Wonky keel?

[Balbas]

I've bought a boat. My first big boat. Its an old Westerly longbow. Its been sat on the hard for a few years and frankly isn't propped very well. I've had it surveyed, which picked up a few minor issues, which I've already fixed.

Working on the boat yesterday the wife commented that 'the keel's not straight'. Sure enough it looks to be wonky - not by much, but... It might be the position of the props. It might be that she's not quite upright. It might be that its an optical illusion. Or it might be that the keel *is* wonky (albeit by a pretty tiny amount).

The surveyor didn't comment on it, indeed he did comment 'well the keel won't be falling off, that's for sure' when looking at the keel bolts. There is a line of rust where the iron keel attaches to the hull, but I put this down to dissimilar materials reacting to temperature variation - and when I asked the surveyor he dismissed it.

So I guess my questions are:-
1) How good was the Westerly build process in the 70's?
2) Assuming the keel isn't going to fall off, is it all likely to move back into alignment in the water?
3) Should I be worried or just accept that it might sail better on one tack than the other?

 

[john_morris_uk]

The keel on my Westerly doesn’t sit quite perfectly on the stub moulding on the hull. I was fortunate inasmuch as our surveyor worked for the local Westetly Agent and he remembered that they all looked like that from new. Whoever made the template for drilling the holes for the keel attachment didn’t get it quite right and all Westerly Sealord keels are bolted on slightly squiffy.

Don’t know about Longbows though and it sounds as though your squiffyness is in a different manner/direction. Ask on the WOA forum? Do some measuring?

 

[anoccasionalyachtsman]

Take a stroll round any boatyard in winter and you'll see plenty. If you have exceptional eyesight you'll also see assymetric hulls and superstructures. It's one of the reasons that boats are faster on one tack, and shows that there isn't just one 'vertical' to point your mast at. Rife until machine made mould tools came along, and as John M says, getting the template for lined up is tricky when the boat isn't straight either.

 

[sailaboutvic]

You could ask the surveyor to take another look , after all you did pay him to do a job , although I doubt if he going to say now , oh I missed that , but he will at less put your mind to rest .
If your in a good working yard you also could ask the yard to take a look .

 

[Akestor]

I have a longbow Ketch from 1972 ( with number 0032) since October 2017 and done tones of work so far...and still do!

I also noticed that the keel was not perfectly alligned to the hull ( i cant recall the word for the thinner area of the hull where the keel attaches ) towards the stern at the end of the keel where is thin. I just made straight the anomaly with epoxy putty. The difference at the end was about 0.5-06 cm and could easily be seen when looking behind the prop shaft. A friend and experienced repairman told that its just an imperfection but nothing to worry about.
The boat is back in the water for some months now and everything is good.
But i agree that you should ask more people around the yard to have a look.

Once you are at the yard you can fill your bildge with water and see the next day if you have any leak from the outside at the keel/hull joint.

I also broke some of the polyester caps that cover the keel nuts to check for corrosion and i was lucky to find shiny steel. I think polyester caps do more harm because they crack and not seal the bolts, just trap bildge water inside.

I am also mentioning some more things that may have been miss by the surveyor.

-Check your rudder for play , front-back and left-right. Its now good opportunity to change bearings if you have play.
-Check the skeg. I would suggest undoing 1 of the screws that hold it in place and see the condition. Is it corroded?
On my boat they are 10 machine screws (M5) that hold in place , NOT getting through the hull ,just in. I replaced them all (most were corroded) and to my surprise i discovered that one of the holes was getting though the hull which i fiberglassed.

They are good boats and the hulls are top quality. She also sails very well, we got smooth 6-6.5 knots at beam reach with 11-15 knots wind.

Do you see the serial number on the entance hatch? You have the Lloyds certificate? Juat wondering which hull number you are!

PS
Just saw there is another thread for numbers. I have 2 wooden plates with numbers and letters inside the first closet across the toilet door.

 

[Balbas]

Just re-reading the survey report which contains:

With the yacht sighted from a distance her hull moulding was visually true and fair, with the keel symmetrical and rudder in alignment.

So maybe the wife and I have wonky eyes...

Akestor - the number is O 211 and yes there is a wooden plate inside the hanging locker with her part 1 registration number and registered tonnage, but that's not the HIN. Couldn't find any other numbers but will check the transom as per the other thread.

 

[fisherman]

When I fitted out a Cygnus many years ago my friend thought he would make a bulkhead profile for one side and reverse it for the other. Then we started again, and made every component, and established the deck height, by measuring the side to side discrepancies and halving them. Don't assume your hull is uniform.

 

[Tranona]

The line of rust where the keel meets the hull is quite normal. Nothing to do with different metals, just old fashioned rust from the edge of the cast iron keel. If you have run out of other jbs, good idea to clean the jint all the way round, treat the rusty bits and apply sealant into the join if it has broken away, then Primocon and antifoul. This is normal maintenance and probably needs patching every year or two.

 

[Balbas]

All, thank you. My wife has read this thread and is now much more relaxed than she was yesterday. Which makes my life much better all round!

 

[Seajet]

Balbas,

and this is a tip for any buyer of a pre-1987 boat, do you know where she was during the October 1987 Hurricane in the south east ?

In Chichester harbour alone dozens of yachts were sunk at their moorings, and hundreds - if not thousands around - were badly damaged, including those at boatyards being knocked over like dominoes.

Loads of 2-3 man band ' grp repair ' outfits sprang up overnight, and there were plenty of stories of ' keels put on but not quite the right angle ' - in fact the same has happened to a boat I know recently involving a serious pro' and no time pressure I''m aware of, maybe the owner just p'd him off and the guy thought ' this'll sort out his PY ! '

 

[Concerto]

The number is O 211 and yes there is a wooden plate inside the hanging locker with her part 1 registration number and registered tonnage, but that's not the HIN. Couldn't find any other numbers but will check the transom as per the other thread.

You will not find a HIN as they had not started when your boat was built.

You should find the hull number moulded into the transom. It may also be on a plate on the main bulkhead. There should be a deck number that may match the hull number moulded in the forward end of the cockpit well when the teak grating is removed. You should also find the hull number written on the underside of loose wooden panels like locker lids.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Westerly keel attachment in the 70s depended a bit on pious hope, but the dodgy ones should have been sorted by now.

 

[LittleSister]

Fortunately the sea's wonky, too.