.1

[stiknstring]

Grateful for advice as to a potential purchase of either of these two boats. I have been a sailor for the past 30 years and for personal reasons, am looking to sell my sailing boat (Oceanis 50) and buy a smaller power boat in the UK that is small enough for me to handle on my own and tough enough to take on some of the weather here in the UK (my sailing boat is in the Med to where we escaped some 8 years ago). I am torn between these two (above) as although the pricing is roughly the same (new versus a 3 year old boat), the accommodation in the 27.2 is smaller but probably OK for me on my own while the 30.1 means that I can have my two sons on board occasionally. I do not want to get into the "big boat" issues that I have on my sailing boat or into a motor boat suitable complicated that maintenance starts to erode the enjoyment. A quick turn of the key and off is my ideal. That apart, the 27.2 with the 440 hp engine is a beast while the lower powered and heavier 30.1 is quick and agile but a little less exciting. The mystery to me from my sailing background is more of a general question on sterndrives/IPS etc which terminology leaves me puzzled and unable to make a judgement as to what prop arrangement to look for (maybe one not available on Targas - which would steer me away from the type). Any advice /comments on what goes on underwater from a technical/maintenance/performance viewpoint? For occasional forays along the UK coast and over the Scillies/Normandy etc, is this the right boat with the right drive? Many thanks in advance, Alan

 

[Bandit]

The Botnia Targas, Tarfish and Sargo's are all sterndrive boats (outdrives) and not IPS.

All have Volvo Penta Engines and Outdrives.

Look at the Sargo's also they are good boats.

Depending on what accomodation you want 27ft, 30ft to 35/36ft.

The 30 feels a lot bigger than a 27ft.

If you get a secondhand one get the engines and drives checked over by an independent of the boat owner Volvo Penta dealer.

 

[Kawasaki]

Great choice Alan
The Botnia does what is says on the tin etc
Did some instruction on a 33 some years ago
Only in sheletered waters locally but there was a 2 metre chop because of wind against tide and the boat just went through it literally like a knife through butter
Handy thing to berth etc with two motors and two access doors from the helm and nice wide side decks
The30 ft is the better imho
as Bandit said it does feel a lot bigger inside
All apart from the later ones are outdrive, thats the only negative I have to say about the boats
Thats just me though I just dont really like the things
Nothing wrong with how they drive the boats and how they handle
In fact I was talking to a member of the UK's importers staff (very experienced and knowledgable Chap )at the Southampton boat show in 2018 and as He pointed out the Targa suits the outdrive system,fair play
I have viewed many this last14 months (helping a good friend) in the UK and Europe
Sea trialled a couple
Friend Alex has been hankering after a 37 or a 42
However we are making plans to veiw a smaller one that is in France
31/2, mark 2 I think it is
Some of the 'smaller' ones have two heads and the berths are modified etc, on later ones
Yes again as Bandit mentioned they all seem to have the green lumps in them
Maybe a few had yanmars??, not sure
Early ones had the TAMD then later the KADS
'D' series afterwards
the D ones are quieter and more modern obviously and maybe a little more economical ref fuel burn
Just for interest for You Alan and others
The search for my Pals new boat has included Grand Banks, Dale Nelson, Nimbus and Aquastar types
The search has taken us all over the UK and Spain and the Netherlands
Its Matey's first serious hard boat (got a rib had a sports boat) so its just Me spending his money on hotels etc!!!
Good innit!
So as the 'Expert tyre kicker' I kinda dont want the search to end!
What I am getting around to saying really is that it is hard to choose what one wants
So
Here are some hard facts Alan
Go to 30ft I think
D series if the budgett will
Seaworthyness is brilliant
Oh! looked at others like the Sargo as again Bandit mentioned
There are a couple of other makes similar too but all are like hens teeth
The Botnias are not cheap that is a 'given' but well made
Plus re sale is kinda protected
Not that there is a 'Cartel' or anything like that but Wessex the UK Chaps and Botnia themselves do 'protect' the Brand imho
To sum up
Bloody well built vessels that will see you through choppy times etc!

