LittleSister
Well-known member
Until relatively recently (historically speaking) mariners had none of those things!
But they weren't crossing oceans to pass the time in those days.
Wot! No GPS....?
- Thread starter zoidberg
- Start date
Until relatively recently (historically speaking) mariners had none of those things!
But they weren't crossing oceans to pass the time in those days.
Bajansailor
Well-known member
I have a wonderful Canadian friend who is now about 80, and still sailing - he and his girlfriend (they are still together now) crossed the Atlantic in the mid 70's in a leaky wooden Hillyard from the Canaries to Barbados.
Arnold was an accomplished ham radio operator (he could converse in CW at staccato speeds) but doing the maths for calculating a sun sight totally foxed him.
So he would take his sights each day, relay the info to the then net controller (Bill CN8CW in Morocco, on the Transatlantic Maritime Mobile Net) who would then calculate Arnold's position and tell Arnold the course to steer for Barbados - and they arrived here successfully.
Arnold was an accomplished ham radio operator (he could converse in CW at staccato speeds) but doing the maths for calculating a sun sight totally foxed him.
So he would take his sights each day, relay the info to the then net controller (Bill CN8CW in Morocco, on the Transatlantic Maritime Mobile Net) who would then calculate Arnold's position and tell Arnold the course to steer for Barbados - and they arrived here successfully.
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Wansworth
Well-known member
Well the sun rises in the East sets in the west,helpful pointer with simple matches boatspeed can be approximated,diary of days passed,when approaching area of possible land either check sounding s,ask a passing fisher man spot land based lights.....and remember Columbus found America when it wasn’t there?
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john_morris_uk
Well-known member
We are that sad boat with all of these things. Not sure what this means. Perhaps it’s a sign of my age and how when I started sailing navigation was by compass and walker log. You spent a lot of time at sea not 100% sure where you were... A good fix was a wonderful thing.
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mjcoon
Well-known member
"found" or "founded" or stumbled-upon?
zoidberg
Well-known member
Current thinking is that Columbus was well aware that 'America' was there, for he had access to fragments of much earlier charts or 'rutters' dating from the Viking era centuries before..... but those around him in C15th Spain and Portugal were largely ignorant of such seafarers' lore.
Among more recent research is the book 'Columbus' by prolific writer/investigative journalist John Dyson, until lately a regular contributor here under the name of 'Pugwash' and with whom I regularly sailed in his Holman ketch, who retraced Columbus' first voyage using extracts from his ancient logbook and journal in a very similar vessel - and with a crew of young Portuguese. His conclusions, in the book, make startling reading.
cherod
N/A
So long ad you are not looking to land on some small remote island then ( as someone has said ) the sun rises somewhere and sets somewhere else in the almost same place with monotonous regularity so Long as you know which one is which and which direction you originally wanted to go then eventually you will find land , then you can ask someone “ where am i “ ,, easy ??
GHA
Well-known member
Most boats sailing across an ocean these days must have double figures gps receivers on board, the chances of losing the lot must be close to zero. Much better to worry about things that might actually happen..
What are the most common repairs at sea for yachts sailing across the Atlantic? ARC survey results tell all - Yachting World
Robin
Well-known member
I had them all but then the electronics crept in, seafarer echosounder, Seafix RDF, then Decca, GPS, dGPS, Yeoman plotter, electronic plotters with electronic charts, OpenCPN on a laptop(still have) plus now we travel far less, a Raymarine Axiom MFD which shows radar and AIS separately or overlaid on chart display, all repeated wirelessly to an Android notebook at lower helm. We do have 3 GPS transducers, but not a single paper chart other than in pilot books. Smartphones and 2 notebooks all have GPS built in and 2 of the 4 have apps that display lat/long, with/without stored charts. Sold my sextant and tables to forumites and my Casio scientific calculator, that did celestiial solutions far quicker than me, went tits up long since. Whilst we have 2 compasses plus binos with compass, we have a better electronic one
Oh and in relation to another thread, oilies these days are for going to shoreside loos in rain too hard for the brollies, which naturally are wind resistant specials, and in my case double as occasional walking aids being less 'conspic' than sticks or canes.
