Volvo Penta engines.

[Wansworth]

Looking at a boat with one but somewhere I read they are not good and spares are expensive,any comments,many thanks.

 

[Neeves]

They are Perkins engines, marinised by Volvo who buy in parts from subcontractors. The largest parts to require replacement are the seawater pump (I think its a Johnson pump), specifically the shaft, and the exhaust elbow. You can live with a slightly worn shaft for a long time, the seals are not cheap - but hardly a major item of expenditure. Copies of the elbow, in stainless, are freely and cheaply available. The engines use standard oil filters and the belts last for ever (well a good few thousand hours).

Other parts might be expensive - but take a major error in servicing, bad luck or senility (of the engine), to need replacement.

Servicing of the engine can require the dexterity of a young monkey - but that's partially the fault of the boat builder - so check the commonly serviced parts for access.

Jonathan

 

[Tranona]

Bit like asking about Ford cars - there are so many different types that it is impossible to generalise - except that the sorts of boats you are looking at if they have the original engines will be "old". Old in 2 senses, first their physical age (40 years+) and then their design type. The pre 1980s were old style heavy low revving seawater cooled engines made in low volumes for marine use with little or nothing in common with industrial or automotive engines. The numbers still in use is falling and spares for many parts and models are becoming unavailable or expensive. While the engines themselves are robust and many are still giving good service, major issues, or an accumulation of minor issues often make them uneconomic to repair. Modern replacements are so different in concept that replacement is a major job and likely to exceed the value of the boat.

So, could be a ticking timebomb.

 

[Wansworth]

I seem to be running up against an obvious problem old boats have old engines or have gone beyond and fitted an outboard and left the original engine and stern gear in place to avoid extra costs and paperwork removing an old inboard

 

[rib]

Had a kad 32? In a rib. On a circumnavigation round UK fresh water pump shaft /spline broke. In a big bav which often threw its propellers 70/80 hp ish lots of relay trouble. Training boat not private.. As we're the smaller bav which often suffered from raw water pumps and relays. And the odd head casket.. I have a beta 50hp. Done hundreds of hours and 10,000 s of sea miles in 14 years cruising and playing.. One water pump and one alternator bracket... ? ?.. Volo said the water pump one was very rare.... Not what the mechanic said when he came to fix it.. Im also under the impression that the early ones had dissimilar metals on cooling system and one sort suffered from oil Pick up pipe problems... I might add every volvo mechanic I had were very helpfull ??

 

[rib]

Ps... Used to buy spares from key parts.. If they are still going

 

[ChromeDome]

They are Perkins engines, marinised by Volvo who buy in parts from subcontractors. The largest parts to require replacement are the seawater pump (I think its a Johnson pump), specifically the shaft, and the exhaust elbow. You can live with a slightly worn shaft for a long time, the seals are not cheap - but hardly a major item of expenditure. Copies of the elbow, in stainless, are freely and cheaply available. The engines use standard oil filters and the belts last for ever (well a good few thousand hours).

Other parts might be expensive - but take a major error in servicing, bad luck or senility (of the engine), to need replacement.

Servicing of the engine can require the dexterity of a young monkey - but that's partially the fault of the boat builder - so check the commonly serviced parts for access.

Jonathan

That really depends. Volvo have marinized their own auto/truck/industrial products over time and others' (GM petrol to a large extent). E.g. recent diesels include the Deutz-based D4 series.

Parts availability and costs are discussed a lot, not least the electronically managed versions. Also on these forums:

Search for site:.ybw.com volvo ecu

 

[dunedin]

Have we run out of 101 reasons not to buy an old boat and had to open a new list of 1001 reasons.
VP engines are fine if properly serviced, but clearly when looking at cheap old boats they won't be as pristine as Eur 1/4m new boats.
Has rhe OP looked at every old boat on the market and rejected 100%?

 

[Beneteau381]

They are Perkins engines, marinised by Volvo who buy in parts from subcontractors. The largest parts to require replacement are the seawater pump (I think its a Johnson pump), specifically the shaft, and the exhaust elbow. You can live with a slightly worn shaft for a long time, the seals are not cheap - but hardly a major item of expenditure. Copies of the elbow, in stainless, are freely and cheaply available. The engines use standard oil filters and the belts last for ever (well a good few thousand hours).

Other parts might be expensive - but take a major error in servicing, bad luck or senility (of the engine), to need replacement.

Servicing of the engine can require the dexterity of a young monkey - but that's partially the fault of the boat builder - so check the commonly serviced parts for access.

Jonathan

Hmm, if you are going to say something then get it right otherwise your credibility goes? Some older VPs were built by VP.
Some were based on Peugeot, some were based on Japanese derived Perkins. Mine was based on a a BL/Perkins car engine. The latest lot are based on the Perkins 400 series, which is the latest small engine offering from Caterpillar/Perkins

 

[Beneteau381]

That really depends. Volvo have marinized their own auto/truck/industrial products over time and others' (GM petrol to a large extent). E.g. recent diesels include the Deutz-based D4 series.

Parts availability and costs are discussed a lot, not least the electronically managed versions. Also on these forums:

Search for site:.ybw.com volvo ecu

The D series are based on the Perkins/Cat 400 series. They are not electronically managed. The ecu debacle? The ecu was designed to integrate the engine parameters in to nmea2000 systems so that the values could be displayed on MFDs. Also the start stop system could be activated electronically. The engines themselves are bog standard mechanically injected lumps and can be started and stopped mecahincally, (at the height of the MDI debacle, VP were offering a mechanical switch bodge to get owners out of trouble) I got involved with a brand new Ovni problem burining through 5 of the MDI boxes. I helped them solve the issue. It was flyback from colllapsing coil fields in solenoids thwt was cooking switching chips.
Deutz as part of the D series? I dont think so.

