Unfortunate Road traffic incident

[Steve803]

I've always wanted to sail. It's been a long time bucket list tick. I found the boat I would like and brought it, and took it on the one hour journey home. As I was reversing the boat onto my driveway, a driver who certainly wasn't paying enough attention to notice there was a 21ft boat reversing onto a driveway a quarter mile ahead, made no attempt to stop and drive straight into the trailer and shunted the boat onto the edges of the trailer, causing some paint damage here and there, but most importantly, split the starboard side keel (it's a bilge keel). I'm not the type of person to give up easy, so im looking at attempting repair. Ok, the trailer I don't hold much hope for, but the boat I'm hoping I can salvage as its a bit of a classic. I have no knowledge of boats, only bodywork on cars. Now the entire length of the innerside of the keel has came away, I assume some expoy, would be used here after all surfaces are clean. Then fibreglass sheeting left to right, then top to bottom and keep building up before a gel coat. There appears no damage to the hull. I've tried to get intouch with boat builders, surveyors etc, but have had no reply. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks

 

[Boathook]

Sorry to hear about this and welcome to the forum

Have a read of this thread, link below posted by a member here last year. The damage to your boat is very similar or seems so. Anything is repairable but it comes down to cost and time. Even doing the repairs yourself could be costly. The fact that you know about repairing cars means you have knowledge about the PPE needed / required for grinding fiberglass, etc.

Stupid - hit breakwater stones ...

 

[Steve803]

Sorry to hear about this and welcome to the forum

Have a read of this thread, link below posted by a member here last year. The damage to your boat is very similar or seems so. Anything is repairable but it comes down to cost and time. Even doing the repairs yourself could be costly. The fact that you know about repairing cars means you have knowledge about the PPE needed / required for grinding fiberglass, etc.

Stupid - hit breakwater stones ...

Thank you for the advice and direction.

 

[MontyMariner]

I assume you got the drivers insurance details.
You will need a surveyor report then preferably three estimates for repair.
As I see it, the fact that it's a boat isn't relevant, it's an RTA. Being a damaged boat just adds a complication with the car insurers, as it's not the normal run of the mill claim.

 

[William_H]

It seems like OP wants to do the repair himself. Probably in insurance terms the boat is a write off and he will get a pay out. Or perhaps not.
The essential thing to know is just how the bilge keel is attached to the hull. OP says hull is intact. Might imply that the keel is in effect glued on to the outside of the hull. This would require a build up of fillets from keel to hull on each side. Picture 2 seems like that fillet has parted. If that is the case then grind away the damaged fillet of GRP and resin and replace with new lay up. The size of the fillet will dictate it's strength. So in close to the corner you can use filler of resin and micro balloons or similar. It is the surface of the fillet which will give strength. I would suggest kevlar cloth in lieu of glass. Not that expensive and very tough. Need very sharp scissors. Use epoxy for resin. The biggest challenge will be to get a decent attachment of the cloth to the hull and keel. Just a few comments on what really is a job requiring expert or serious consideration.
Now for a crazy idea. Remove both bilge keels. Cut a hole in centre of keel and fit a keel box and fabricate a ballasted center board. My little 21fter was built this way and has wonderful windward performance and very easy retrieval onto trailer. (need a swing or lift rudder also) ol'will

 

[nevis768]

Sorry to hereabout your accident. I would probably just buy another boat, more cost effective in terms of time, money. That size of boat are regularly on the net being given away.

 

[wallacebob]

With appropriate skills and knowledge it’s probably repairable, but will cost £££. A professional could assess it, but they know they won’t get the work, so won’t bother. It’s economically unviable. Are you a club member? Most clubs have helpful and knowledgeable people in the yard. Your lack of experience needs guidance! This isn’t cosmetic, it’s structural. A bodged fix will possibly kill you, or put others in danger. Don’t get emotionally involved, walk away with the insurance money and start again.

