Anchoring rights

[VexedIllologist]

As a relative newcomer to anchoring in Greece I have followe this thread with interest. I apologise for a bit of a thread drift, but would be interested in the views of the more experienced in the use of anchor buoys. I can see a benefit to be able to see where everybody's anchor lies, but it also becomes another piece of rope for all to get tangled up with? So please, do you use one and why / why not?

Years ago I used an anchor buoy every time; there simply weren't so many boats and there was plenty of space. Moreover, people generally knew what anchor buoys were!

It was a small metal buoy (they used to make them for the purpose) with an anchor painted on it.

One day, when in the Bay of Naples, a stiff breeze was blowing on to the quay where we lay stern-to the single anchor. A large Guardia di Finanza patrol boat (c. 80 feet) arrived in the harbour with aplomb and promptly manoeuvred towards our buoy and proceeded to pick it up. Meanwhile I was starting the main engine to be able to react to the seemingly inevitable disaster.

Fortunately, there was some slack in the quite light anchor buoy line and one of the patrol boat sailors quickly realised it was not a mooring buoy that had been fished up on deck, but an anchor buoy (it might also be that the impressive plume of exhaust smoke on an 'emergency start' had caught his eye!). The buoy was hurriedly dropped, the anchor held and my blood pressure began to slowly descend after its crescendo...

Phew! What if I hadn't been enjoying the view of the harbour? Mmm...

I have not used an anchor buoy again!

 

[OldBawley]

I very rarely deploy an anchor buoy. Reasons : if someone else does not get tangled in the buoys rope, then you will. Most sailors are old and almost blind.
However, sometimes ( when using two anchors ) it is nice to have something indicating where the anchors are. Mostly to help others see where my spikes lay.
In that case I place a clearly marked anchor buoy. My anchor buoy is NOT connected to the anchor.
Snorkelling I put a buoy near my anchor ( sometimes a bit further ) with a stone as a weight.
It happened twice some idiot wanted to use my anchor buoy as a mooring and once ( Villefrance ) I saw some dayboat pulling my anchor to the surface while I was visiting a friend in the marina.
I guess they just wanted to know what was on that cute little buoy. That was a16 kg CQR and a lot of chain. We ware very lucky the anchor set again since it is a ¾ hour walk to the anchorage.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I am sure we talked about this in the pass .
Anyway if I feel the need to use an another buoy ( i.e. An tripping line ) , we would lay one the normal way except ,
once we settled I would then remover the buoy and tie a longer line that will sink and bring the line back to the bow .
In that way , no one can pick our line up by mistake or get their propellor caught on it and if we should need it to release the anchor it's on our bow really to be used .
I don't see any point leaving an buoy floating .
I have been told by a few that the buoy marks there anchor so other don't sit on it , it doesn't matter if someone sit on it or not it's not going to affect your anchor . Just imagine if everyone deployed an buoy .

 

[nortada]

I am sure we talked about this in the pass .
Anyway if I feel the need to use an another buoy ( i.e. An tripping line ) , we would lay one the normal way except ,
once we settled I would then remover the buoy and tie a longer line that will sink and bring the line back to the bow .
In that way , no one can pick our line up by mistake or get their propellor caught on it and if we should need it to release the anchor it's on our bow really to be used .
I don't see any point leaving an buoy floating .
I have been told by a few that the buoy marks there anchor so other don't sit on it , it doesn't matter if someone sit on it or not it's not going to affect your anchor . Just imagine if everyone deployed an buoy .

Have used a similar ploy but circumstances dictate the approach taken.

 

[Chris_Robb]

Re the anchor Buoy
Often when coming into an anchorage in light winds you find most of the boats all swung the correct way, but you know very well that they are probably lying to their chain where it touches the bottom. This therefore makes it very difficult to know in a crowded anchorage where to put your hook.

The anchor buoy would solve this issue - but you may choose the wrong buoy! AND the issues around obstruction with the buoy in my view trumps their use in 90% of circumstances - follow Vics plans on foul bottoms.

So there are a number of things that can be done here to help both for you and the newcomer. Endeavour to know where your anchor is: (In clear water) paint your anchor white - you will often find you can see it when drifting around. You can therefore help the newcomer by telling him where it is. This pro-active approach will help avoid clashes later...... Always offer advice on how much chain YOU have out (nicely) and where you think your anchor is if drifting.

