THOSE OF US WITH BOATS IN THE MED

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I wouldn't be so sure about that Mike.
What you say is the right approach, not at all sure politicians will take that route though...

I guess you could be right. The first country that opens up for mass tourism will get a huge number of visitor bookings but I still think its madness to allow hundreds of thousands of potentially infected people into your country

After all that is exactly how the virus was transmitted into countries in the first place

 

[longjohnsilver]

I guess you could be right. The first country that opens up for mass tourism will get a huge number of visitor bookings but I still think its madness to allow hundreds of thousands of potentially infected people into your country

After all that is exactly how the virus was transmitted into countries in the first place

Not if every traveller is tested before entry, I think you were talking earlier about Emirates airways doing a test with results in 10 minutes . If that works, then opening borders becomes more realistic.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Not if every traveller is tested before entry, I think you were talking earlier about Emirates airways doing a test with results in 10 minutes . If that works, then opening borders becomes more realistic.

Yes that was my earlier point. Getting tested just before you travel or being able to demonstrate immunity through a recent test seems to me to be one way to ease international travel. Of course in the long run, its going to be widespread vaccination that enables travel

 

[mcanderson]

Latest from Riviera Radio on the Cote d'Azur

Estrosi participates in video conference with Head of State - After having participated Thursday morning, in a video conference organized by the French President with 22 mayors across France. The mayor of Nice Christian Estrosi says that he welcomes “the progress obtained in preparation for the end of lockdown” announcing that “all National Education staff will be tested ahead of resuming their posts”.

Estrosi, also added that another positive point to come out of the meeting was the “possibility” that “under the supervision from the Prefect and the Regional Health Agency” certain business sectors could “reopen earlier than elsewhere”. The mayor of Nice added that he was “notably thinking of the tourism industry” crucial to the region’s economy.
Emmanuel Macron is set to meet with unions of the hotel and restaurant industry this morning at 9.30am. Riviera Radio will be keeping you updated throughout the morning on the outcome of this meeting.

The Elysée said ahead of Thursday’s conference "The management of the crisis will be more and more decentralised and mayors in particular will be at the helm,”

During the meeting, the President reportedly said that deconfinement will not be done in a "regionalised manner". The President's staff said that a national framework will be set but room for maneuver will be given to local elected officials, particularly in regard to school re-openings and local transport

 

[Portofino]

I just looked that up. If an major airline can do a test in 10 minutes, why is the UK p@ssing about with swabs up your nose and 24 - 48 results plus all the associated admin?

Because its 8HIT ........UK GOV is seeking a refund .

How does a coronavirus antibody home test kit work, and how do I get one?


Wish folks would in planning returning to there boats in the Med would adhere to the basic principle of .....
Not getting your self into a situation where you are inhaling someone else’s exhaled air .
Or uber minimising it as much as possible. Going through an airport is contrary to that pure madness ,

The key to a unlocking tourism in the Med is the r number the transmission rate , more syncing it with where you are traveling from to where you are traveling to .
Respecting social distances , local hand hygiene when you arrive .

Should a workable “spot test “for want of a better word turn up , what will happen @ the rtn leg airport if it records a +ve ??

Picture this ......budget carrier - 3 or 4 rtn flights from London to Palma same plane 180 capacity ....ok the Micky mouse intermittent seating plan
call it 90 pax so by 9 pm it’s had ( say 4 trips ) so 720 potential virus hosts ..... sorry passengers ......as Mike says they passed the ( publicity stunt ) of a pre flight test of there blood *** in the departure area somewhere .
But somebody’s walked it in on there shoe , or via a glance or airborne it’s on the under surface of a piece of hand luggage a magazine or ladies handbag for example.
They call the flight .
Proud as punch feeling safe now , you strut to the gate ....staff are masked up , gloved up even eye protection , ......all looks pretty impressive.

As you cram into your place or walk down the aisle you notice the next person across bending down to attend to a lace undone .
That lace was trampled into the carpet into the centre aisle .You are on row 15 ....so 1/2 the carpet has virus .
The mag person a little unsteady had brushed the infected mag ( picked up earlier on a motorway services on the way to the airport it was sneezed on full on gobbed on by a highly infected person ) all along the seat top corners on one side .
Evey one else that followed ...most touched the same area.

