adapting to getting older

Aaaaw, you young lads, still in your sixties worrying about the onset of decrepitude are making me depressed, if you are healthy you will be able to sail long after you have given up golf. I and my mate, Hugh, work taking boats through the canal, pushing lock gates, catching lines, opening and closing sluices, we are ten years older than you and twice the age of many of our customers but there are still plenty of sailors passing much older than us. Hugh has been doing it while recovering from prostate cancer, you have the choice to lie down or to carry on, which do you think is better for you?
 
Quandary said:
Aaaaw, you young lads, still in your sixties worrying about the onset of decrepitude are making me depressed, if you are healthy you will be able to sail long after you have given up golf. I and my mate, Hugh, work taking boats through the canal, pushing lock gates, catching lines, opening and closing sluices, we are ten years older than you and twice the age of many of our customers but there are still plenty of sailors passing much older than us. Hugh has been doing it while recovering from prostate cancer, you have the choice to lie down or to carry on, which do you think is better for you?
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Definitely. I wouldn't go quite so far as to say that growing old is just in the mind but, - well, actually I would. Barring truly unfortunate circumstances, you can do more or less what you want for as long as you want.
 
Just notched up 86, knees are somewhat problematic, as is using an inflatable to get to the mooring. Maybe I'll have to give up when I get old.
 
I'm no spring chicken, and I've found one of the best things is in-mast furling. I have to hoist the mainsail only once a year, and have easy and infinite control over its area, from the helm.
 
pvb said:
And now a more serious answer. I'm well in to my sixties, and a few years ago was getting increasingly frustrated by my boat, a lovely HR352. As it was 24 years old, it needed more and more maintenance and repairs, and I was finding it heavier and heavier to use. I decided to sell it, and bought a new AWB. Similar size (bit bigger actually), but it's a revelation. Everything seems much easier to use - a combination of being new, better technology, better design, smaller jib, better electronics. It has more headroom inside, a better heads/shower, and is much lighter and more spacious. It shouldn't need much serious maintenance for some time. I happily single-hand it most of the time. I appreciate this isn't a solution for everyone, but it works.
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Whenever I have toyed with this idea, the issue that has worried me has been "flightyness" associated with light weight / high windage. My first boat was a Hunter 26 which was for all the world like a big dinghy and would be unsuitable if I tried it now in my old age. I have sailed modern AWBs from the likes of Benny and have always found that they require quicker reactions and actions to keep the situation under control. Thats one thing I really like about the Starlight - low freeboard, barn door rudder and deep lead keel mean that she is bulletproof in that respect.

So how have you found this issue changing over from a heavy and fairly old fashioned 352?
 
birdseye said:
Whenever I have toyed with this idea, the issue that has worried me has been "flightyness" associated with light weight / high windage. My first boat was a Hunter 26 which was for all the world like a big dinghy and would be unsuitable if I tried it now in my old age. I have sailed modern AWBs from the likes of Benny and have always found that they require quicker reactions and actions to keep the situation under control. Thats one thing I really like about the Starlight - low freeboard, barn door rudder and deep lead keel mean that she is bulletproof in that respect.

So how have you found this issue changing over from a heavy and fairly old fashioned 352?
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Well, there's more windage with a modern boat, so I specified a bowthruster. The perception of AWBs being "light weight" is mainly incorrect; my Bavaria 37 is heavier than the HR352, and she feels reassuringly well-made and stable. In terms of manoeuvrability, modern fin-keelers are much more nimble than older long-keel designs, so marina berthing is easier, although the saildrive doesn't give as much propwalk as a conventional shaft drive. The HR352's hull design meant that it eased itself into waves fairly gently, whereas a flatter-bottomed AWB can slam in some conditions, but again I've been surprised how little water comes over the deck on the new boat and usually sail with the sprayhood down. I miss the centre cockpit of the HR352; it made single-handed berthing easier and psychologically seemed more protected and safer. Although I had in-mast furling on the 352, the newer in-mast furling on the Bavaria works so much more easily. Inside the boat, there's a world of difference - the HR352 is fairly cramped, with poor headroom in the cabins, whereas the new boat is cavernous with great headroom and is so light and airy inside. Best of all, it doesn't have a teak deck!
 
You're spoiling my dream. I really fancy downsizing to a Pogo 30 in a year or two when I can't sail my HR34 any more. I've not sailed one, but after looking at one we were berthed alongside, it looks very light and easy, and should see me into my 80s enjoyably, and it would only take me a few hours to get to the other side too.
 
johnalison said:
I don't like that idea. For many of us, an important component of sailing pleasure is the feeling of driving the boat at its best, and making passages efficiently. Particularly with fractional rigs, a reefed main will take a lot of power away, and one result is an uncomfortable wallowing motion. With reefing lines to the cockpit, and an autopilot to assist, reefing is something I am happy to put off until it is absolutely necessary, and it only takes a minute or so to do. In fact, unreefing I find harder. My attitude is partly affected by the fact that I only have two reefs, both deeper than the first two on a three reef system.
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A trip to the sail maker for a three reef system might be in order? And fit the needed lines and blocks etc
 
birdseye said:
Whenever I have toyed with this idea, the issue that has worried me has been "flightyness" associated with light weight / high windage. My first boat was a Hunter 26 which was for all the world like a big dinghy and would be unsuitable if I tried it now in my old age. I have sailed modern AWBs from the likes of Benny and have always found that they require quicker reactions and actions to keep the situation under control. Thats one thing I really like about the Starlight - low freeboard, barn door rudder and deep lead keel mean that she is bulletproof in that respect.

