The major restoration of Chance (Token) James Silver Western Isles Motor sailer

[jstarmarine]

You’ve asked for comments so here goes.

What I find most interesting about these restorations the small technical details and practical applications of actually how you go about some of the work. For instance, I have little experience in steaming wood and so some details as to how you construct the steam box, generate the steam,what wood you are using, how green it is, how you actually manipulate it into place before it cools down and goes stiff again et cetera. That’s just one example of something I would find very interesting. It might seem every day ordinary work to you but some of the tricks and techniques of boat building that I’ve picked up over the years have been from boatyards and professionals that I’ve worked alongside and have become invaluable in the restoration and maintenance of our own boats. To me that’s what makes restoration videos interesting.

Hi John,
Yes, restorations are interesting on many different levels from the basic smallest jobs to the larger structural jobs of which I have done many over the past 45 years that I have been a boat builder. Steaming ribs and in some cases planks into a number of different shapes and angles takes many years of experience to master and in some cases a few failures as well.

As for steam boxes I made one up when I which an apprentice and it is still servicing me well to this day. However, I am going to many to make an extension to my original steam box to make it long enough for Chances ribs and planks to go into it as the original steam box is only 8ft long and I am going to need one twice as long for Chances ribs and for the sections of beam shelf I need to replace in Chance when the time comes to do that job. The rib job is my first priority job to get the old ribs out and get the new green oak ribs made up and steamed in place so that my brother and I can get them in and then make a start on the planking.

As to how green does the oak have to be, the greener the better, it is best if the tree is felted in the late summer when the oak is at its greenest. then cut and steam it as some as you can after that. You steam the oak for about an hour per inch thickness and you have to move bloody quickly from the steam box to get it in place before it cool down too much. So you get all the tools and spare tools ready and then go for it.

Ribbing out a boats hull is very satisfying as you can see the whole boat come to life in front of you as you steam in the ribs and give the boat form.

When I do the ribs in Chance I will have a video on how we do the job and how it is important to do it correctly.

Regards

Simon
Owner of Chance

 

[jstarmarine]

If you can persuade the previous owner to part with the bits that seems the best option, otherwise it's spending a lot at Davey Co or getting things custom made, both are likely to cost far more than purchasing the originals.

Hi Penfold,

I have tried that course of action without success and at the end of the day much of the old items would have to be replaced as much of it was galvanised steel and any other items may well be worn out in any case and so gone to the lengths I am going too with the restoration, I might as well start off with new parts made to the original specs and that way I will know I can trust the new part not to break. I know very well it is going to be expensive to make one items. But that part of the challenge of restoring old classic boats. It is a way of keeping the past alive for future generations and to keep our maritime heritage going.

Regards

Simon
Owner of Chance

 

[jstarmarine]

Having cut out the broken piece of wood from this door frame it is time to let in a piece of Mahogany that is a close match to the existing colour of the original mahogany.




This is the only damage on this door, so when it is planed down and sanded back and a little bit of stained varnish it will match the surrounding wood.




A least this is a start with more small and larger repairs to come has we go through the large number doors we have to do that came out of Chance.

 

[jstarmarine]

So far, we have removed much of the interior furniture to gain access to the inside of the hull to inspect the condition of the planking and to inspect the condition of ribs throughout the boat. What we found was that the forward part of the boat, that is from the stem to as far back as the galley the ribs were in good condition and will only need washing down to come clean and then get a few coats of primer and then undercoat and finally either white or cream gloss to finish off the paint work in that part of the boat. However, that is where the good part ends because from then on it is a different story as many of the ribs in the main cabin are broken along the line of the turn of the bilge. Not all the ribs are broken, in this area there are 12 ribs aside, all but one on the starboard are broken, however, on the port side 8 out of 12 ribs are broken. So, there are going to be a lot of work that needs doing in this area alone to give back this part of the boat its original strength.
The frames as far as we can see are in good order and just need cleaning and painting when the time comes.
We have yet to find out what is hiding behind the fuel and water tanks in the cockpit as we have not had time so far to remove these tanks as they are heavy steel tanks and will need the help of the yard owner with his crane to lift them out next time we are at Chance. Then we can inspect the hull and ribs and frames and see what condition they are in.
Go aft from the cockpit it is a different story. this end of the boats hull is a complete mess of broken doubled and sistered ribs on the starboard side and only the port side aft of the cockpit is in the condition, the ribs and frames are as the boat was build, 2 x single ribs between the frames and none of them doubled up. There are a couple that need replacing that is due to repairs done in the past where the repairers split the ribs due to drilling undersize holes for fixings.

I know, it will appear to some people why clean the bilge out now, my boat builder who did my apprenticeship 45 years ago said to me if the bilges are clean, you will not lose anything, and the boat will smell clean and the will make it easier to work in. So, while some of us will be working on other parts of the restoration, a couple of people can be cleaning out the bilges and removing the last of the ballast and then wash out and clean the bilge and then lay down some new temporary floorboards.

