What's the RYA's response to British boats being BANNED from Belgium?

[maxi77]

I must admit that threads like this do tend to make me really wonder how some people actually aquired enough money to buy a half decent boat. The RYA cannot make Belgium do anything themselves, so why then does the reality that Belgium finds the possesion of red diesel in yachts is fineable mean that the RYA has failed in someway in it's service to it service to us.

 

[sailorman]

Even more amazing is some of them have sailed into Oostende direct from the UK 100 times with their own boat.
Also seriously concerned with the present situation. that could seriously dent ones wallet.
Personally i have never had a problem with the Belgian Douane, they are always pleasant & courteous,even have taken the odd coffee ( we can afford good coffee too ).

 

[GlennG]

The RYA cannot make Belgium do anything themselves, so why then does the reality that Belgium finds the possesion of red diesel in yachts is fineable mean that the RYA has failed in someway in it's service to it service to us.

Yep. The RYA purports to represent the industry. There's not much more of an important than this one; in effect the BANNING of British boats from other countries.

So lobby. And come up with novel and practical ways of solving the problem, such as lobbying for "leisure marinas" to flog white diesel. Or producing a document that we can produce to Belgian plod explaining that the RYA will take on our case and what we should do.

Then communicate it.

 

[Tranona]

"Keeping the membership better informed" might mean producing a magazine the membership might actually want to read because it contains the useful and up to date information we need.
I gave up looking at their website ages ago.

Well, as you don't read it and don't use the website - how would you know what information there is there?

Get real. The information is available and is up to date for anybody who is interested.

As for need, I guess only avery tiny minority of members have a specific interest in what goes on in Belgium, although of course it may be of general interest, which is why the information is provided for all those who can be bothered to read it.

 

[Tranona]

Yep. The RYA purports to represent the industry. There's not much more of an important than this one; in effect the BANNING of British boats from other countries.

So lobby. And come up with novel and practical ways of solving the problem, such as lobbying for "leisure marinas" to flog white diesel. Or producing a document that we can produce to Belgian plod explaining that the RYA will take on our case and what we should do.

Then communicate it.

All that has been done already. The RYA does not represent "the industry" - that is the BMF. The lobbying has been done. The minister responsible has supported the RYA/BMF and is pursuing the issue with the EU and the Belgian government. What more do you want them to do - send one of our gunboats?

If you bother to read all the information you will have worked all this out already. Just because it has not been resolved yet is not the fault of any of the organisations mentioned who are doing exactly what you criticise them for not doing.

 

[sailorman]

The RYA magazine is more into race oriented, items ( how many of those are actually paid up personal members), not so much coverage for those of us that now prefer cruising & are personal members of many years standing.
There have been articles relating to the various diesel fuel issues over the past few years. this latest problem does have the possibility of heavy fines for yachtsman who have innocent & legitimate passage into & through Belgian waters.
on the face of it,not much has been publicised as to what is actually being done,to assist us.

 

[sailorman]

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?t=304584

 

[GlennG]

All that has been done already. The RYA does not represent "the industry" - that is the BMF. The lobbying has been done. The minister responsible has supported the RYA/BMF and is pursuing the issue with the EU and the Belgian government.

So what's the point of the RYA then? Flags & race etiquette?

Seriously I thought the BMF were the industry trade body and thus weren't open to individual members. The RYA seem to claim the individual membership. Now I'm confused.

What more do you want them to do - send one of our gunboats?

Do we still have one? Maybe we could send in the UN

 

[jamesjermain]

"Keeping the membership better informed" might mean producing a magazine the membership might actually want to read because it contains the useful and up to date information we need.
I gave up looking at their website ages ago.

There are none so deaf as those who don't want to hear; none so ill-informed as those who don't want to read.

 

[sailorman]

There are none so deaf as those who don't want to hear; none so ill-informed as those who don't want to read.

James i would respectfully suggest that you have the ear of folk that us mere RYA members do not

 

[jamesjermain]

So what's the point of the RYA then? Flags & race etiquette?

Seriously I thought the BMF were the industry trade body and thus weren't open to individual members. The RYA seem to claim the individual membership. Now I'm confused.



Do we still have one? Maybe we could send in the UN

James i would respectfully suggest that you have the ear of folk that us mere RYA members do not

Semi-retired old hacks don't carry much weight in the corridors of power (saving the grace of Piers Morgan, of course).