With some anchor dragging apps it is probably possible, if you press the button on when the anchor hits the ground, know exactly where it is - but that is rather more boring to work out how to do it - once done it could just become a procedure on anchoring. I think I am rather too lazy to do this!

In 6 years I have only used an anchor buoy once, in porto Rafiti when I was at anchor for several days. It was used as the pin end of the local Optimist starting line - for the training and selection of the young Greek Olympic hopefuls. A very entertaining week.....

 

[FirstAway]

Many thanks to you all for the feedback on this, it gives me confidence that I am doing the right thing.

 

[noelex]

With some anchor dragging apps it is probably possible, if you press the button on when the anchor hits the ground, know exactly where it is - but that is rather more boring to work out how to do it - once done it could just become a procedure on anchoring. I think I am rather too lazy to do this!

You need to allow for the position of the GPS antennae, but you can work out the position of the anchor using the chart plotter trace. The anchor drop point is usually obvious and it is surprisingly accurate.

I sometimes dive on my anchor in quite murky water where the bottom cannot be seen from the surface. With some help from the GPS I can usually pinpoint the position of the anchor to a few metres.

This is also very helpful, especially in light variable wind, when I can estimate if a boat new to the anchorage is dropping their anchor close to ours. Conflicts with boats swinging into other boats are rare, but the most common reason is when the two anchors are close together (and the scope is similar). In light wind the boats might start a reasonable distance from each other, but they will eventually become close.

Knowing the position of your anchor is sometimes useful.

 

[Chris_Robb]

You need to allow for the position of the GPS antennae, but you can work out the position of the anchor using the chart plotter trace. The anchor drop point is usually obvious and it is surprisingly accurate.

I sometimes dive on my anchor in quite murky water where the bottom cannot be seen from the surface. With some help from the GPS I can usually pinpoint the position of the anchor to a few metres.

This is also very helpful, especially in light variable wind, when I can estimate if a boat new to the anchorage is dropping their anchor close to ours. Conflicts with boats swinging into other boats are rare, but the most common reason is when the two anchors are close together (and the scope is similar). In light wind the boats might start a reasonable distance from each other, but they will eventually become close.

Knowing the position of your anchor is sometimes useful.

I am one of those rare people who do not have a plotter!!!! I have been using a laptop with PC Plotter and a plug in GPS (Evermore GM R900) but since upgrading to Windows 10, I remain firmly based in Haslemere all the year round. (any ideas?). Using in the mean time Navionics on my Samsung S5 (waterproof) - which works very well in the context of simple med eyeball navigation - and yes it has a track so that could be even easier as its always on.

 

[noelex]

I am one of those rare people who do not have a plotter!!!! I have been using a laptop with PC Plotter and a plug in GPS (Evermore GM R900) but since upgrading to Windows 10, I remain firmly based in Haslemere all the year round. (any ideas?). Using in the mean time Navionics on my Samsung S5 (waterproof) - which works very well in the context of simple med eyeball navigation - and yes it has a track so that could be even easier as its always on.

Anything with a plotter function should work well so the PC or the Samsung should be fine. The trick is get the true anchor position (providing you have an anchor that sets quickly) is to displace the drop point by the distance (and direction) between the gps antennae and the bow.

This is easy to do, but difficult to explain. This diagram (assuming the antennae is near the stern) might help. The cross shows the correct anchor position:

 

[Chris_Robb]

Anything with a plotter function should work well so the PC or the Samsung should be fine. The trick is get the true anchor position (providing you have an anchor that sets quickly) is to displace the drop point by the distance (and direction) between the gps antennae and the bow.

This is easy to do, but difficult to explain. This diagram (assuming the antennae is near the stern) might help. The cross shows the correct anchor position:

Thanks. Useful overview

 

[TQA]

Gosh you guys are making this complicated. I know how much chain I have out say X.

Assuming we do not have a strong current and we do have a reasonable wind, for 360 days this is usual my bow is pointing at the anchor.

So the anchor is X distance off the bow inline with the boat.

 

[Chris_Robb]

Gosh you guys are making this complicated. I know how much chain I have out say X.

Assuming we do not have a strong current and we do have a reasonable wind, for 360 days this is usual my bow is pointing at the anchor.

So the anchor is X distance off the bow inline with the boat.