 

[oldgit]

Suspect the real problem to consider is not how difficult and expensive the boat is to repair, this will pale into insignificance if owner decides to scrap the thing.
Having been involved with cutting up old glass fibre boats in the dim and distant past, the process is horrific, probably personally lethal and involved things afterwards which were definately not environmentally very friendly at all.
Do not get involved with disposing of the remains yourself, make sure its the insurance companies problem.
Find it difficult to even consider the merits of fixing this , every corner of every boatyard in the land is jammed full of vessels requiring "a little light restoration" , you will have to fight off yard owners with pointy stick at the prospect of somebody prepared to take one of these "bargains" away. ?

 

[Boathook]

You mention that the boat is a bit of a classic but what make and model, etc.

Hope you are claiming for the trailer from the other driver at least. The trailer does seem decent in the picture and opens up options to purchasing another boat that doesn't have a trailer.

 

[Steve803]

I assume you got the drivers insurance details.
You will need a surveyor report then preferably three estimates for repair.
As I see it, the fact that it's a boat isn't relevant, it's an RTA. Being a damaged boat just adds a complication with the car insurers, as it's not the normal run of the mill claim.

It's a complicated one indeed. As the driver didn't strike our vehicle our insurance company are not involved. However our legal team our dealing with the medical issues before they look at the boat. They really haven't mentioned any action to be taken on the boat, and I don't like sitting around looking at it in that condition on my driveway. I just would rather get it fixed and send my legal team the invoices. I really feel that they won't be doing anything about the boat and it will be on the driveway for many years if I don't take action.

 

[Steve803]

You mention that the boat is a bit of a classic but what make and model, etc.

Hope you are claiming for the trailer from the other driver at least. The trailer does seem decent in the picture and opens up options to purchasing another boat that doesn't have a trailer.

I say it's a "classic" as it's old but was very much sea worthy, and Ellen Macarthur put them in the history books. It's a Newbridge Corribee.

 

[scozzy]

Sounds like you have transferable skills which is a bonus and will keep costs down..all you need now is time....
If it's a bucket list to go sailing anytime soon then pursue the insurance and buy another boat
If you love the boat and a tinker like may of us do then why not,you're bound to find lots of other things to do besides the repair and may actually end up sailing her! When you do you'll at least know her an awful lot better than you do now and get great satisfaction from it.

 

[Refueler]

I am the one who did similar repairs to bilge keel ... Stupid - hit breakwater stones ...

The damage was far more extensive than first appeared. Once we started cutting back to check extent - we understood it was a major job. It was not only GRP work - but we still have the cabin woodwork to replace / refit and bond in ..

I have a "love affair" with that boat as she has been with me many years through good and storm weather. She was not insured - my choice - and all costs were on me. The final cost would probably bounce somewhere near the 3000 quid mark, with wood work still to complete ... for a boat only worth that on the market in UK ... ok here in Latvia probably 6000. Work was done on a private cash basis ... if it had been professionally done ? I would guess double that cost.

First I would be onto Your and Other Drivers Insurance ... the boat was on a trailer connected to your vehicle. If the Other Drivers insurance want to declare a 'Write Off' or "Total Constructive Loss" as some Ins call it ... then you push to keep ownership .... I did this with a Snapdragon 23 that was declared TCL .. they agreed a figure - I was paid - the money then paid all repairs and yard fees. Boat was better than before !
But if Insurance agree to repair - then get it done professionally - seriously ... its hell of a job to do ... one which you may regret starting.

 

[Steve803]

It seems like OP wants to do the repair himself. Probably in insurance terms the boat is a write off and he will get a pay out. Or perhaps not.
The essential thing to know is just how the bilge keel is attached to the hull. OP says hull is intact. Might imply that the keel is in effect glued on to the outside of the hull. This would require a build up of fillets from keel to hull on each side. Picture 2 seems like that fillet has parted. If that is the case then grind away the damaged fillet of GRP and resin and replace with new lay up. The size of the fillet will dictate it's strength. So in close to the corner you can use filler of resin and micro balloons or similar. It is the surface of the fillet which will give strength. I would suggest kevlar cloth in lieu of glass. Not that expensive and very tough. Need very sharp scissors. Use epoxy for resin. The biggest challenge will be to get a decent attachment of the cloth to the hull and keel. Just a few comments on what really is a job requiring expert or serious consideration.
Now for a crazy idea. Remove both bilge keels. Cut a hole in centre of keel and fit a keel box and fabricate a ballasted center board. My little 21fter was built this way and has wonderful windward performance and very easy retrieval onto trailer. (need a swing or lift rudder also) ol'will

