VP Outdrive opinions please..

[Tanqueray]

I'm very aware of the usual problems and the usual opinions associated with VP outdrives - so at least we do not have to go over all that ground again!
But I have a slightly different question for those with significant experience of VP O/D's if I may.
I have been a shaft drive guy for 50+ years (professionally and for leisure) with some limited exposure to both jets and outdrives - but for the next project there would be significant advantages to using O/D's (depth and drying) providing I could build in some reliability as well.
For those who were on the scene when 290's etc. were being sold new - IF they were new, and IF they were treated reasonably, and IF they were regularly serviced with genuine VP parts then, accidental damage aside, for how long could one hope to have reasonable reliability before age-related problems started to become the norm?
Would say three seasons use at say 500 hours per season be a reasonable expectation (hope) from 'as new' regularly and professionally serviced units? The project I have in mind is about that timescale / hours and I have the availability of two lightly used 290's which I would have professionally stripped and overhauled with genuine parts - I would use these to replace the existing units (which are fully operational anyway) and so I would have two spare units.
Do I have reasonable expectations or am I dreaming?

 

[madabouttheboat]

I have a number of drives on different boats. One has twin DP-D (a slightly newer version of the 290) That boat is now 20+ years old, still on original drives and no problems encountered.

Another boat does have an original 290 on it. This dates to around 1989 and again is still in perfectly serviceable order.

If they were still available new I would choose the old 290, and its derivatives, over the modern VP stuff any day of the week. If properly looked after they seem to provide sterling service. If they do go wrong, it is usually down to lack of maintenance and even then they are relatively simple things so not overly difficult or expensive (in boaty terms) to fix. You can pick up a reconditioned one for a few grand, so if the worse happened and you needed to get back on the water ASAP, that is your worst case scenario.

If you are really looking at 500 hours per season, I suspect you will need extra maintenance to keep them tip top. I am thinking maybe a mid season oil change for example.

 

[BruceK]

If you look after them and regularly do seals, anodes and everything else required then there is no reason for them not to last you many years. Mine are over 30 years now and are fine. High maintenance yes, poor quality no. It's the skimping on maintenance costs which becomes their downfall.

 

[[2068]]

There are outdrives still running with 2000hrs+ on them without issues.
And others that are toast at 400hrs.
It's not about the hours - regular maintenance is the thing.
Also, running with larger / more powerful engines is going to put more strain on bearings and gears.

 

[Chris_d]

I've had two 290 DPE's since virtually new and they are now up to 1200hrs, no issues except a few seal changes due to fishing wire etc.. still on the original cone clutches despite loads of river and lock use. Reckon the 290 is the most reliable and easiest to maintain, they seemed to go down hill with all the steering ram issues of later DPG's etc...

Police in London ran Botnia Targa 32's with twin AD41's on 290 outdrives and I saw one up for sale with 25,000hours on it! Probably was maintained to death but it shows they will do the job if looked after.

 

[Tanqueray]

Thank you very much for the informed replies folks - it's very reassuring.

 

[spannerman]

As a professional Volvo and Mercruiser drive rebuilder I would agree with the comments above, don’t skimp on servicing and they will serve you well.

 

[Seastoke]

Thank you very much for the informed replies folks - it's very reassuring.

500hrs a season is some going .

 

[Tanqueray]

500hrs a season is some going .

I understand where you are coming from and it's a Yes and No situation.
a) Yes 500 hours is a lot for leisure but this is semi-commercial hours for a bucket-list project I've always wanted to attempt - which is why I am asking whether I can get semi-commercial usage for say three seasons out of what is basically leisure equipment.
b) In ye days of olde (1970/80's) I was doing 6,240 hours per year (260 days x 24 hrs) at sea with the machinery running 24/7 during that time so - not really.
RISK ALARP - then fingers crossed.

 

[Moodysailor]

I used to work for a VP Centre, I'd also echo the words above. The DP-E was a brilliant drive, a lot of issues with earlier ones sorted out, we had many last a lot of years. Some of the fishing boats had them near us due to wanting to dry the boats out, they lasted well in that heavy use (provided they were well maintained).

If I were you, I'd look for the following:

• Mostly or fully main-dealer serviced, with documentation. Alternatively, serviced by someone who really knows their stuff - if in doubt, find out!
• Talk to the dealer/person who has serviced the vessel, they are usually happy to discuss
• I'd prefer one with higher hours but less shifts - it may sound odd, but as they use a cone clutch, once in gear there is almost no load. It's the shifting cycles which can wear the clutch.
• Check for external corrosion, especially around the areas where the housings bolt together. If they are suffering or showing crevasse corrosion here it is usually a sign that there is galvanic action in the area the vessel is moored, or the anodes haven't been replaced often enough. It's not necessarily a deal-breaker, but it's a reason to probe further.

 

[Greg2]

This is a disappointingly positive thread about outdrives - where is the usual ‘work of the devil’ commentary from those scarred by endless problems?! ?

