Lysander Gunter rig.

[tonyart]

Hi, I have bought a fully restored Lysander sailing boat, I am new to sailing and already done part of my RYA course.
The boat I have was not rigged up when I bought it, also the person I bought it from just restored it during lockdown. I am a practical person and can usually work things out on how they go, but I don't have a picture or didn't have a visual picture on how to rig the sails, I have tried looking on websites for pictures and ideas on how its rigged up, but so far came up with nothing.
Does any one know or do they have a gunter rig setup, they can send me some pictures of?

I spent the morning figuring out how to assemble it, managed to get it 70% assembled, but got stuck on where the ropes and pullies attach, I used the knowledge I got from my course so that helped a bit.
I have guessed where the ropes should go, but cant figure out the attachments and pullies.
Thanks for any help.

 

[Tranona]

Welcome to the forum. This will give you a good start lysander.org.uk/wp/?page_id=26 Expect fellow owners will be very helpful, although looking at some of the photos you may be able to solve your problem yourself. when you have done it you will find it is fairly straightforward, but not easy to describe without being able to point at the relevant bits.

Good luck. Sound little boat.

 

[tonyart]

Thanks for the link, I have tried those photos but cant get a good view of the rope rigging, dont know if im missing something on their website, but cant find contact details or forums.
yes I didnt find it too difficult on the basic setup, took me a couple of hrs, just stuck on the rope rigging lol

 

[DownWest]

The Mirror dinghys are mostly gunter rigged, another source of photos. Some of it depends on how it is reefed. A single halyard attached to the yard at different points or possibly two halyards. My gunter has a single halyard attached to the jaws at the mast (the forked end of the yard) and a line that goes round the mast to hold the yard to it just under the shrouds, but I suspect that is not how yours works.

Having looked at Tranona's link, it appears to be a single halyard attached to the reinforced point on the yard.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

On a Heron, there's a single halliard running to (approximately) the centre of the gaff. I suspect the Lysander will be the same as it's such a small rig, but alternatively, there might be a throat halliard to the gaff jaws and a peak halliard to a point along the gaff. In that case, you hoist the throat halliard first until the luff is tight, then the peak halliard to shape the sail.

 

[Sybarite]

Hi, I have bought a fully restored Lysander sailing boat, I am new to sailing and already done part of my RYA course.
The boat I have was not rigged up when I bought it, also the person I bought it from just restored it during lockdown. I am a practical person and can usually work things out on how they go, but I don't have a picture or didn't have a visual picture on how to rig the sails, I have tried looking on websites for pictures and ideas on how its rigged up, but so far came up with nothing.
Does any one know or do they have a gunter rig setup, they can send me some pictures of?

I spent the morning figuring out how to assemble it, managed to get it 70% assembled, but got stuck on where the ropes and pullies attach, I used the knowledge I got from my course so that helped a bit.
I have guessed where the ropes should go, but cant figure out the attachments and pullies.
Thanks for any help.

I first started sailing on a gunter-rigged Lysander more than 50 years ago. Great little sea-boat.

Mine was a fairly simple rig : the main halliard was attached (iirc) to the gaff (?) spar and hauled up so that this spar was as nearly vertical as possible. It had a groove into which the mainsail bolt rope was slid. Then a line was threaded though the cringles in the sail and then around the mainmast. It lifted more easily if the threading was was brought back to the same side of the mast (and so on alternately) rather than trying to thread it in a spiral. Difficult to describe but hope you understand.

Mine used blue Enterprise dinghy sails.

 

[tonyart]

20211010_120114.jpg

Don't know if you can view the picture. This is what I have done so far. Rigging the mast,boom & gaf assembled also attached the sail to the boom and gaf. This was fairly straight forward. At this point it's more complex I can't figure out how the gaf attaches to the mast. The ropes seem self explanatory as they seem to only fit specific pullies as either too thick to run though. I have found what I belive is the mail halyard one end is attached to 3 pullies these fix somewhere to the mast and gaf.

 

[tonyart]

I first started sailing on a gunter-rigged Lysander more than 50 years ago. Great little sea-boat.