 

[jstarmarine]

I badly injured my left ankle which as put me off any heavy physical work for 6 weeks

Last weekend while working on my other project boat in my yard I badly injured my left ankle which as put me off any heavy physical work, however, it will not stop me from getting some work done of other projects that do not me to stand to do them.
Jobs like rubbing down the bits that were brought back from Chance over the past few months which are in my workshop.
I had made a lot of plans for the next few months which now have to be amended. The main job that is going to have to be amended is the removal broken ribs and the rotten planks that are going have to be replaced before we can move Chance back to Essex to be near my workshop.
So I am going to have to get some help to do the job while I can not get in the boat to do the job myself.
So if anyone knows of anyone who can help in the Preston area please DM me.

 

[burgundyben]

Oh. Tgats a bumner. I fell off mine into the yard and broke an arm.

I only realisedxa few days ago that youre doing 2 boats, Chance and Mai Star.

 

[tillergirl]

Bad luck. I thought I was complaining with an attack of tennis elbow, arthritis and RSI in the right elbow which was so painful that I had to try to eat my Corn Flakes with my left arm (very messy!). But that sounds very nasty. Dare I say you need to take it easy please.

 

[jstarmarine]

Oh. Tgats a bumner. I fell off mine into the yard and broke an arm.

I only realisedxa few days ago that youre doing 2 boats, Chance and Mai Star.

Hi Ben,
Two boats at different ends of the country, one close to home (Mai Star II) and the other (Chance ) just north of Preston in Lancashire. Chance in Lancashire is going to have to go on the back burner for a while, while I regain the use of my feet again. Doctors say 6 to 8 weeks. I was hoping to have Chance in a movable condition by then. No way without some help from some people.

 

[jstarmarine]

Finally back on my feet again, although not completely back to square one, they are a lot better and I can drive again. So back to work next week and get work done on the jobs that have been sidelined for the past 2 weeks. This means, although I can not go up ladders for a few weeks while I get the strengthen back in my ankle muscles. I can walk short distances and can do bench work while sitting on a chair to do some of the smaller tasks which need to be done on Chance's doors and other items which are in the workshop.

Once job which will take some time to sort out will be to set up my dovetail jig to make the new drawer frames for the drawers that are beyond repair as they are rotten in places where they were left in position and got wet and enclosed then let nature do the rest. The drawers from Chance are all rotten in one place or other apart from the drawer fronts which appear to have been spared from getting rotten. So at least the mahogany fronts will not have to be replaced. Which is a saving grace. Trying to find the same mahogany that the rest of the interior was made from would be a headache if not impossible to source now. As we have taken much of the interior out of Chance now apart from the transverse bulkheads which are still in position to keep the shape of the boat and also to define the cabins. The fuel and water tanks which we did not have time to remove last time we were at Chance. The rest of the interior is now clear.

Now the hard work begins with removing the broken ribs and replacing the rotten planks and making the hull strong once more to be able to move the boat on transport back to Essex.

So now there will have to be a work schedule drawn up to do the work in a logical order and use our time the most efficiently to cut down on wasted time and resources. So now down to the planning stage which while my ankle gets better I will do over the next couple of weeks with help from my family.

 

[jstarmarine]

Chances' doors getting sorted, some getting a sand down and others getting repaired and others getting a complete rebuild

The doors in the centre of this photo are the first of the small doors that have been repaired as necessary and then just been sanded down ready to get their first coat of thinned varnish




Some of the other small doors have not faired as well and will need some replacement parts made for them, it some cases more than one piece, others just need just one side of the door.





Other small doors just needed gluing back together as the old glue as given up and the small wedges in the tenons are not enough to hold them together any longer.




A small amount of cleaning up the joints and a small amount of modern glue and gentle cramping together and then a quick sanding down when the glue is cured and then they can be put with the other doors to be varnished




However, these pair of doors are not so good as they are either broken or rotten and in the case of these two doors they are both rotten and broken, so these two doors will have to be completely rebuild




This door is rotten in the centre of this photo




This door is rotten and as broken

 

[Rosneath]

The port side in the aft is has it was when Chance was built in 1948 with single ribs and no doubled or sistered ribs in sight




The starboard side on the other hand is full of doubled and sistered ribs.So at sometime in the past there was a lot of work done to this side. There most have been a lot of broken ribs and rather than replace the broken ribs just added extra ribs. A short term job and one that is going to be corrected when the ribs are replaced with complete length ribs from the deck to keel. The main job will be to remove the deck covering or edging boards so that the ribs can be pushed down from the deck and steamed into position and held there while the copper nails are driven through the new ribs and roved into place.





This is the pile of wood that has come out of the galley area port and starboard sides the cupboard unit on the starboard and settee to port and the base unit up against the engine bay bulkhead. Also the heads compartment and the last of the wood in the aft cabin that was in the way of the hull.





Now that the last of the wood which was on this bulkhead was removed the outline of the original berth is now clearly seen. This berth is going to go back in and a very similar berth is going to go back in the starboard side, which from other James Silver's of Chance's age had to large single berth in the aft cabin.