Remember the UV contact tracing post ^^^^ kids in a class by 4 pm the teacher looked like a clown under UV .

Person who picked it up from there shoe is one of those who is up and down , opening the locker phaffing ....lost her purse when the trolly dolly’s came round ....had to get up again open the locker rummage + move everyone else stuff in that locker touching your stuff ...you are say near her .
You get up later to find your specs etc .
Anyhow by the end of the measly 2 1/2 flight ( not talking 8 hrs ) to Palma you have rubbed your eyes phaffing attempting to clean your specs . Her virus is now multiply in you entering via your conjunctiva ....your eyes .

No saying everyone on that plane that day is gonna get symptoms not at all just debunking the pre flight 10 min blood test .if such a thing is ever reliable.

As said some now tell me if 10 % or 5 % get ill while on holiday ......how are they gonna qualify for the return flight ?

The best way is to assume everyone is potentially a carrier and avoid ALL situations where crowds gather .

*** Not happy with Joe public messing with there own blood , how ever tiny and good intentioned in any crowded public place .I mean think of HIV + ve .......the plaster comes off during the flight and the wound is inadvertently opened ....perhaps a minor undiagnosed blood dyscrasia leads to further blood droplets on the seat etc .

Asking for other blood bourne disease transmission .

Playing doctor’s and nurses in the privacy of your own home fine .

 

[petem]

According to my mate who read an article in the "Olive Press" that said that someone who works in duty free had had a letter from someone who works for the airport who didn't say where they got their info from, flights will resume in September!

Get a grip guys!

 

[PowerYachtBlog]

By what I know so far, Italy provisional plan is to open its borders for movement of persons (in and out of country including airports) for March 21. While Malta has an ETA tied up with Vaccine. The first Vaccine is rumored to arrive for the fall of 2020, and the first lot will go for medics, soldiers, and Police forces. So that would apply Vaccine and commercial availability in 21.
So I think while I think (and hope) we have seen the worst of Covid-19 lock downs, normality as at 1/2020 is still far away.

 

[Clancy Moped]

According to my mate who read an article in the "Olive Press" that said that someone who works in duty free had had a letter from someone who works for the airport who didn't say where they got their info from, flights will resume in September!

Get a grip guys!

That someone in the airport received a letter from the airports operator, Aena, feel free to ignore the information.

 

[MapisM]

By what I know so far, Italy provisional plan is to open its borders for movement of persons (in and out of country including airports) for March 21.

I haven't heard of anything along those lines that can be qualified as a plan, even provisional.
As opposed to rumors and journalist speculations, of which there's plenty of course, as always.

At the moment, it is indeed very likely (almost confirmed) that upon the first lockdown release, TENTATIVELY scheduled for May 4th, we should still have rather strict constraints.
Among others, no inter-regional movements - aside, as already happens now, from special/urgent reasons, which don't include tourism/pleasure.
A fortiori, cross border movements will also fall under these restrictions, obviously.
But when and how regional and/or cross border movements will be allowed, AFAIK at the moment is anyone's guess.

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Yes that was my earlier point. Getting tested just before you travel or being able to demonstrate immunity through a recent test seems to me to be one way to ease international travel. Of course in the long run, its going to be widespread vaccination that enables travel

Looks like the UK is indeed thinking along these lines. Article from today's Times

 

[Portofino]

Looks like the UK is indeed thinking along these lines. Article from today's Times

Contradict its self ......feels like it’s written by a arty jurno with a CSE grade 5 in science .

Says get a test up to 48 hrs before .......presume - ve ...right .If so why the need for “ facial coverings “ ??

So are folks free from spreading it via exhaled droplets after this test or not?

Incubation period means it’s useless .

Any test has to be specific ....to C19 not other covid viruses and C19 mutates .So you could be barred from the airport with some other corona virus a normal strain .Never banned flue patients or common cold before .

