Wheelhouse yachts

[Wansworth]

Are WiFi controls sufficientply advanced that yachts with wheelhouses or raised cabins need a sterring weel outside.I imagine a wheel steering in doors but use of WiFi engine and steering controls so maneuvering can be done with good visibility. Holding contrl dongle.In reference to the moody is there need for twin wheels,it’s not a performance boat and not being stuck up the stern with marginal sight lines an outopilot could do a better job.

 

[rotrax]

Our motorsailer has only an internal steering position in the pilothouse.

It also has a front cockpit, just behind the mast.

In open waters it is possible to steer and navigate the vessel from this cockpit using the Raymarine remote control for the Autopilot.

Tested it over short distances, but never used it in anger.

The Raymarine system, from direct experience, works quite well.

 

[LittleSister]

I'm not sure I'd trust radio remote controls for close quarters manoeuvring, which is when you'd be most likely to want to be steering from outside. I'm thinking there'd be risks of poor reception, interference from other kit (including from other boats around), and even low battery power. I haven't experienced the latest gear, and maybe that's all covered, but rotrax's statement that his kit works 'quite' well isn't super reassuring.

On my ancient-tech LM motorsailer there is wheel steering in the wheelhouse, and tiller steering in the (aft) cockpit, all mechanical. The wheel can be disconnected by lifting a latch on the rudder post, which results in less load and more feel to the tiller, but the tiller can also be operated no problem with the wheel still connected. The tiller is also quickly removable, to clear the cockpit.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Very big ferries and tugs with electronics costing millions and mounted well away from sea and weather, have occasional incidences due to failure of control systems, sometime fatal.

Do you really thing that for serious usage your little yacht could provide a better environment and more robust electronics?

I would have liked an autopilot that I could remote control but the Pelagic one I bought was a sad dissappointment and could never be set up to suit the boat.

So like Little Sister I just must go outside to adjust the autopilot in my LM. The handy roof hatch in the wheelhouse sorts out the close quarter stuff with with Navigator. I can even operate wheel and throttle from outside when picking up moorings single handed.

Better layout trumps hi tech solutions.

 

[Sandy]

Are WiFi controls sufficientply advanced that yachts with wheelhouses or raised cabins need a sterring weel outside.I imagine a wheel steering in doors but use of WiFi engine and steering controls so maneuvering can be done with good visibility. Holding contrl dongle.In reference to the moody is there need for twin wheels,it’s not a performance boat and not being stuck up the stern with marginal sight lines an outopilot could do a better job.

With some kit and good internet connection you could do all that from the comfort of your own sofa at home.

I prefer the wind in my face and the smell of salt air.

 

[Neeves]

Wired and Wireless controls are very well established, specifically for docking, for MoBos (and any large vessels, like container ships and cruise ships). The limit is the size of your wallet. Why would anyone consider a sailing yacht to be any more difficult or complex than a large MoBo, both can have bow thrusters etc etc. I'm also not sure why the discussion is focussed at wheel house or raised cabins - there is no reason why wireless controls could not be used on a non wheelhouse/raised cabin yacht (or multihull). Its all about money - and the skills of the owner/skipper (and crew).

If you have a very large wallet you can decide if you want the wind in your face - and can dock your vessel standing anywhere you like. The technology is all there.

Dockmate® makes docking easy from any place on board | Dockmate®

I cannot operate the autopilot nor throttle from an iPad but I can operate radar, chart plotter etc (and stir the porridge - men can multitask) with WiFi

Jonathan

 

[Wansworth]

As op,I quite like wheelhouses but more the traditional fishing boat kind with a door each side to exit on to the deck to make fast the recent post about the moody seemed to put the helmsman in an awkward position to moor up short handed and to actually see properly through the wonderful cabin,two rather important factors.Wheelhouses are great especially in inclement weather but I see no need to cram everything in,a proper wheel and a settee is enough,cooking can be done below.Interbreading a caravan with a sea going boat can only lead to tears

 

[Neeves]

I don't like to show bias but in addition to Dockmate there is another company called Yacht Controller

Yacht Controller™ - Wireless Remote Control of Your Yacht

I've been on motor yachts, 80', using such systems and watched 200' commercial vessels using similar systems and they are very impressive. To watch a crew member with a little consol, the size of a video game controller (and I've seen them wireless and wired) docking without breaking into a sweat - amazing.