 

[maxi77]

Yep. The RYA purports to represent the industry. There's not much more of an important than this one; in effect the BANNING of British boats from other countries.

So lobby. And come up with novel and practical ways of solving the problem, such as lobbying for "leisure marinas" to flog white diesel. Or producing a document that we can produce to Belgian plod explaining that the RYA will take on our case and what we should do.

Then communicate it.

Well they have got a letter from the EU saying it is legal for UK vessels to have red deisel. After all they lobbied hard and long to get the best deal on red because boats needed red, now you are suggesting they reverse that and lobby for white having said it was bad for boats.

 

[maby]

Well they have got a letter from the EU saying it is legal for UK vessels to have red deisel. After all they lobbied hard and long to get the best deal on red because boats needed red, now you are suggesting they reverse that and lobby for white having said it was bad for boats.

There is nothing in the law that stops marinas stocking unmarked, high-sulphur, FAME free diesel and selling it to us provided we pay the full tax. The fuel manufacturers already produce it - it's just red diesel without the dye added.

Sooner or later, we (including the RYA and HMRC) are going to be forced to accept that the current rules cannot continue - we should all be pressuring our marinas to switch to fuel supplies that are accepted as legal all over Europe. Have any of you asked your marina management to switch? I have, and give them the occasional reminder.

I'm not convinced that white road diesel would be a serious problem for most of us. Plenty of people use it and modern engines should be perfectly happy with it.

 

[jamesjermain]

The RYA magazine is more into race oriented, items ( how many of those are actually paid up personal members), not so much coverage for those of us that now prefer cruising & are personal members of many years standing.
There have been articles relating to the various diesel fuel issues over the past few years. this latest problem does have the possibility of heavy fines for yachtsman who have innocent & legitimate passage into & through Belgian waters.
on the face of it,not much has been publicised as to what is actually being done,to assist us.

I've just been through a recent copy of themagazine and counted 24 pages aimed at cruising people directly and seven aimed exclusively at racers. The rest were of general interest to all members. Everybody and every activity covered relates to the membership either as idividual members or as members of affilliated clubs and organisation.
As for your last sentence - I give up!

 

[sailorman]

There is nothing in the law that stops marinas stocking unmarked, high-sulphur, FAME free diesel and selling it to us provided we pay the full tax. The fuel manufacturers already produce it - it's just red diesel without the dye added.

Sooner or later, we (including the RYA and HMRC) are going to be forced to accept that the current rules cannot continue - we should all be pressuring our marinas to switch to fuel supplies that are accepted as legal all over Europe. Have any of you asked your marina management to switch? I have, and give them the occasional reminder.

I'm not convinced that white road diesel would be a serious problem for most of us. Plenty of people use it and modern engines should be perfectly happy with it.

I would assume out continental cousins are quite happy with white with no notable side effects

 

[sailorman]

I've just been through a recent copy of themagazine and counted 24 pages aimed at cruising people directly and seven aimed exclusively at racers. The rest were of general interest to all members. Everybody and every activity covered relates to the membership either as idividual members or as members of affilliated clubs and organisation.
As for your last sentence - I give up!

one does not hoard magazines
i place them in our club for those less fortunate non RYA members

 

[maby]

I would assume out continental cousins are quite happy with white with no notable side effects

I'm not sure what it is that is sold in continental marinas - could be high-sulphur, FAME-free - effectively our red diesel minus the dye...

 

[jamesjermain]

one does not hoard magazines
i place them in our club for those less fortunate non RYA members

 

[Twister_Ken]

Well they have got a letter from the EU saying it is legal for UK vessels to have red deisel.

The basis of most court cases is two parties, both of whom have been assured by their lawyers that they are right, and the other side is wrong. The case is then fought by both sides' lawyers. One party loses, the other wins, but both lots of lawyers get paid. So why would a lawyer tell his or her client that they didn't stand a chance?

 

[Koeketiene]

So lobby. And come up with novel and practical ways of solving the problem, such as lobbying for "leisure marinas" to flog white diesel.

Don't hold your breath.
The RYA/BMF actively pushed for the retention of red diesel to spare marinas the expense of having their tanks cleaned.
Like having diesel tanks cleaned occasionally would be such a bad thing