What about contact transmission from hard objects , on your shoe , on a magazine ,Or you are sat in transfer bus / taxi inhaling the drivers C19 virus ridden exhaled air ?
He picked it up Sun pm , then ( diligently the air port tested him Mon Am = - ve then as the “test “is not sensitive enough for 8 hrs inside him ) So they cleared him for work .......Then he spent all week spreading it to everyone he transferred around the place .....bless em at least they have a so called “ health passport “ in there breast pockets !


Basic premise going Fwds is ( happy to repeat btw )
Don,t volunteer to get into a situation whereby you inhale strangers exhaled air .

 

[John100156]

I know its a killer virus but we just don't know enough about its transmission, it will not be until a year hence that we will know what its really all about, by which time it is hoped we will have some form of reliable test and a decent vaccination regime in place.

I personally think just taking sensible and reasonable precautions, like frequent hand washing, properly managed gloves and masks - only in certain circumstances and of course social distancing, where we can, is really all that we should be considering at this time.

When you consider the actual size and weight of viruses, I expect they could linger remaining suspended in air, or even rise on thermal draughts for quite a while after being exhaled, how long the virus remains viable in air I don't know, I expect it would prefer a decent host and temperature in the order of 37C to proliferate and I also expect it would need a decent dose of live virus for it to take hold. So we shouldn't be overly scared, just sensible and careful.

Unless frequent and highly accurate testing becomes readily available, I do agree I think it could be very dangerous indeed, leading people into a false sense of security. We just don't know enough yet!

I personally would be less likely to fly even with recirc air HEPAs in place than to take the Chunnel. If I had to fly, I would probably use a mask and gloves in the airport and whilst on board, not buy any refreshments and would be careful how I removed and disposed of the mask and gloves when the journey is over and would then apply some alcohol based hand sanitiser. I expect a mask will need to be removed at passport control.

 

[Orthop]

One of my colleagues worked in a testing center of C19. A positive tested patient wanted to return to work in his hospital after 14 days of quarantine. This requires two negative tests within 24 h. It took over 10 days, because every day the tests showed a different result, One day positiv the next day negativ and so on. What I want to say is that you can discuss the quality of the tests... (the test itself and the way how it was done...)

@ Portofino: also the AK home tests should be discussed controversial.

Than I don't know any study or paper that says that after an infection with C19 you have immunity ... perhaps anybody can tell me...

 

[John100156]

In terms of tests/medical research, I believe we are in almost the embryonic stage of understanding how this virus works, so nowhere even near the infancy stage. I am utterly amazed at the progress being made in such a short time by our excellent scientists who rarely get credited.

Remember, I am just an engineer and not a Virologist, but I have designed many labs for well over 35 years now and have worked with some of the key Profs involved in this epidemic. Like when the influenza strain (H7N9) was given the highest possible threat for viruses at risk of causing a worldwide pandemic, known to most of us mere mortals as Avian Flu, we were immediately mobilised as part of a design team to build a Containment Level 4 Laboratory somewhere in London, I can't say where. Yet that threat fizzled-out and thankfully and we never moved to Construction stage thank goodness.

Basically, among influenza A viruses there were 17 different types of (H)aemagglutinin, from H1 to H17 and nine different types of (N)euraminidase, from N1 to N9 which I believe are related to the spikes and attachments often seen on virus images. So each virus has one type of H (such as H7) and one type of N (such as N9). The H7N9 strain emerging in China ironically did not make birds ill, but has been killing about a third of infected humans. The H5N1 strain we experienced not so long ago on the other hand, evolved to kill birds and 'some' humans infected from these birds.

Seasonal influenza 'A' strains (There are three I think A. B and C) currently circulating in humans are H1N1 (Killed an estimated 20 to 50 million people worldwide. It was ironically and erroneously called “Spanish flu”) and H3N2 which are bad and can kill have 'changed' a lot since their first introduction into humans. That's the scary bit. Vaccines can be used to prevent flu, but it’s critical I believe to have the H and N identified to create/provide immunity,

NOW: I have no idea how H and N are relevant to C-19, but it just illusttrates the immense complexity and range of viruses, so we really must just be patient, obedient (hardest bit) and await the science without panicking! Sadly dealing with the dire consequence of this epidemic and taking sensible measures to avoid contamination.