 

[gordmac]

The 30 will have two engines, has advantages but twice the maintenance costs. And will use more fuel.

 

[oldgit]

They are the police choice on the Tidal Thames above the barrier,think they must have at least 6 or 7, presumably because they are fast stable and manoeuvrable.
Have yet to see one employed futher downstream or elsewhere in commercial use offshore, where robust single hulled boats seem to be preferred by pilots etc.
The EA locally did have one a while ago but either it was replaced with something else or simply sold off.

 

[volvopaul]

One of my clients has a 27 with kad 44 260, he says it goes anywhere in anything .

He told me of a twin engine one for sale with D3 engines, if they are the early D3 I would avoid it .

 

[maverickofpoole]

There is a 27.1 for sale at Wessex Marine that has twin 200 D3's, it's a 2011 boat so is the later model Volvo's
I have twin 170's D3's in my 2010 boat with about 650 hours on them and so far all we have had to do is annual servicing and 1 water pump renewal. Fingers crossed that continues

 

[stiknstring]

There is a 27.1 for sale at Wessex Marine that has twin 200 D3's, it's a 2011 boat so is the later model Volvo's
I have twin 170's D3's in my 2010 boat with about 650 hours on them and so far all we have had to do is annual servicing and 1 water pump renewal. Fingers crossed that continues

 

[stiknstring]

Thank you all for your replies. Really helps in my decision making. There is clearly alot to learn getting into powerboats from sailing. I am grappling with a personal matter at the moment but will come back later once that calms down. Thanks again, Alan

 

[pumpsmynads]

Botnia do an outboard version too of the 27 I think.

 

[stiknstring]

Thanks to all for their replies/advice. Having trialled the 27.2 with a 440HP D6, finally signed the contract yesterday. Relieved at the engine warranty (3 years). A little concerned at using a single engine on a boat without motive back-up (at least my last boat had a mast and sails!) - feels like being back to flying single engined aircraft which always kept me alert for any change in engine sound....Anyway, decision made and a huge learning curve ahead, that I look forward to, with a new form of boating to learn. Trim tabs - blimey, what are they etc!

I am sure I will be back for more advice over next few months - thanks again everyone

 

[maverickofpoole]

Congratulations, the 27.2 with 440hp will be a great combination, she should go like a scalded cat.
Don't forget the photos when she arrives

 

[mr mischief]

Congratulations on a great choice , I have owned my Targa 27 for nearly a year now and find that its the perfect size for the two of us and easily managed single handed , the steering takes a bit of getting used to with the out drive and no keel but thats par for the course for this type of boat , just keep the speed up
I get just under 30 knots from mine with 260 hp so yours should fly with 440hp in it !

Graham

 

[gordmac]

Enjoy your new toy!

 

[pumpsmynads]

Lovely. Did u buy from Wessex marine?

 

[Elessar]

Thanks to all for their replies/advice. Having trialled the 27.2 with a 440HP D6, finally signed the contract yesterday. Relieved at the engine warranty (3 years). A little concerned at using a single engine on a boat without motive back-up (at least my last boat had a mast and sails!) - feels like being back to flying single engined aircraft which always kept me alert for any change in engine sound....Anyway, decision made and a huge learning curve ahead, that I look forward to, with a new form of boating to learn. Trim tabs - blimey, what are they etc!

I am sure I will be back for more advice over next few months - thanks again everyone

Will be a lovely boat.
I’ve done plenty of channel crossings in single engine boats you’ll get over your fear. Most breakdowns are fuel related and often strike both engines anyway.
The access to a single means it’s easier to maintain and fix too.

As an experienced sailor you will feel out of control in it at low speeds. You’ll have to get used to drifting and being blown about, your temptation will be to be in gear too much so you can steer it, and then you’ll be going way too fast.

Ideally, get someone who is really experienced in outdrive cruisers to come with you and give you some ideas.