john_morris_uk
Well-known member
We have large plotter with radar overlay facility (except I’ve stuck with the ancient Raytheon R20x while its still working as it’s so good) there are three GPS’s on board but we still carry paper charts and tables. Most nav is done electronically, but with plans to cross oceans very soon, I’m old fashioned enough to still carry the stuff that doesn’t need batteries. Most likely I’ll never need it, but I’ve sailed across oceans and they’re big places to suddenly find yourself without power and wondering where you are.
newtothis
Well-known member
A former colleague was a ship master in the 1960s. When coming across the Indian Ocean, with constant cloud cover, the sailing directions were: head west until Africa is sighted, then turn starboard for Suez. Crude but effective.
GHA
Well-known member
An old mobile phone in a tin box could probably get you well round the world on a single charge turning on for a moment once a day to get a lat n long. Sextants are great fun but there are things to worry about on a boat that might actually happen...
Mark-1
Well-known member
Too right. ...and in the week when Marvin Creamer died we shouldn't forget that.
We can all find the North Star, measure the angle with some kind of heath robinson 'angle measurer' on the night the GPS failed so we'd know a baseline Latitude. (If we're in the Northern Hemisphere.) Pick a rough latitude that doesn't have any hidden nasties and a nice densely populated area to arrive at. Sail down that. Keep a lookout to make sure we don't bump into anything. Watch out for when there's a lot of birds around.
If people don't like any of that just pick another set of methods, there's no shortage.
People sail in ice, when there's no way to know where they are relative to the lumps. (and did before radar)
...and that assumes you don't have mobile phones, fitness watches or any of the other vast array of every day items that give position .
zoidberg
Well-known member
One can have all the clever e-devices that marketing wonks can dream up, all duplicated, providing a wealth of near-precision information to the owner, and still make crap decisions with it.... 'cos that capability hasn't kept pace.
It seems to me that the more high-grade nav data is provided, the less thinking about options goes on. There's a lot of abdication to the instruments....
It seems to me that the more high-grade nav data is provided, the less thinking about options goes on. There's a lot of abdication to the instruments....
Neeves
Well-known member
It is nice to know that we are all comfortable and well prepared.
Jonathan
apologies - but Zoidberg beat me to it.
Jonathan
apologies - but Zoidberg beat me to it.
mjcoon
Well-known member
Perhaps one of those wind-up radios intended for use away from civilisation could be plundered to become a wind-up GPS...An old mobile phone in a tin box could probably get you well round the world on a single charge turning on for a moment once a day to get a lat n long. Sextants are great fun but there are things to worry about on a boat that might actually happen...
Sandy
Well-known member
How people navigated without knowing to the nearest 0.05 of a millimetre where they were is something that surprises a lot of modern sailors.
I was at a Royal Institute of Navigation event about GPS and asked the question, "Can you be confident that the charts are correct, as some of them were last surveyed in 1870?", there was a confused response from the speaker.
I was at a Royal Institute of Navigation event about GPS and asked the question, "Can you be confident that the charts are correct, as some of them were last surveyed in 1870?", there was a confused response from the speaker.
zoidberg
Well-known member
Not all the speakers at RIN events are confused.
A fair few of them - and of those usually lurking at the back of the room - are highly accomplished navigation specialists. There are, of course, boffins galore.
A fair few of them - and of those usually lurking at the back of the room - are highly accomplished navigation specialists. There are, of course, boffins galore.
capnsensible
Well-known member
Some ocean sailors can do Astro. Most can't. It doesn't really matter either way. But if you are gonna spend the whole passage worrying about what might go wrong (coz as you know, something always does) probably best to stay at home.
GHA
Well-known member
No point worrying on passage, too late. Bad things happen because of what you did or didn't do before leaving..
(like have a boat which can function just fine when all the linked together toys go grumpy..)
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