So, right or wrong, we MUST LEAVE IT TO THE EXPERTS AND IMO JUST FOLLOW THEIR BEST ADVICE. ALBEIT MAYBE IMPERFECT AT THIS STAGE, They WILL sort it.....

 

[lambohill]

Subscribe to read | Financial Times


France and Spain have outlined their Lockdown easing measures.
France outlines lifting from May 11 in stages with beaches closed until at least 1st June, Spain a 4 stage system running until end of June. After these dates still restrictions.
Restricted provencal movement for residents during this process.

Whilst it is positive, with restaurants and cafes re opening to a degree, I cannot see open to internationals for a while after.
Uk is in a worse place and a few weeks after these dates at best.
If UK goes 2 weeks after Spain that would be mid July. The concern will then be, although France and Spain will be open, will they want to see persons from outside?

 

[mcanderson]

Monaco’s plan

Speaking on Monaco Info this evening Monaco's Minister of State Serge Telle has said that from the 4th May there will be three phases. For a progressive end to the lockdown.
The first phase from the 4th will see people able to circulate freely in the Principality and return to work. Shops will be able to reopen respecting strict health measures, hairdressers and beauty salons will be open on appointment. Private yachts will be able to circulate from 9am to 8pm respecting limits in place by the police maritime . Building sites will reopen again under strict health measures.
The second phase from the 11th will see educational establishment reopen progressively for primary, secondary education and higher education. Nursery schools will not be reopening.
Depending on the success of the first two phases and the continual control over the virus the third and final phase could see from 1st June "non essential" establishments reopen such as bars, restaurants, cafes, beaches, cinemas and swimming pools and gyms.
From May 4th Masks will be obligatory on public transport and strongly advised when out and about. Gel sanitizer will be made available however wearing gloves is not advised by the health authorities as they are thought to give a "false sense of security".
Testing will continue in the form of nasal swabs and eventually blood tests, as and when they are confirmed to be 100% reliable.
Serge Telle confirmed that a peak in Covid-19 had not been seen in Monaco and that thanks to health personnel and the goodwill of people respecting the measures in place the situation was under control.
The phases will be carried out in a"stop and go" way in order to control the situation at the end of each phase.
Serge Telle concluded that we must learn to live with the virus, remain vigilant respect barrier gestures and social distancing measures.

 

[vas]

looks like there's a EU wide consensus to an extent. Our useless PM yesterday presented a similar route:
4th May free movement without sending SMS or carrying a special form, small shops/hair salons (not so sure why all countries have to state them separately...)
11th May final class of secondary education (the 17yolds going to have their equiv. A-level exams in June)
1st June bars restaurants, hotels, organised beaches, etc. That's when they expect to lift the ban to visiting isles.
all that with certain rules on persons/m2 for each type of activity, % of customers in hotels, outside seating for restaurants with set distances between tables and max # of ppl per table
No clear mention on tourism, nor on lifting leasure boating activities.

V.

 

[mcanderson]

Specifically on boats


Phase One - The first phase from the 4th will see people able to circulate freely in the Principality and return to work. Shops will be able to reopen respecting strict health measures, hairdressers and beauty salons will be open on appointment. Private yachts will be able to circulate from 9am to 8pm respecting limits in place by the police maritime. Building sites will reopen again under strict health measures.

Now Monaco doesn't have the longest coastline.....

 

[Portofino]

Once the “ R “ numbers the transmission rates end up near enough equivalent as I said countries will open up the internal borders amongst each other .

It ain't going away and private boating is not particularly a crowd gathering activity with multiple strangers , more family units who have been together anyhow so in theory shouldn’t put upward pressure on the R .

Nor is knocking about in your foreign homes .

 

[mcanderson]

Not crowd gathering, have you forgotten the Lerins in the summer holidays!

We need to learn to live with this and not just by hiding from it.