The Ady Gil: Who was in the wrong

[jamesjermain]

Jaw Jaw not war war for a start. Ultimately only pressure from world organisations will have any effect and so far Japan has ignored them all. A few fragile boats under their bows isn't going to stop them either.

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

What tactics could Sea Shepherd use that would both be effective and meet with your approval?

Assuming that the Japanese don't wish the Whales to become extinct (they like to eat them after all) then collecting some evidence that the current levels of Whale killing will lead to the extinction of the Whales would seem to be the best way to stop the killing.

Not as much fun as burning a ton of diesel in a good old Nautical game of touch rugby but more effective.

I pressume the Japanese hunt to a quota. So presumably every Whale Sea Shepherd 'save' leads to another whale being killed later. Or is that flawed logic?

 

[Sybarite]

I didn't get that impression James. The AG was stopped or near to it. They were also sitting roughly parallel to the whaler at the start of the incident. Because they were stopped, they needed forward way to get steerage. I do not think that they would have tried deliberately to put a light composite and very expensive vessel right in the path of a heavy steel ship, endangering their lives at the same time. I think that they may have tried to accelerate across the bows but the Japanese ship then turned back to port to follow their move.

They were also being heavily bombarded by two water hoses which must have obscured their vision with a disorientating effect.

 

[Sybarite]

This is useful. If you watch AGs position it only starts to move at 00:08 in the film and is struck at or about 00:16. 8 seconds is not a long time to get steerage in a 60' boat. Ii appears that once they realized - under the heavy hosing - they were going to get rammed they tried to move out of the way. If you look at the footage taken from the SS-BB, you see the SM turning then back to port to ensure ramming.

In the clip taken on the AG, the skipper gives an instruction to stop and save fuel. The other crew member moves forward to pass on the message. This supposes that the helmsman was down below. He probably did not have the same all round view here - as well as being doused with water - and therefore may not have been able to react as quickly as he might otherwise have done.

 

[webcraft]

Not as much fun as burning a ton of diesel in a good old Nautical game of touch rugby but more effective.

I pressume the Japanese hunt to a quota. So presumably every Whale Sea Shepherd 'save' leads to another whale being killed later. Or is that flawed logic?

It may indeed be flawed logic. For one reason or another the Japanese have failed to meet their quota since at least the 2005-2006 season. Sea Shepherd claim to have saved over 1300 whales in the last three seasons. Reports in the media would seem to at least partially bear this claim out Here's a couple from the last two seasons:


2007-2008

JAPAN'S whaling fleet will return to port tomorrow on Tuesday after killing little more than half its intended catch in the Antarctic because of harassment by activists, officials say.

The 8044-tonne Nisshin Maru mother ship is due to dock in Tokyo tomorrow morning, ending a five-month voyage, while the five other fleet vessels will dock at various ports in the capital and western Japan.

Source


2008-2009

Whale watchers and marine mammal enthusiasts around the world might be pleased to learn that Japan fell substantially short of its minke whale hunt quota, thanks largely to disruptive efforts of the Sea Shepherd Conservation Society earlier this season in the Antarctic region.

Three vessels from the whaling fleet returned home this week and reported a final tally of 679 minke whales and one fin whale for a five-month effort, much of which was spent in clashes with the crew of the Steve Irwin, of the Sea Shepherd fleet.

Japan's goal had been to kill up to 935 minke whales and 50 fin whales. Shigeki Takaya, a fisheries agency spokesman, told the Associated Press: "This season's catch was reduced as a result of the interference by protesters."

Source

- W

 

[TradewindSailor]

This is useful. If you watch AGs position it only starts to move at 00:08 in the film and is struck at or about 00:16. 8 seconds is not a long time to get steerage in a 60' boat. Ii appears that once they realized - under the heavy hosing - they were going to get rammed they tried to move out of the way. If you look at the footage taken from the SS-BB, you see the SM turning then back to port to ensure ramming.

In the clip taken on the AG, the skipper gives an instruction to stop and save fuel. The other crew member moves forward to pass on the message. This supposes that the helmsman was down below. He probably did not have the same all round view here - as well as being doused with water - and therefore may not have been able to react as quickly as he might otherwise have done.

You don't need speed to manoeuvre a twin prop vessel like the Ady Gil, nor do you have to go forwards.

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

Reports in the media would seem to at least partially bear this claim out

Ta, that totally addresses my point.