Thanks for the advice

 

[Steve803]

With appropriate skills and knowledge it’s probably repairable, but will cost £££. A professional could assess it, but they know they won’t get the work, so won’t bother. It’s economically unviable. Are you a club member? Most clubs have helpful and knowledgeable people in the yard. Your lack of experience needs guidance! This isn’t cosmetic, it’s structural. A bodged fix will possibly kill you, or put others in danger. Don’t get emotionally involved, walk away with the insurance money and start again.

Great advice. Thanks

 

[Steve803]

Sorry to hereabout your accident. I would probably just buy another boat, more cost effective in terms of time, money. That size of boat are regularly on the net being given away.

This is a possibility that's crossed my mind. However that leads me to my next issue of, what am I do do with a broken boat on a twisted trailer, and to make matters a bit more complicated I live at a quite remote location.

 

[Steve803]

I am the one who did similar repairs to bilge keel ... Stupid - hit breakwater stones ...

The damage was far more extensive than first appeared. Once we started cutting back to check extent - we understood it was a major job. It was not only GRP work - but we still have the cabin woodwork to replace / refit and bond in ..

I have a "love affair" with that boat as she has been with me many years through good and storm weather. She was not insured - my choice - and all costs were on me. The final cost would probably bounce somewhere near the 3000 quid mark, with wood work still to complete ... for a boat only worth that on the market in UK ... ok here in Latvia probably 6000. Work was done on a private cash basis ... if it had been professionally done ? I would guess double that cost.

First I would be onto Your and Other Drivers Insurance ... the boat was on a trailer connected to your vehicle. If the Other Drivers insurance want to declare a 'Write Off' or "Total Constructive Loss" as some Ins call it ... then you push to keep ownership .... I did this with a Snapdragon 23 that was declared TCL .. they agreed a figure - I was paid - the money then paid all repairs and yard fees. Boat was better than before !
But if Insurance agree to repair - then get it done professionally - seriously ... its hell of a job to do ... one which you may regret starting.

Thanks, I think I will try to badger the experts again. I'm sure then it will be a write off, then my legal team can deal with the removal cost and hopefully we will start fresh with another one. The next time it will be going straight to the chosen harbour!! Thanks again.

 

[B27]

Looking at the OP's pictures, I'm curious as to how the boat is built and what might have been done to it.

Are the keels iron?
Looking at the pics, they could be GRP stubs and iron at the bottom?

I wonder if it's a fairly conventional hull with bolted-on keels, which someone has added GRP around the tops of the keels, in an attempt to fair the keels, fix leaks or stiffen the hull/keel joint?
The damage seems to stop very abruptly at the hull body.
Yet the keels would look to have flexed a lot relative to the hull?

I would think the whole structure needs a good dose of looking at by someone familiar with boats and broken GRP.

Rebuilding the bottom of the hull is not particularly hard IMHO, but it becomes a big job if there is an interior to reinstate to a good standard.

It is a big job and need to be done right. To get insurance you may need a survey in the future, so it might be worth talking to a surveyor now.
There are obvious safety implications!

It would be useful to see pictures of the inside.
If you can name the design and builder you may get more specific advice.

Many of the smaller bilge keel boats were lightly built and have now had long tough lives.
GRP can always be repaired, but it's not always economic or sensible unfortunately.

 

[bedouin]

I wouldn't even think of trying to do it yourself. Presumably the driver had insurance so you can claim off that.

I am no expert but I am afraid the boat may be a write off - with damage like that it can be very hard to know how serious it is until you take it apart to find out. Probably best just to take the cash and look for another one.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Also, being a "classic" is not so important in the boating world. It gets you admiration, but nothing else! A "classic" might be easier to sell if in sailable condition, but it won't fetch any more than a non-classic of similar size and age.