The layout of Chance appears to be one of a two berth cruising Motorsailer with a single crew cabin in the forepeak. This appears to be the case as the forepeak appears to have skin fittings to lead you to believe that there was a sea toilet in that cabin along with a vanity sink and its own small wardrobe that was separate from the rest of the interior.

The galley was set out just behind the forecabin and aft of the galley area the main cabin for entertaining guests and the aft cabin set out of the owner of the day.

hi
new to forum i have been researching james a silver for a number of years i met chris jardine once and lent him some photos of silver yachts when he was heading up the silver registration.Unfortunatly he gave up due to ill heath .He said he would pass on the hard drive but it never arrived.i am a certain age and have some time on my hands but not very good on the computer would someone volunteer to help me.
My imput would be over 100 hundrred photos regarding silvers .my father was a manager my sister worked in the office and i was a apprentice boatbuilder from 1964 till 1969
Regards john Willis

 

[jstarmarine]

hi
new to forum i have been researching james a silver for a number of years i met chris jardine once and lent him some photos of silver yachts when he was heading up the silver registration.Unfortunatly he gave up due to ill heath .He said he would pass on the hard drive but it never arrived.i am a certain age and have some time on my hands but not very good on the computer would someone volunteer to help me.
My imput would be over 100 hundrred photos regarding silvers .my father was a manager my sister worked in the office and i was a apprentice boatbuilder from 1964 till 1969
Regards john Willis

Hi John,
Whereabout, do you live as I am in North Essex, May be we could set up a new James Silver register and get input from other James Silver owners and together we could get a more detailed register of the Boats and what as become of them over the years,

I am looking for photos of my James Silver Western Isles 40 ft Motor Sailer, I hope you can help me with my research. May be in your collection of Photos you may have a photo of my boat, So far I have come up empty handed with other sources.

Kind Regards

Simon Papendick
Owner of Chance currently under restoration by my family and I

 

[jstarmarine]

Rebuilding the small galley cupboard doors, first taking them apart cleaning the tenons and gluing them together with modern glue.

Using these clamps in the reverse way, which you can do with this type of clamp with a little pressure the joints come apart




A little at a time the tenons come apart



Then off completely and now ready for a clean up of the tenons



These tenons had small wedges to tighten up the joints which are left in place so they can be used again when a small amount of glue is placed on the wedge before the tenons are re-fitted

 

[jstarmarine]

Setting up my mortise cutter to make new parts for the door frames for Chance


Having got this as a Christmas from my wife, It is now time to get it set up for making the new mortise and tenon joints for the doors which have got either rotten or broken parts in them.




With a bit of trail and error and a lot of patience will get the handle on this piece of equipment and will soon be making the mortise part of the joints




This is one of the original mortise and tenon joint which this new piece of equipment will be making in due course

 

[burgundyben]

Nice work. I have a mortising machibe. Very handy.

I started the other Silver thread when the previous Silver website went away so that owners and interested parties could get in touch.

Not that I'm a Silver owner, but would be delighted to see a new register set up.

 

[penfold]

hi
new to forum i have been researching james a silver for a number of years i met chris jardine once and lent him some photos of silver yachts when he was heading up the silver registration.Unfortunatly he gave up due to ill heath .He said he would pass on the hard drive but it never arrived.i am a certain age and have some time on my hands but not very good on the computer would someone volunteer to help me.
My imput would be over 100 hundrred photos regarding silvers .my father was a manager my sister worked in the office and i was a apprentice boatbuilder from 1964 till 1969
Regards john Willis

Where abouts are you? I'm sure something can be worked out.

 

[jstarmarine]

This week I will be starting to rebuild the cupboard doors that were rotten in some parts, so although they are going to be a slightly different colour mahogany with a little bit of staining to get the colour more to the rest of the doors, When doing any restoration look will try to match as much as possible.

 

[jstarmarine]

A couple of the smaller doors are in need of new parts to be made to replace broken or rotten parts. Others just need taking apart and modern glue used to fix the joints.




This is the first of the small doors getting glued together after the joints were cleaned and modern glue put on the mortise and tenon joints before being sash clamped together for the glue to cure and then sanded down





The first two doors on the work bench clamped and left for the glue to cure and then they will be given their light sanding and then got ready to go with the others to be varnished.

 

[jstarmarine]

So the varnishing starts with the first of the repaired and sanded doors getting their thinned coats of varnish

So it begins, the long road of daily varnishing until these doors look like them should be



As it can be seen the wood is taking up a lot of thinned varnish as they have not seen a varnish brush in over 20 years



The colour is coming through the coats of varnish, if when the rest of the bulkheads and cupboard and locker fronts look like these doors it will be a very lovely sight down below in the cabins and when the Wheelhouse and aft cabin are varnished again as they should it will be a beautiful sight

 

[burgundyben]

Good that you can crack on with the other bits while not near the boat