 

[30boat]

It may indeed be flawed logic. For one reason or another the Japanese have failed to meet their quota since at least the 2005-2006 season. Sea Shepherd claim to have saved over 1300 whales in the last three seasons. Reports in the media would seem to at least partially bear this claim out Here's a couple from the last two seasons:


2007-2008
Source


2008-2009
Source

- W

I'm quite flexible when it comes to the methods used against the whalers as long as animals are saved.Big problems need big measures.Simples.

 

[TradewindSailor]

If anyone's interested the Ady Gil's (ex Earthrace) specs are here:
http://www.earthrace.net/index.php?section=3

She's got twin 540hp Cummins Diesels

Dry displacement 14 tonnes

range:
The range of Earthrace depends on speed. At 6 knots she can go an incredible 13,000nm (24,000km) on one tank of biodiesel. That's over half way around the globe! Of course your crew gets grumpy at 6kn when you're in such a high speed vessel. At 25 knots she has a range of about 2,000nm (3,700km).

So ..... she was idling to save fuel was she???????????

 

[AndieMac]

Piracy is illegal, but the whaling, no matter how distasteful to some, is legal.

Whaling in Australian territorial waters is Illegal, Antartic component included!

 

[Major Catastrophe]

But also I have no sympathy with the tactics of the whale huggers.
They deliberately put themselves at risk, inviting a collision which could have caused the deaths of some or all of the crew.

Read the Sea Shepherd website and all potential crew have to sign a document to say they accept all risks, including death.

At the end of the crew application form is this bit:

VOLUNTEER WAIVER OF LIABILITY

I assume any and all risks associated with volunteering with SEA SHEPHERD CONSERVATION SOCIETY, whether on land, at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel, in any capacity in which I might serve.

I agree that I am volunteering with SEA SHEPHERD entirely upon my own initiative, risk and responsibility. I acknowledge that I am a volunteer, everything I do for SEA SHEPHERD is done as a volunteer, and I expect no wages, payment of any other form of compensation
for anything I do for SEA SHEPHERD.

I agree for myself, my heirs, executors, and administrators, to release, hold harmless, and forever discharge SEA SHEPHERD, its Board members, supporters, vessels, officers and personnel from any and all claims, demands, actions, causes of action, in law, admiralty or equity, on account of my death, or on account of any injury to me or my property, which may occur from any cause whether on land or at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel. I take full responsibility for any negligence by me. I agree that I am
fully responsible for payment of all medical expenses and other damages arising if I am injured or become ill while volunteering, whether on or off a SEA SHEPHERD vessel.

I acknowledge and understand completely that activity with SEA SHEPHERD, whether at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel, is inherently dangerous, and cannot be made safe even with the exercise of the greatest degree of care. I further
acknowledge that most of the people on the ship will be volunteers who are not professional mariners and who can be expected to make mistakes which may result in injury to me and I will take full responsibility for any injury.

I have read and completely understand the history of the SEA SHEPHERD, including being confronted by armed government forces while the SEA SHEPHERD is in the protection of marine species. I have been fully briefed with written material on how dangerous the SEA SHEPHERD campaigns can be. I have viewed the activities of the SEA SHEPHERD on video and acknowledge that there has been some "glamorization” of SEA SHEPHERD activities, but I took careful note of the actual danger exhibited on the screen. I am ready to put myself in personal danger. I also understand that I am aboard a vessel that possibly carries no insurance policy of any kind.

I understand that once I am onboard the ship I will be briefed on safety and operating procedures (while at sea or in preparation for). Any time I have a question or am uncomfortable, I will address my concerns to an officer of the ship. I agree to follow the orders of the Captain, Officer(s) and/or the Port Manager.


I have read and understand this release.

Finally they warn:

Warning:
No whiners, malcontents, mattress lovers, and wimps need apply.

 

[AndieMac]

As the court is in session, and the trial by internet is underway, we have heard at length the background (past indiscretions) of the Sea Shepherds AKA Paul Watson and his terrorist fanatics, who hold scant regard for Colregs, good seamanship and playing (attempted) bondage games with ships propellors.

On the prosecution side, we have a country who has always behaved in a very civilised and caring manner towards its Asian Pacific neighbours for the last 100 years, well maybe the last 50 years anyway ...... and always abide by international opinion and laws, in an attempt to co-exist peacefully.

 

[AndieMac]

Read the Sea Shepherd website and all potential crew have to sign a document to say they accept all risks, including death.

At the end of the crew application form is this bit:

VOLUNTEER WAIVER OF LIABILITY

I assume any and all risks associated with volunteering with SEA SHEPHERD CONSERVATION SOCIETY, whether on land, at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel, in any capacity in which I might serve.