On a serious note I would concur with much of what has been said . Having had two or three outdrive boats and running one at work I would say that even when maintained they can sometimes cause a bit of grief but, in the main, if looked after will provide good service. The sensible approach is to have a budget to look after them and don’t skimp.

 

[LBRodders]

500 hours of what, WOT or displacement speed? Are we talking steady cruising or stop /start pulling inflatable bananas?

That's the key information to this question.

 

[Tanqueray]

500 hours of what, WOT or displacement speed? Are we talking steady cruising or stop /start pulling inflatable bananas?

That's the key information to this question.

As I said in my OP 'IF they are treated reasonably'
No WOT except in emergency, either up onto the plane and then back off the old fashioned way or river cruising (unavoidable) but if the slow stuff gets too much I'll probably stick some sort of auxiliary drive on.

 

[tico]

Is 'oldgit' on holiday or asleep?

Seriously tho, I had 290 & DP-E outdrives for 20+ years ...... Maintenance is key. The single problem that i had in all that time was my own fault - missed out a thrust washer on reassembly :-(

 

[LBRodders]

As I said in my OP 'IF they are treated reasonably'
No WOT except in emergency, either up onto the plane and then back off the old fashioned way or river cruising (unavoidable) but if the slow stuff gets too much I'll probably stick some sort of auxiliary drive on.

As others have said, keep it maintained and I reckon it you wont have too many problems.

Not sure what the semi commercial bit is. Either it is or isn't [for regs and insurance anyway], but that's not what the threads about. Just don't get tripped up!

 

[oldgit]

Is 'oldgit' on holiday or asleep?

Seriously tho, I had 290 & DP-E outdrives for 20+ years ...... Maintenance is key. The single problem that i had in all that time was my own fault - missed out a thrust washer on reassembly :-(

Out boating

Not aware of any small commercial craft in my locality and any skippers who earn a living on the water ,who use outdrives.
Without exception they all have shaft drives.
Mainly small charter and fast fishing vessels.
There might be reason for this. ?


A chap on our moorings has a fairly new Sealine T41, no idea what outdrives but its got outdrives.
Owned boat for several years and has religiously had the boat serviced by official VP dealer in Essex.
Two years ago had a problem with the outdrives, the bill for which, the insurance paid up.
Last year more serious problems which the owner had to pay for.
Walked past the boat today, boat was being washed and polished, spoke to the valeter, whats going on ?
Owner has had enough, boat has been is sold and he has bought a Princess...on shafts.
Previous day another member was punching the air with joy, literally just sold his boat with outdrives 5 mins previously
Rather old 290s but constant problems.
Guess what sort of propulsion his new to him Flybridge has.
End of our pontoon is an Fairline Sedan on outdrives, 290s owner has given up trying to maintain the hydraulics, they just stay down now.
How about a Sealine 33 which had both legs replaced shortly after purchase.
Corse they might all just be unlucky !


Ooo ......forgot the other S41 that is still waing to to come home from the Solent , he had two goes getting home after outdrives failed, the second he got about 5 miles before having to turn back. Just unlucky again ?
Outdrives are fine for mincing around the bay if you struggle to do 50 hours a year but otherwise. !

 

[A_8]

One can't just metric this by hours, duty cycle plays a significant part. Example, river use, perfect servicing, never any water in the drives and they will last forever. Or 3000 rpm/max torque 90% of the time, missed an oil change or 2 plus water ingress twice and they are done by 1000h for anything but river use.

I had my upper gear crack at 250h/2 years on a DPE drive and discussed it directly with VP and IIRC they told me design life on the DPE drives were 2000h. Back then I was not informed enough to ask how they got to that but the same question on a typical VP engined 40-45 feet shaft gearbox boat was 4000h.

 

[Tanqueray]

Thanks for all the comments folks, I now have all the information I need (confirmation really) and the purchase will proceed.
I shall however take O.G.'s advice into account and will at all times attempt to transit 'Bay to Bay' whilst mincing appropriately.

 

[oldgit]

Thanks for all the comments folks, I now have all the information I need (confirmation really) and the purchase will proceed.
I shall however take O.G.'s advice into account and will at all times attempt to transit 'Bay to Bay' whilst mincing appropriately.

Warned about outdrives so many times by so many people, most who earned their living on the water.
Cannot be that bad surely ! Good luck .

 

[Tanqueray]

Warned about outdrives so many times by so many people, most who earned their living on the water.
Cannot be that bad surely ! Good luck .

Well joking aside, I did read and consider what you said, and I did not dismiss it either. As per the OP there are other considerations in this particular project - considerations that at least caused me to stop and question my pre-conceived ideas.
As we all know, boats are compromises, horses for courses etc. etc. I too have made my living on the water since 1972 (as a marine engineer) but again as per the OP I have not had much dealings with O/D's. On another occasion I could have gone for shafts but for this job I've now chosen drives, I will prep and look after them as best I am able, and we'll see how it goes.
I've only just thought of this - but I've now pushed myself around the oceans with steam, nuclear, gas turbine, diesel, petrol, jet drives, outboards, oars and sails - so perhaps it's just fate rounding things off!