Its not for me, either, but just because I cannot afford it and don't need it does not mean I think its simply a fad.

Historically if you had the money and a big yacht you needed crew, or lots of frioends - now you can go to sea just you and the wife. I can think of neighbours who have big yachts and multihulls - and never venture from the pontoon - without 'hands' (I've been a pair of those hands).

Jonathan

 

[Neeves]

As op,I quite like wheelhouses but more the traditional fishing boat kind with a door each side to exit on to the deck to make fast the recent post about the moody seemed to put the helmsman in an awkward position to moor up short handed and to actually see properly through the wonderful cabin,two rather important factors.Wheelhouses are great especially in inclement weather but I see no need to cram everything in,a proper wheel and a settee is enough,cooking can be done below.Interbreading a caravan with a sea going boat can only lead to tears

Stirring the porridge, making sure the toast does not burn, fresh coffee and simultaneously looking out at the seascape (multitasking again) - its a real pleasure.

For us the floating caravan works quite well (the washing machine is in one of the engine rooms) - but our peak speed is just over 16 knots - so its quite a fast maritime caravan.

Jonathan

 

[dunedin]

...............

I would have liked an autopilot that I could remote control but the Pelagic one I bought was a sad dissappointment and could never be set up to suit the boat.

So like Little Sister I just must go outside to adjust the autopilot in my LM. The handy roof hatch in the wheelhouse sorts out the close quarter stuff with with Navigator. I can even operate wheel and throttle from outside when picking up moorings single handed.

Most modern autopilots comprise a variety of separate components (ram, processor, compass/gyro, control pad), speaking to each other over a computer network (perhaps N2K).
A wired in control pad sited in the wheelhouse is no less and no more reliable than one sited in the cockpit - both are reliant on the network to operate. And many of us have iPads and mobile devices connected to the network via Wi-fi (though for other reasons I prefer not to have the autopilot linked to the plotter). So I am not sure your concern is applicable to modern autopilots,

And there are a LOT of system on the boat that rely on data transmission through the airwaves - VHF, AIS, GPS etc. A well setup WiFi, with tested signal strength, should not be a concern. I hope so as just added a wireless control for the bow thruster and anchor windlass, to aid solo sailing.

 

[Tranona]

I hope so as just added a wireless control for the bow thruster and anchor windlass, to aid solo sailing.

Likely to be your best buy of the year. although I have a normal rule of not getting off until I have all lines attached, there are times when the ability to operate the bow thruster from the pontoon is very useful. Likewise being able to raise the chain while at the helm can save a lot of hassle, for example if you screw up anchoring and end up too close to another boat or shallow water, you can lift the anchor and chin while in control of the motor and helm before having another go.

 

[rotrax]

I'm not sure I'd trust radio remote controls for close quarters manoeuvring, which is when you'd be most likely to want to be steering from outside. I'm thinking there'd be risks of poor reception, interference from other kit (including from other boats around), and even low battery power. I haven't experienced the latest gear, and maybe that's all covered, but rotrax's statement that his kit works 'quite' well isn't super reassuring.

On my ancient-tech LM motorsailer there is wheel steering in the wheelhouse, and tiller steering in the (aft) cockpit, all mechanical. The wheel can be disconnected by lifting a latch on the rudder post, which results in less load and more feel to the tiller, but the tiller can also be operated no problem with the wheel still connected. The tiller is also quickly removable, to clear the cockpit.

I am not sure I agree with that.

Look at post #2. I said nothing about close quarters, did I?

Our vessel has the wheel in the huge pilothouse, about central, quite high up. No side doors, only one rear door.