Mine was a fairly simple rig : the main halliard was attached (iirc) to the gaff (?) spar and hauled up so that this spar was as nearly vertical as possible. It had a groove into which the mainsail bolt rope was slid. Then a line was threaded though the cringles in the sail and then around the mainmast. It lifted more easily if the threading was was brought back to the same side of the mast (and so on alternately) rather than trying to thread it in a spiral. Difficult to describe but hope you understand.

Mine used blue Enterprise dinghy sails.

Yes thanks, I had this set up with the gaf almost vertically up and the sail fits nicely. Can't figure out the hilliard lol

 

[tillergirl]

I have a complete unused set of plans. What do you actually need?

 

[Sybarite]

Yes thanks, I had this set up with the gaf almost vertically up and the sail fits nicely. Can't figure out the hilliard lol

The halliard should attach somewhere near the middle of the gaff so that it is hauled upward as far as possible.

 

[tonyart]

I have a complete unused set of plans. What do you actually need?

Thanks, I just need to know how the rigging is fixed inc pullies and ropes. I figured how the mast,gaff,sails and boom fit.

 

[tonyart]

The halliard should attach somewhere near the middle of the gaff so that it is hauled upward as far as possible.

Thats what I thought. Around the middle of the gaf is a 2 foot long bulge in the gaf also a hole in this part. The top of the mast has 2 holes above the slot with the pully, also at the tip is a vertical down hole about a foot deep for what looks like a threaded bar. Next weekend I'll get some proper pictures of it. Should make it look and should clearer.

 

[DownWest]

From your pic:
The halyard is the thicker rope and should just go through the slot & pulley in the mast and be tied to the gaff/yard. The skinny bit of line is for lacing the lower part of the sail to the mast, as Syberite discribes. There should be a pulley off the front top of the mast for the jib halyard, possibly attached to one of the holes with a bit of rope or wire(?)
The bulge in the gaff/yard is to re-inforce it. Is there another hole further up to to allow for reefing? It will be the same distance away from the first as the horizontal row of eyelets in the lower part of the sail.
The rope and pulleys top left might be the mainsheet?

There is always the possibility that the restorer did some non standard stuff. The wire shroud to the right of the mast has some odd swages at the bottom. (If it is a shroud)

 

[tonyart]

The wires showing in picture with swages are the mast supporting cables that attach to the bow of the boat also used for the jib, the other 2 cables are for fixing the mast to the port and stbrd side of the boat. I just left them there so I had a reference point I could work off when assembling on the floor.

Yes there is a smaller pully slightly above the halyard pully for the jib,

I am probably over thinking the jib, as described by other posts the main rigging is complete. Thinking about it now and from comments, this is confusing from pictures of the same rig set up.

From a photo there is a line running from the center of the gaff to the end of the gaf, another rope is fixed to that line to the mast. But pic doesn't show how. I'm guessing now that's the halyard.

My gaf has the reinforced center part and a 8mm hole is near the center of that, I'm guessing that's the reinforcement to carry the weight if the gaf and the taught sail. From the halyard.

From what I can see the main parts are complete, but as it was fully derigged I have 3 spare pullies attached to the halyard, I'm guessing these fit somewhere on the base of the mast and up the mast. Also guessing from the boat setup I been using the 3 extra pullies should aid lifting the gaf and sail up the mast with little effort?

I also have 2 loose pullies, I'm guessing they are for rigging the boom.

 

[DownWest]

Since it is a fairly small rig, I doubt you need other than the halyard direct to the gaff/yard, not multiple purchase. From your third paragraph, there might be a line called a 'span' tight along the gaff and the end of the halyard has a pulley on this, so the gaff can slide down to reef.
The extra pulleys might be to lead the halyards aft from the base of the mast, onto the coachroof, so you can reach them from the cockpit, are there any cleats at the back of the coachroof?

 

[tonyart]

Not directly on the roof, there are some guide runners running along side the lower part of the coachroof (window level) and there are a few cleats and rope grippers on the cabin door walls also on the inner sides of the main deck. I'll get some pictures of the boat layout also better ones of the rigging, should.make it look clearer.

 

[Romeo]

Pretty difficult to know what you need to know without pics. Whereabouts are you..... getting someone there in person is by far the best way.