Just to remind you. I said Mediterranean. Your method would just not work here.

 

[GHA]

Anything with a plotter function should work well so the PC or the Samsung should be fine. The trick is get the true anchor position (providing you have an anchor that sets quickly) is to displace the drop point by the distance (and direction) between the gps antennae and the bow.

This is easy to do, but difficult to explain. This diagram (assuming the antennae is near the stern) might help. The cross shows the correct anchor position:

Excellent idea and dead easy on Opencpn, mouse on waypoint then just put distance and bearing into anchor Pro rather than going up to the bow and try to guess the chain length if there was no catinery, ta for sharing.

 

[nortada]

The way this thread is heading is this a bit of Fred Drift or intentional anchor drag?

 

[Chris_Robb]

The way this thread is heading is this a bit of Fred Drift or intentional anchor drag?

Unless it gets caught on some ground chain

 

[duncan99210]

Just to remind you. I said Mediterranean. Your method would just not work here.

Well, I sail in the Med and that's how I sort out where my anchor is. Minor variation is that I don't usually set the anchor alarm unless the winds getting up, so I'll know what direction the anchor lies in.

 

[BobnLesley]

Assuming we do not have a strong current and we do have a reasonable wind...my bow is pointing at the anchor. So the anchor is X distance off the bow inline with the boat.

Except for the Murican anchors: Not quite so prevalent here in the Caribbean as we found in their home waters, which apparently includes the Bahamas, but the North American boats do not like anyone 'sitting over my anchor'. We've come to realise that this actually translates into English as: 'Anywhere ahead of where I am'. I've now lost count of the number of times that we've heard an American skipper say that he's sitting to lets say 100' of rode, but is adamant that the spot into which the next boat settles, which might well be 200' and 45 degrees off his bow is apparently 'sitting over my anchor'. This problem's often exacerbated by their use Octopus-Anchors, which have a nasty habit of scuttling across the seabed: Thus when the original 'idiot' who was sitting on his anchor has moved elsewhere and another 'asshole' arrives and settles in 200'/45-degs off his opposite bow, the anchor is quite likely have moved there in the meanwhile, leading to another round of abuse.
Our record on a direct level was in Long Island Sound when a chap dinghied over (we'd been unable to understand his message, even when shouted) in 25-30 knot winds and pouring rain to advise us that we were sitting 'right on my anchor', our estimate was that we were around 60 degrees and 200-250' off his starboard bow!

 

[jordanbasset]

Invariably when I wake up in the morning in an anchorage in Greece when there is little or no wind I am right over my anchor, sometimes can actually see it from the boat.

 

[noelex]

Well, I sail in the Med and that's how I sort out where my anchor is. Minor variation is that I don't usually set the anchor alarm unless the winds getting up, so I'll know what direction the anchor lies in.

I think that knowing where your anchor is located is useful information, but I am a bit puzzled why this prevents you setting an anchor alarm. Occasionally anchor drags can occur in quite light wind and the anchor alarm serves as an extra crew member that is constantly checking on your position. This is good insurance.

Ideally the anchor alarm should be centred directly over the anchor and therefore will also give the distance and bearing to the anchor. This way, as the wind changes direction, the distance to the anchor stays constant. You can therefore set the alarm at only a slightly greater distance than the amount of rode you have out and the alarm will go off if the anchor moves, but not produce a false alarm even if the wind swings 180°.

There are some variations on the above. You can deliberately offset the alarm so that if wind changes direction significantly the alarm sounds even if the anchor is not dragging. This can sometimes be useful if, for example, there is another boat is lying at two anchors that presents a collision risk if a change in wind direction occurs. However, most of the time our anchor alarm is set to sound only if the anchor drags.

Unfortunately, some chart plotters only have an anchor alarm that can be activated from the current location, which is much less versatile. Sometimes there is a work around this problem, but many simply resort to a tablet, smartphone or PC which surprisingly often have better anchor alarms than the purpose designed marine chart plotters.

 

[RichardS]

Invariably when I wake up in the morning in an anchorage in Greece when there is little or no wind I am right over my anchor, sometimes can actually see it from the boat.

In Croatia when I get up in the morning the first thing I do is put the kettle on .... and the second thing is to pop outside and have a look at my anchor on the seabed. If I can't see it I'm disappointed but that has only happened a handful of times in the last 10 years.

Richard