Women and the 35 foot problem

dylanwinter

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www.keepturningleft.co.uk
Other threads have covered the fact that there are a lot more 35 footers around than there ever have been. many people have expressed the opinion that this is not a good thing.

I used to be a producer on Woman's Hour so my feminist credentials are impeccable.

However....deep breath

I blame the women.

Observation will tell you that more men than women sail.

Of the 350 subscribers to my website only two are women. Of the people who watch my youtube films 95 per vcent are men aged 45 to 65.

Yachts cost so much that the decision about whether or not to buy has to be made by both sides of any partnership.

Men dutifully take their wives along and getting them to focus on such important matters as sailing performance, ease of handling, cost of marina berths, shallow draft and all round external beauty when what really matters to most reluctant women sailors is the interior space, the separate sleeping accommodation, easy wipe down surfaces, impractical pale blue velour upholstery, separate showers, double sinks and four gas rings - four gas rings - B'nora!.

The priority seems to be to obtain a vessel with a pleasant, light and roomy interior with enough space for grandchildren or much loved family friends to come sailing - as opposed to a smallish, tough boat designed for one or two smelly men to exist for a week without washing much in the way of clothes, crockery or body parts.

As I sail around the UK I see lots of men sailing single handed in boats that are really far too big for them to handle with ease.

They have been persuaded to buy a bigger boat on the basis that if they buy a big one then their wives, their sons and daughters, their grandchildren and their best friends will come sailing with them. They often do - for the two hots weeks of the year - but that leaves all the other weekends between March and November to fill.

I am probably wrong though.
 
Yep, you could be right.
I'm upgrading from a 24' boat and started looking at 29' boats and then 33' and for many of the reasons you mention, I'm now looking at 36' boats. In fact, have we met, because it could be me you're discribing?

P.S. You forgot to mention the dog...
 
Give Them A Deep Shag

Just shag them, that usually shuts them up. A deep Axminster Wool Shag Pile in the forecabin of any 24 footer soon takes their mind of dinner parties. Its the depth that matters in a good Shag, dont skimp in the Shag department or you will be washing up while she drinks Champaign in the owners aft cabin! If you know what I mean ;)
 
I think there are a few very lucky couples that really enjoy sailing together.

F.B. Cooke the well known East Coast sailor felt that sailing single handed , in company with other single handers, was the best form of sailing there is.
 
I knew I was asking for trouble

Just shag them, that usually shuts them up. A deep Axminster Wool Shag Pile in the forecabin of any 24 footer soon takes their mind of dinner parties. Its the depth that matters in a good Shag, dont skimp in the Shag department or you will be washing up while she drinks Champaign in the owners aft cabin! If you know what I mean ;)

wish I had never posted now

- but in my opinion carpets have no place in boats that are actually used for sailing.
 
Nearly right.
All the things you mention, plus consider the following:

35 ft is about the largest I can comfortably and reliably sail singlehanded.
35 ft is about the largest I can get up the East Coast Creeks that I (we) love
35 ft is about the largest boat I can keep maintained myself
35 ft is about the largest that will fit every East Coast Marina
35 ft is just under the 11m x 3.5m mooring size that are still available in quantity in the Med
35 ft x 4ft draft will comfortably go through Europes inland waterways
35 ft is just about as much as can handle when we get older as a couple sailing
35 ft is big enough for the 2 of us to live on ad infinitum with creature comforts
35 ft allows to have visitors for weekends, or family when we are abroad.
35 ft allows enough room for a watermaker.
35 ft gives 6ft + headroom

So, guess what, I bought a 35ft boat.
 
I agree but it's not just the women is it?

Us blokes always try and go one better don't we?

"I don't just want a BMW I want a big BMW" Bl00dy BMW drivers eh Dylan......

I struggle sometimes with a 10m AWB especially in marina's I don't know but you want to go and explore new places or theres no point in the first place.

Thats why I'm fixing up a little 1970's trailer sailer so I can bugger off on my own occasionally without the stress of a bigger boat.

A seaworthy 28 footer that hasn't got a manky interior would be ideal for both jobs though wouldn't it?

Any ideas?
 
I think there are a few very lucky couples that really enjoy sailing together.

F.B. Cooke the well known East Coast sailor felt that sailing single handed , in company with other single handers, was the best form of sailing there is.


I just spent 2 days on my own and really missed swmbo on board. Nice escape but rather have company.
 
I think there are a few very lucky couples that really enjoy sailing together.

F.B. Cooke the well known East Coast sailor felt that sailing single handed , in company with other single handers, was the best form of sailing there is.