First Mate is IC helming when coming alongside, she manages pretty well. I do warps and fenders. When coming alongside I call the moves canal steerer style - 'steer in, steer out' then 'astern'. Once the stern warp is on, I call 'ahead, idle speed' This holds it alongside while I make the warps and springs off.

'Steering in' being the side we are coming alongside. I make these calls from the large swim platform from where I can see the boats position and easily step off when close, taking the stern warp and bow warp with me. Works well.

I would not consider single handing our vessel.

The sales video's of our boat show it under sail in open water with people relaxing in the front cockpit, being steered from there with the Raymarine remote.

If you had ever used the Raymarine remote you would realise it is not suitable for docking manouvers.

Or, on our boat, neccessary.

FYI, the Raymarine autopilot remote only steers port or starboard. It cannot engage/disengage gear or increase or decrease RPM. Purely a remote steering aid.

From direct experience, in open water, from anywhere on the vessel, very effective at changing course in 5 degree movements.

 

[38mess]

The ribs we occasionally use are fly by wire steering and engines, I must say they are very reliable after my initial scepticism

 

[LittleSister]

I am not sure I agree with that.

Look at post #2. I said nothing about close quarters, did I? . . .

If you had ever used the Raymarine remote you would realise it is not suitable for docking manouvers.

Or, on our boat, neccessary.

I can't see that we're disagreeing.

 

[rotrax]

OK, thats fine.

It is just that you followed my post with something I had not mentioned, ie, docking with a remote.

I must have jumped to the wrong delusion............................

 

[Neeves]

There is something wrong if a boat is too large that you cannot come alongside single handed - it effectively means you spent all that money on a large toy and it needs your friends for you to enjoy it. If a remote control allows you to leave and return to a dockside, single handed, its a good investment.

I exaggerate - obviously - but many people, your parents, young children are not going to be reliable - you should be able to berth by yourself.

Altruism is alive and well.

All of these systems are well proven - if there were big issues - they would be very well aired - bad news travels faster then a catamaran can beam reach

From memory Navico do not offer a remote facility for their autopilot.

Stay safe, take care

Jonathan

 

[rotrax]

That is your opinion, and of course, you are entitled to it.

It would be extremely difficult to come alongside in my vessel without assistance, either onboard or shoreside.

First mate and I sail together. We are a team. We enjoy our boat and accept the compromises it has, including docking.

We average 1500 NM's every sailing season when allowed, so we do get around a little bit.

I have absolutely no interest in single handed sailing, so I shall probably never do it.

Navico might not offer a remote facility for their autopilot, but Raymarine do.

We have one hanging on its neck lanyard alongside the helm.

We are trying to stay safe, and are taking care.

Thank you for your good wishes.

 

[Laminar Flow]

We have a wheelhouse with a rear door access and only an interior helm station; we can mount an (emergency) tiller in the cockpit if need be. After some initial enthusiasm, when the boat was new to us, we never used the tiller again. We normally sail two up, my wife and I, and we do all the docking from the wheelhouse; from here it is only a couple of quick steps to the level cockpit. Like Rotrax's ship we are a well-oiled team.

Electronically and in terms of an autopilot we are at the Luddite end of the middle ages. The pilot is an old CPT wheel pilot of Californian production and it is now, by my reckoning, at least 45 years old and doing duty on it's third ship, the first having been a plywood Piver trimaran. On passage and in open water it, well he, Arnold, as we have dubbed it, takes the helm; we do not need a remote and it would be quite pointless as with the house and the cockpit on the same level and everything is pretty much within the same reach as with a regular open cockpit boat. The wee tub is after all a mere 31' long.

It is too easy to overthink things. Having hand-steered across the Pacific and back, a distance of well over 7000 miles, I am quite happy to let Arnold do the only job he is any good at, while I play with the sails or enjoy a cuppa with the wife on the foredeck where I can focus on that wind-on-my-face thing and sniff the salt air.

 

[rotrax]

" George " our autopilot steers better than either of us.

Shame not to keep him busy...............................