I agree that I am volunteering with SEA SHEPHERD entirely upon my own initiative, risk and responsibility. I acknowledge that I am a volunteer, everything I do for SEA SHEPHERD is done as a volunteer, and I expect no wages, payment of any other form of compensation
for anything I do for SEA SHEPHERD.

I agree for myself, my heirs, executors, and administrators, to release, hold harmless, and forever discharge SEA SHEPHERD, its Board members, supporters, vessels, officers and personnel from any and all claims, demands, actions, causes of action, in law, admiralty or equity, on account of my death, or on account of any injury to me or my property, which may occur from any cause whether on land or at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel. I take full responsibility for any negligence by me. I agree that I am
fully responsible for payment of all medical expenses and other damages arising if I am injured or become ill while volunteering, whether on or off a SEA SHEPHERD vessel.

I acknowledge and understand completely that activity with SEA SHEPHERD, whether at sea, in port, ashore, or enroute to or from any location or vessel, is inherently dangerous, and cannot be made safe even with the exercise of the greatest degree of care. I further
acknowledge that most of the people on the ship will be volunteers who are not professional mariners and who can be expected to make mistakes which may result in injury to me and I will take full responsibility for any injury.

I have read and completely understand the history of the SEA SHEPHERD, including being confronted by armed government forces while the SEA SHEPHERD is in the protection of marine species. I have been fully briefed with written material on how dangerous the SEA SHEPHERD campaigns can be. I have viewed the activities of the SEA SHEPHERD on video and acknowledge that there has been some "glamorization” of SEA SHEPHERD activities, but I took careful note of the actual danger exhibited on the screen. I am ready to put myself in personal danger. I also understand that I am aboard a vessel that possibly carries no insurance policy of any kind.

I understand that once I am onboard the ship I will be briefed on safety and operating procedures (while at sea or in preparation for). Any time I have a question or am uncomfortable, I will address my concerns to an officer of the ship. I agree to follow the orders of the Captain, Officer(s) and/or the Port Manager.


I have read and understand this release.

Finally they warn:

Warning:
No whiners, malcontents, mattress lovers, and wimps need apply.

Theres another offence........the scoundrels have plagiarzed a waiver contract from a hard working 'bungee jumping' and sky-diving company.
They just haven't got a conscience........

 

[Bajansailor]

I noticed in the video that the Sea Shepherds all appeared to be wearing bullet proof vests (not life-jackets, which might have been more sensible?) - would a BP vest stop a whaler's harpoon? I think not.........

 

[Sybarite]

Legally ?? They were in an internationally accepted whale sanctuary. Research - Come off it. The Japanese are required to submit their whale research project in advance to the IWC and when they did were told that their programme was without value. Most of the stated tests did not require whales to be killed.

They openly flout the rules they signed up to - and they only did so because the Americans indicated they would exclude them from the Alaskan fishing grounds if they refused. As they flout them for the 23000 dolphins which they slaughter each year between September and March in a little cove at Taïgi in Japan so that they can sell their mercury rich meat which at 2000 ppm is 5000 times the legal limit of 0.4 ppm.... (See the documentary "The Cove")

People stood up in the past to end bull baiting and cock fights. At least there are people taking action here. Once this is settled we need to take on the bull-fights...!!

John

 

[Sybarite]

You need to get out of the way. Spinning a boat with twin props doesn't do that. If you watch the video from the SSBB the SM was turning hard to starboard. Going forward was as logical as any other move. It was then that the SM turned back to port again to hit the AG. Watch the video from the SS BB.

 

[Sybarite]

But it stopped a bullet for Paul Watson.

 

[AndieMac]

I understand during the last 'Cod War' in the mid 1970's, the Royal Navy sent many warships to do battle with the Icelandic fishing boats. During this time many ships were rammed, lots of injuries and 5 deaths.

These wars went on for more than 15 years

How many Colregs were contravened in the North Atlantic during that period?

Is it because the unqualified rabble in the Southern Ocean are merely whale-huggers and not the RN, that attracts the main criticism?

I could be wrong...........but I'm starting to sense a double standard!

 

[Major Catastrophe]

Theres another offence........the scoundrels have plagiarzed a waiver contract from a hard working 'bungee jumping' and sky-diving company.
They just haven't got a conscience........

Wow, I knew Aussies were tough, but I didn't know that bungee jumpers were "being confronted by armed government forces".

 

[AndieMac]

Wow, I knew Aussies were tough, but I didn't know that bungee jumpers were "being confronted by armed government forces".

I afraid the country has gone to the pack..........the old days of larikinism are fast disappearing....marshall law ruling the streets.......the only safe place these days is behind a computer keyboard