 

[Wansworth]

Have we run out of 101 reasons not to buy an old boat and had to open a new list of 1001 reasons.
VP engines are fine if properly serviced, but clearly when looking at cheap old boats they won't be as pristine as Eur 1/4m new boats.
Has rhe OP looked at every old boat on the market and rejected 100%?

This old boat just on the market today for sale in Ribadeo not far to go to view,I just wanted a comment on Volvo engines as Ithas one.

 

[Tranona]

Hmm, if you are going to say something then get it right otherwise your credibility goes? Some older VPs were built by VP.
Some were based on Peugeot, some were based on Japanese derived Perkins. Mine was based on a a BL/Perkins car engine. The latest lot are based on the Perkins 400 series, which is the latest small engine offering from Caterpillar/Perkins

While this is true, not really relevant to the OP. Of you follow his long trail of threads on NOT buying a boat he is looking at old sailing boats under 26'' and £10k which, if they do have an original Volvo inboard will be single or 2 cylinder engines of up to maybe 15hp. These are cast iron seawater cooled engines mostly of Volvo Penta own manufacture (although some were re-badged Albins). Completely different from the more modern and larger engines. as he says in post ~4 many have died and been replaced with outboards with the original still in place. This situation is not unique to Volvo as most of the small diesels from the 60s through to the late 70s have now become difficult to keep running due to lack of spares. Volvo was of course the dominant supplier at the time with a huge range of small engines so is the one that potential buyers of small old boats comes across most often.

 

[Stemar]

Well, I had a VP2003 in Jissel. I got it second hand for free (just happened to know the right person at the right time) when the original MD1 died, at 30 years old. The 2003 seems to be at the origin of many of the unreliable Volvo stories, but mine was still going strong when I sold the boat 16 years later. I learned the correct starting technique and it never missed a beat apart from a blocked filter once, which was hardly the engine's fault. It never needed oil between changes and always started first time, even in the middle of winter. Yes, they had an issue with the gearbox shaft, but that was early one, and I doubt there'll be any still running that haven't been fixed. The only other thing was that, not having heater plugs, it did take a bit of churning to get going on a cold day, and smoked when cold

On my experience, a Volvo engine wouldn't put me off. I'd certainly rather have a good Volvo than a tired Beta, Yanmar or whatever. I want to see the engine start from cold, idle properly and drive the boat hard without overheating or making smoke once warm. If it does all that, I don't much care what make it is.

 

[ChromeDome]

..
Deutz as part of the D series? I dont think so.

Wonder where I picked that up

D4 is not a truck engine base unit, I was developed by Deutz for Volvo specifically as a marine engine, having a Lanchester shaft makes it a particularly sweet motor for a four banger.

Added:

Deutz have a long history of being at the forefront of diesel technology, not up to date with how much of Deutz Volvo own these days since Volvo purchased Nissan Diesel in Japan, as they are using a lot of ND technology in their new engines including soon to be launched D8? marine motor.

However Deutz did design the Volvo Penta D4/6 engines and they have proved solid motors.

The DT-67622 is a rock solid base engine producing squat all power out of 7.2 liters.

My only reservation regarding the Vetus marinisation is the use of a dry exhaust manifold, every manufacturer without exception using dry manifolds has suffered cracking problems. This model has very low specific output so MAY just work.

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

Bit like asking about Ford cars - there are so many different types that it is impossible to generalise - except that the sorts of boats you are looking at if they have the original engines will be "old". Old in 2 senses, first their physical age (40 years+) and then their design type. The pre 1980s were old style heavy low revving seawater cooled engines made in low volumes for marine use with little or nothing in common with industrial or automotive engines. The numbers still in use is falling and spares for many parts and models are becoming unavailable or expensive. While the engines themselves are robust and many are still giving good service, major issues, or an accumulation of minor issues often make them uneconomic to repair. Modern replacements are so different in concept that replacement is a major job and likely to exceed the value of the boat.

So, could be a ticking timebomb.

Don’t disagree with the general points being made, but I was informed that the basis of the original Diesel engines (MD 1, 2 etc.) were generator engines for use in remote Scandinavian areas., much like Lister in the UK. Those fitted with fresh water heat exchanger cooling have a better chance of lasting longer but spares of major parts now almost unobtainable.

 

[Beneteau381]

Wonder where I picked that up


Added:

You are talking about another series of VP engines, used in dark side boats, we are talking sail boat auxiliary engines

 

[Stemar]

but spares of major parts now almost unobtainable.

True, but surely that would apply to most engines of that age, whatever the make.

 

[DownWest]

Wandy hasn't told us which engine it has, which would clear up the source confusion..

Friend in Portugal bought a rebuilt MD11C for his boat, but never got to fit it. Still available and in the EU ;o)

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

True, but surely that would apply to most engines of that age, whatever the make.

Correct. My post was to support, and add to, Tranora’;s post.

 

[Wansworth]

Wandy hasn't told us which engine it has, which would clear up the source confusion..

Friend in Portugal bought a rebuilt MD11C for his boat, but never got to fit it. Still available and in the EU ;o)

“Wandy”!


Whatever next!…..18.74hp from 2002…..but the boat a Furia 28 needing lots of work and over 9 metres so long term too expensive