I have 2 gunter rigged boats. Both have two halyards for the main, throat and peak. The throat halyard is fixed close to the jaws of the gaff. On one boat the peak halyard goes to a wire strop that runs along the length of the gaff. This holds the yard at the correct angle even when one or two reefs are put in the main. On the other boat in order to reef I need to lower the sail and change the fixed point about half way along the gaff to which the peak halyard is attached. Both halyards run from the gaff to sheaves set into the top of the mast. The mast sheave for the peak halyard is of course above the sheave for the throat halyard.

On one boat there is a 2:1 pulley system on the halyard to bring it down to the deck. On the other boat it is a direct line. When it comes on to the cleats, peak is to port, or rather further to port than the throat on my boats.

 

[tonyart]

Thanks for replying, I live spalding Lincolnshire.

I have some extra info from someone with the same boat, he's explained on how he rigs his. Though no 2 boats are the same.
From what I gather, I need 2 pullies at the top of the main mast, also there is a center mounted pully fitted into the mast, so 3 pullies in total. The center pully connects to the jaw of the gaf with the main halyard.

My gaf doesn't have a slider. There is a hole in the reinforced section, and from what I gather the 2nd halyard ties off that hole and though the side pully at the top mast. The 3rd top pully is for the jib sail.
This is what I understand from the instructions given.

Atm my mast only has 1 pully mounted on the side instead of 2. It is possible when prev sailed it could have just had 1 halyard to lif the gaf into position.

In the bag with the sails had all the ropes, attached to the main halyard are 3 pullies, also 2 loose pullies 1 large and one small.
Also I have 1 rope that in the center its looped and sowen with a nylon eye inthe loop.

As you say and I said its very difficult to see how it all goes together with out pictures or other visual idea of how it should go.


With the instructions I've been given I'm having a go at assembling the rigging this weekend and I'll get some close up pictures and video of the rigging etc.

 

[tonyart]

Hi, spent 3hrs assembling the rigging and succeeded. the early afternoon wind didn't help and with the boat facing the wrong way lol.
Had to attach a pully to the sidestay, as the bolt for the centre and side pully wasn't long enough to add a 3rd pully, the jib is quite small so shouldn't be a problem.
Im missing a few items, need a kicker pin, wasn't with the gear I had, also need some better pullies and extra sheets for reefing.

added pics here Items Shared on 10-17-2021

I couldnt fully lift the main and gaf due to wind

 

[Romeo]

Hi, spent 3hrs assembling the rigging and succeeded. the early afternoon wind didn't help and with the boat facing the wrong way lol.
Had to attach a pully to the sidestay, as the bolt for the centre and side pully wasn't long enough to add a 3rd pully, the jib is quite small so shouldn't be a problem.
Im missing a few items, need a kicker pin, wasn't with the gear I had, also need some better pullies and extra sheets for reefing.

added pics here Items Shared on 10-17-2021

I couldnt fully lift the main and gaf due to wind

So much going on there. Would really like to be there to help you,, but we can't (unless anyone on here lives near Spalding.

So firstly, the turning blocks that the halyards run through, only need to have one wee wheel in them, not two. The ones that you are using might be intended for the mainsheet. If you don't have others you can use these ones.... but ignore the smaller of the two wheels so that there is a straight turn.

All the halyards, once they go through the blocks on the tabernacle, should lead back to the jamming cleats on the coachhouse roof. You have the jib halyard going forward first (although I appreciate you might just have done that to keep it out the way.

It does look like you have a peak and a throat halyard. I appreciate that you were not able to tighten them up fully because the boat was on a trailer and pointing the wrong way for the wind.

The red line that you are using for lacing the mainsail to the mast is a bit of a disgrace. Might we worth leaving the lacing till you get the basics set up. When you do, look up a you tube video on how to lace the sail to the mast.

The tack on the mainsail should be tied onto the boom (or is there in fact a pin that goes through it?), not tied up to the mast. The bigger cringle between boom and gaff jaws is for a reef... no need to run the lacing through it. Ignore the reef for now until you get the rest set up to your satisfaction. Try to keep it as simple as possible to start with.

That'll do for now. Hope you are having fun with it, and do not think that any of the above is meant as criticism! Just trying to help.