3 beginners tips for starting out in marina manoeuvring.
1) In gear 10% of time out of gear 90%.
ie drift 90% and decide what your next course correction will be.
2) Point the wheel in the right direction before clicking it into gear. The wheel does effectively nothing when you are not in gear (leading to the temptation to be in gear too much!)You’ll be clicking into gear and coming straight back out again so steering after you are in gear is too late.
3) Put a windex on the pulpit so you can anticipate where the bow will go next. Helps greatly with 2).

Enjoy!

 

[CLB]

Will be a lovely boat.
I’ve done plenty of channel crossings in single engine boats you’ll get over your fear. Most breakdowns are fuel related and often strike both engines anyway.
The access to a single means it’s easier to maintain and fix too.

As an experienced sailor you will feel out of control in it at low speeds. You’ll have to get used to drifting and being blown about, your temptation will be to be in gear too much so you can steer it, and then you’ll be going way too fast.

Ideally, get someone who is really experienced in outdrive cruisers to come with you and give you some ideas.

3 beginners tips for starting out in marina manoeuvring.
1) In gear 10% of time out of gear 90%.
ie drift 90% and decide what your next course correction will be.
2) Point the wheel in the right direction before clicking it into gear. The wheel does effectively nothing when you are not in gear (leading to the temptation to be in gear too much!)You’ll be clicking into gear and coming straight back out again so steering after you are in gear is too late.
3) Put a windex on the pulpit so you can anticipate where the bow will go next. Helps greatly with 2).

Enjoy!

Agree with above, although on a windy day being out of gear 90% of the time won't be manageable. I tend to be in gear more like 60% of the time when close quarters, windy or not, but I have had years on sterndrives. On a calm day, 90% out of gear will give you time to assess and correct without building up too much speed, but as point 2 states, steer before gear always. I tend to be full lock before engaging gear. It only takes a couple of seconds to go from lock to lock, although it often feels longer when things are getting a bit messy

Another useful thing to keep in mind is to never try and power out of trouble. By the time you are tempted to do thIs, it is usually too late and you just increase the level of damage.

 

[Elessar]

Agree with above, although on a windy day being out of gear 90% of the time won't be manageable. I tend to be in gear more like 60% of the time when close quarters, windy or not, but I have had years on sterndrives. On a calm day, 90% out of gear will give you time to assess and correct without building up too much speed, but as point 2 states, steer before gear always. I tend to be full lock before engaging gear. It only takes a couple of seconds to go from lock to lock, although it often feels longer when things are getting a bit messy

Another useful thing to keep in mind is to never try and power out of trouble. By the time you are tempted to do thIs, it is usually too late and you just increase the level of damage.

Some good additional points.
But I stand by my statement of aiming for 10% for beginners.
It was 3 beginners tips. I could have added 4) don't go out on a windy day until you've built experience, but i think it went without saying to an experienced sailor. And you might do 60% in a fairway but not in close quarters, even after your years on sterndrives.

 

[CLB]

Some good additional points.
But I stand by my statement of aiming for 10% for beginners.
It was 3 beginners tips. I could have added 4) don't go out on a windy day until you've built experience, but i think it went without saying to an experienced sailor. And you might do 60% in a fairway but not in close quarters, even after your years on sterndrives.

In a fairway it's closer to 100%. Remember the 60% is a mixture of forward and reverse. I'm mostly only out of gear when steering. My mooring is across tide and also across the prevailing wind, so I usually need some form of input to correct things.

 

[Elessar]

In a fairway it's closer to 100%. Remember the 60% is a mixture of forward and reverse. I'm mostly only out of gear when steering. My mooring is across tide and also across the prevailing wind, so I usually need some form of input to correct things.

Good for you. With a single 440hp D6, approaching 100% in gear in a fairway will be way too fast in that boat.

And I still stand by my statement of 10% in the context of "3 beginners tips for starting out in marina mooring". Your cross tide berth is irrelevant in that context.