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westhinder

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It mentions Starlight 35, very scarce data, some of it incorrect, does not mention Starlight 39 at all, but does mention Starlight 46, of which just a couple were built, with some running rigging sizes as the only detail.
Disappointing, to say the least.
 

justanothersailboat

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Well that (edited to add: original site, not anything mentioned later) was off target. Apparently my boat has half a metre more keel than it really does, is suitable for ocean races, is "spacy", and I've been carrying running rigging three to four times longer than it predicts I need.

Hope nobody orders sheets based on this.
 
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jwilson

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I use yours and do find it useful but can I point out you have no Seawolf 26 or 30 information? You have the Dehler 36cws but not the 37cws nor the 37.
I'd be delighted to add Dehler 37 and 37CWS if anyone wants to list them on our brokerage. The Seawolf 26 and 30 are more difficult, as their values are now generally below the level at which we would take them on brokerage. The source of the photos and details are from boats we have sold.
 

lustyd

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Yes, but I think the stub is really more of an invitation to submit text, hoping someone will take on the task.
The vast majority of stubs on there come from someone inserting a link to a page that doesn't yet exist. It's quite normal to link to something that needs more explanation but would not be appropriate to explain on the current topic (quite the opposite of forums!). The author may not always be an authority on the other subjects, so they leave them for others to eventually complete.
 

dgadee

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We only take boats on brokearge if we can photograph them ourselves, so proably 98% are our own photos. A very few photos are "owners photos", with their permission.
That explains the quality of image. Self advertised boats usually have the worst images imaginable.
 

Snowgoose-1

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Well that (edited to add: original site, not anything mentioned later) was off target. Apparently my boat has half a metre more keel than it really does, is suitable for ocean races, is "spacy", and I've been carrying running rigging three to four times longer than it predicts I need.

Hope nobody orders sheets based on this.
Just shows that the Internet is still the Wild West in many ways. Will be sending a pic to them and an amendment anyways.
 

justanothersailboat

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I've sent corrections to another site (better than the one that started this thread) and not seen them acted on or responded to... asking the AI-generated terrible one to correct seems a waste of time.

I look forward to it being scraped for inclusion of the next generation of AI tools, causing them to generate further nonsense, which will then be scraped...

Yachtsnet is much better, a seriously valuable resource. Thanks for that.
 

andsarkit

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I wondered about copyright in the images you used.
Yachtdatabase are claiming copyright on all the images and data they have taken from other sources!

"The copyright to all contents of this site belongs to YachtDatabase.com. You may view the pages of this site and print data for personal use and information. Systematic download of information is not allowed. Copying or reproduction of any part of the site to other sites or using the information of this site in any edited form for commercial use, including use of YachtDatabase.com’s name or domain names, is only allowed with written permission."
 

dgadee

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Yachtdatabase are claiming copyright on all the images and data they have taken from other sources!

"The copyright to all contents of this site belongs to YachtDatabase.com. You may view the pages of this site and print data for personal use and information. Systematic download of information is not allowed. Copying or reproduction of any part of the site to other sites or using the information of this site in any edited form for commercial use, including use of YachtDatabase.com’s name or domain names, is only allowed with written permission."
Well, what's wrong with that? The photographer will have the copyright on images they take unless they have passed on the copyright or even if someone is given permission for re-use. JWilson says other images are there with permission.

The other text on the site and formatting is also covered by copyright.

I thought the view that you can scrape images from websites for free was in the distant past (unless you are Google).

My problem with copyright is length of term. 70 years after death! If it was much shorter it would enable a richer public information sphere.
 

justanothersailboat

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Well, what's wrong with that? The photographer will have the copyright on images they take unless they have passed on the copyright or even if someone is given permission for re-use. JWilson says other images are there with permission.
It's not JWilson who's scraping images without permission and claiming ownership... it's the far less useful site with all the AI-generated dodgy data.
 

jwilson

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Yachtdatabase are claiming copyright on all the images and data they have taken from other sources!

"The copyright to all contents of this site belongs to YachtDatabase.com. You may view the pages of this site and print data for personal use and information. Systematic download of information is not allowed. Copying or reproduction of any part of the site to other sites or using the information of this site in any edited form for commercial use, including use of YachtDatabase.com’s name or domain names, is only allowed with written permission."
If Yachtdatabase have "scraped" (which I believe is the current term) material from other places they clearly don't hold the copyright. The web has made copyright a bit of a minefield. I actually WRITE the descriptions of boat designs on Yachtsnet, but again and again I find my exact words are then used by dozens of other lazier sellers (including other brokers) to advertise similar boats.

When they pinch the photos as well and I spot it I complain, and politely suggest they remove them or pay me a fee. One broker actually told me that as the pictures were online they were public property. I (again politely) told him I would see him in court, and face quite high costs as he would very definitely lose, as I had the high-res originals with metadata showing the date, time, and camera and lens used, plus a hidden text copyright marker. As he took down the pictures (which he had cropped to remove our little visible marker) I assume he spoke to someone who knew the law.
 

AntarcticPilot

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It's unfortunate that there are no low cost remedies to copyright infringement.
When I attended a seminar on copyright given by corporate lawyers they showed a little "truth table" with columns for various actors, including lawyers. The likely outcome for each actor was shown by smiley or frowning faces. Oddly, the only column that was entirely smiley was the lawyers!

It's worth bearing in mind that any damages awarded by a civil court would be based on the loss to the copyright holder. Unless there was a clear commercial loss of revenue (as for example, a professional photographer might incur from loss of royalties) the damages awarded might be very low, or even nominal.
 

dgadee

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When I attended a seminar on copyright given by corporate lawyers they showed a little "truth table" with columns for various actors, including lawyers. The likely outcome for each actor was shown by smiley or frowning faces. Oddly, the only column that was entirely smiley was the lawyers!

It's worth bearing in mind that any damages awarded by a civil court would be based on the loss to the copyright holder. Unless there was a clear commercial loss of revenue (as for example, a professional photographer might incur from loss of royalties) the damages awarded might be very low, or even nominal.
True (particularly the lawyers' fees) but it would be useful if there was also the availability of stopping the infringement. The small claims procedure was initiated to suit the needs of business who wanted to deal with small debts, not with the needs of the public, so it is purely money oriented. We really do need access to justice in the UK - not with fees of £1,000 an hour.
 
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