As we write, a rally is taking place in the Solent which highlights this - the Cornish Shrimper rally.
20 foot LOA, no loos, no showers, no 6 foot headroom, one burner stoves, this is life in the raw! Several of the 30 odd boats are single-handed, a few are indeed maried couples, the rest are "odd couples". There seems to be an age requirement to be at least sixty, with several a fair bit North of that age. The cameraderie is superb, and the amount of real sailing being done is a credit to them!
 
a small house

I reckon a key reason for there being so many bigger boats these days is that they're so much cheaper now in real terms. In the 70s a 23ft Westerly Pageant could set you back as much as a small house, but now you can get a 5-year-old 38-40 footer for 100k.

and is about the price of a small house - in some parts of the country
 
I reckon a key reason for there being so many bigger boats these days is that they're so much cheaper now in real terms. In the 70s a 23ft Westerly Pageant could set you back as much as a small house, but now you can get a 5-year-old 38-40 footer for 100k.

House prices have inflated much more than boat prices. In the late 70s, I moved house and simultaneously changed boats. The new 4-bed detached house cost about £22K, the new 31ft Westerly cost about £24K. Priorities, eh?
 
As I sail around the UK I see lots of men sailing single handed in boats that are really far too big for them to handle with ease.

I think I'd disagree with you, if you're talking 35-footers. I often single-hand my 35-footer, and I know from experience it's much easier to manage than a smaller boat. Larger boats are more stable, they have more inertia (so react more slowly), they usually have better sail-handling kit.
 
is that really true?

I think I'd disagree with you, if you're talking 35-footers. I often single-hand my 35-footer, and I know from experience it's much easier to manage than a smaller boat. Larger boats are more stable, they have more inertia (so react more slowly), they usually have better sail-handling kit.

Goodness - you astonish me -

but then I have never sailed a 35 footer single handed

so I bow your superior experience

Dylan
 
I think I'd disagree with you, if you're talking 35-footers. I often single-hand my 35-footer, and I know from experience it's much easier to manage than a smaller boat. Larger boats are more stable, they have more inertia (so react more slowly), they usually have better sail-handling kit.

Must depend on the boat, then, as I find my 24-footer much easier to single hand than the bigger boats I've sailed.

Much lower loads on everything, so I can sheet in the jib (for example) with one pull instead of grinding a winch.

I can reach everything in the cockpit (and part of the cabin) from the tiller. With the sprayhood down I can stand in the cockpit and reach nearly to the gooseneck, to let off sail ties etc.

A bigger boat might have better sail-handling kit, but only because it's a necessity.

I'll grant you stability, in the sense that me standing on a sidedeck on certain points of sail can upset the steering enough to peturb the tillerpilot after a while.

Pete
 
I agree it is a factor, but there are other factors that influence the size of boat people buy. Here's my story.

I went out looking for a cruiser racer circa 33' to 35'. I wanted something that size because it is no fun racing little 4KSBs that aren't taking it seriously but I couldn't afford the sails for anything bigger. Plus I wanted a boat big enough that I could go cruising without being unduly constrained by the weather forecast.

I ended up waking up one morning to realise I'd bought a 43' cruising boat. At least Dacron sails are cheaper than racing sails.

Yes, there is always something else to fix. Yes, it costs more in marinas, but generally only twice as much as a boat that is 21'6". Yes, I can't get up the same creeks that you explore in the Slug. Yes, although I could single hand her, it is better with crew, so that means more effort to organise a trip.

However there is still fun to be had. When the MetOffice says F3-4 and the weather gods trump them with a F6-7 you just get there earlier. When the almanac says "entry impractical against the ebb" and it's the biggest spring of the year, no problem (wish I'd had a camera though - it was wall to wall white water).

I went out with a friend (another forumite) in a bilge keeler. The wind got up a bit more than expected and we were beating with a VMG of 1 knot. My own boat would having been laying our destination at at least 7 knots in the same conditions. He has accused me of living in a parallel universe when it comes to passage planning.

So what I'm trying to say is big isn't necessarily evil and it is not always women's fault.
 
When out sailing, my SWMBO often remarks on the number of men who either sail on their own or in the company of other men. I'd rather have her company and hence the bigger boat to keep her on board with this sailing lark.
Why are so many wives/women reluctant sailors?
 
I blame the women.

I won't say you're wrong in general, but I have a counter-example. KS is a joint venture between my parents and me. Of the three of us, it was my mum who chose her. Dad and I had been looking for "full size" white boats, and had visited a couple of Sadler 32s. Mum convinced us that smaller was better, gaff rig was prettier, and what do you really need all that cabin space for anyway?

We're really happy with the boat.

(I will take dt4134's point though - I am more weather-dependent with KS than I'm used to being. It would be nice to be able to crash through anything at 7 knots.)

Pete
 
lower cold tolerance

When out sailing, my SWMBO often remarks on the number of men who either sail on their own or in the company of other men. I'd rather have her company and hence the bigger boat to keep her on board with this sailing lark.
Why are so many wives/women reluctant sailors?

I love it when Jill comes sailing with me - but she will only go on the boat when the weather forecast is perfect - as for winter sailing

she thinks I am barking.

anyone looking for a small boat could do worse than visit the legendary Andy Seedhouse in Woodbridge

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbMpODjvomo


Dylan
 
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