So how have you found this issue changing over from a heavy and fairly old fashioned 352?
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Agree with pvb. My Bav 33 displaces 5.5 tons - not much less than your boat, and his 37 is over 7 tons. like him I specified a bow thruster and the larger engine. The boat is very solid and stable, plus very easy to handle. Much better than my 2 generations earlier 37 in all respects. Not once have I felt lack of control when single handed.

While you can generalise about the characteristics of AWBs they are not all the same and the latest designs are much better - and nothing like your experience with your Hunter.

As it happens on one of my trips across Poole Bay in 10-12 knots on a reach I level pegged a Starlight 35 for over 10 miles. He was about a half mile to seaward of me and we arrived at Hurst about 50m apart!
 
Why does one need a bow thruster on a 33' fin keeled yacht, it is a serious question. Where our berth is at Crinan the canal is less than two boat lengths wide and we need to do a 180 turn, often into a fresh westerly wind, we slow up, put the helm over give her a burst and just spin her round her keel, she rotates without hardly moving. The keel just acts as a fulcrum, similarly berthing alongside in a one boat length gap we just pointed her in to the middle of it and rotate the bow through 90 degrees as it reaches the landing, the keel carries on to stop alongside. Does the keel have to be lead and with a heavy bulb for this to work. The Sigma 38 we had berthed the same way, on it the keel was a 'Mickey Mouse ear with lead only in the bottom half.
I am interested in the answer as we are contemplating an older design, still fin keel but with an old fashioned iron wedge rather than a lead bulb, bit like our Sigma 33 which always seemed to turn freely.
 
Quandary said:
Why does one need a bow thruster on a 33' fin keeled yacht, it is a serious question.
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Suggest you come down south and I will show you why. Our club marina is very congested and my old 37' was just under the maximum permitted, but the 10 berths that are really big enough are all occupied by even older members than myself. The distance between boats is much less than 2 boat lengths as you described.

The biggest constraint to using the 37 was getting it in and out of the berth on my own. So when downsizing (a bit!) a top priority was ease of berthing as I sail on my own almost all the time. So the combination of the shorter overall length, no ends, and a bow thruster mean I can berth on my own in all conditions with real precision. A boat is no good if you are scared of taking it out! Fortunately our berths are orientated E/W and I berth stern first with the finger to north, so the wind is usually ahead or astern, and mostly with a bit of south. So I come down the alley, stop the boat with a bit of reverse on, turn it through 90 degrees with the wheel and the thruster so the bow is almost touching the sterns of the boats opposite, and back in until I touch the pontoon, pick up a stern line, then walk round the boat picking up all the other lines from the pontoon. If the wind does catch the bow while I am doing this a quick burst of thruster with the remote round my neck and it obediently gets into line. Totally stress free.

There is no downside to having one fitted (other than the hit on the wallet) and for me it makes the difference. Might not be the same for others, but as I said earlier in this thread, it is important to look at what the constraints to sailing are as you get older and less agile and configure your boat accordingly. Maybe accept that you have to give up some of the things that appealed in the past (perhaps like the powerful boat the OP has) and look to keeping the bits that make sailing a worthwhile activity.

BTW both my neighbours ( Freedom 35 and Southerly 110) have bow thrusters.
 
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PabloPicasso said:
A trip to the sail maker for a three reef system might be in order? And fit the needed lines and blocks etc
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Quite unnecessary. I have only used the first reef a few times in recent years, and the second barely ever in the last fifteen. A sound boat that will go to windward in 24kn apparent under full sail means that I simply don't need a boat prepared for ocean voyaging. It is probably true that we go to sea in windy conditions less than when we were younger, but we're not afraid of a following F6. Modern forecasts have made it that much easier to avoid conditions that we would occasionally encounter years ago. Nevertheless, we have made it to N Brittany and Poland in the last two or three years but just been a bit cannier about it. We can manage the boat well enough, but the increased risk of injury at our ages makes a little caution worthwhile.
 
Tranona said:
As it happens on one of my trips across Poole Bay in 10-12 knots on a reach I level pegged a Starlight 35 for over 10 miles. He was about a half mile to seaward of me and we arrived at Hurst about 50m apart!
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Starlight 35 has shorter LWL, displaces more, but carries a whole 2m**2 more sail area than your boat. Maybe he didn't realise you were racing?
 
Re Quandary's point about a bow thruster, one thing I have noticed moving from a shaft drive to a sail drive is that the shaft drive was much better for sharp turns in tight spaces - as the prop was so much closer to the rudder.
For most of us a bow thruster is a pricey luxury - and a retractable one even more so - but isn't a saily boat the definition of expensive luxury anyway :-)
PS On reflection almost everything is better with a shaft drive than a sail drive, except for finding a decent modern boat that still fits them
 
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