Stern-to with lazy lines

[Andrew M]

Thanks for posting up the pics, I've just sent the one of QM2 on to my parents as they were on it last week and docked on Tuesday morning.

Ta,

 

[Chumley]

If you go to Vis, don't miss a swim in Bisevo Blue Cave.
It's the best snorkeling spot of the whole Adriatic imho, well worth the short trip from Vis.

Thanks for the tip, it's already on the list

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

If you go to Vis, don't miss a swim in Bisevo Blue Cave.
It's the best snorkeling spot of the whole Adriatic imho, well worth the short trip from Vis.

Mapism, thats on my list for this year. Can you anchor close to the cave?

 

[st599]

Just use the French method.

Find a gap about 6" narrower than your boat, reverse in and give it some welly as you start to slow down. No need to worry about the bow blowing off.

Once secure, contemplate putting fenders out.

 

[Chumley]

Just use the French method.

Find a gap about 6" narrower than your boat, reverse in and give it some welly as you start to slow down. No need to worry about the bow blowing off.

Once secure, contemplate putting fenders out.

Noted

 

[BartW]

Can you anchor close to the cave?

no you can't,
the nearby shallow cove (to the west) is usually occupied, only space for 2 or 3 boats,

you best go in 2 groups,
and one group stay's on your boat, not anchored.
the visit takes only 15 minutes.

don't forget to go to the green cave when you're in the area,
your boat is on the edge to fit in there,

its on the most south east rock near the island Vis.

 

[Hardmy]

no you can't,
the nearby shallow cove (to the west) is usually occupied, only space for 2 or 3 boats,

you best go in 2 groups,
and one group stay's on your boat, not anchored.
the visit takes only 15 minutes.

don't forget to go to the green cave when you're in the area,
your boat is on the edge to fit in there,

its on the most south east rock near the island Vis.

It's not easy but IMHO possible, left of the cave entrance, with a landline:

If there is some swell, you have to paddle quickly in order to pass the place with few headroom:

BTW if you are in Vis, you could try to enter the Stinivia bay. I must admit that I didn't have the balls:

 

[BartW]

It's not easy but IMHO possible, left of the cave entrance, with a landline:

yes thats the spot that I mentioned about, room for 2..3 boats,
but rarely space left on a sunny day before 12hclock

BTW if you are in Vis, you could try to enter the Stinivia bay.

thanks for the tip V,
didn't know this beautifull spot, saw in one of your previous posts iirc.
good reason to go to Croatia with BA one day


excuses to OP for thread drift

 

[benjenbav]

Naah, why should I argue with that? We Italians have a tradition of maneuvering in style.
Frinstance, I'm told that Straulino once took the Amerigo Vespucci (the Italian Navy training vessel, a full rigged three masted ship with a 300ft+ LOA) up to London along the Thames under full sail...

But back to the point: unless I'm mistaken (I qiuckly cross-read the previous replies - apologies if it was already mentioned and I didn't see that), nobody answered the following question:

If you think about it, securing the stern line is actually the BEST way to hold the bow straight in Xwind: as soon as the upwind stern line is secured, just put the opposite (downwind, so to speak) engine in fwd.
The boat won't go anywhere, because held by the stern line, but the bow will "automatically" be held against the wind.
This way, the power you've got is actually much higher than any b/t, and you can keep the boat in her berth forever, waiting for the crew to secure the bow lines.
Just don't exaggerate with the throttle, usually it's sufficient to keep it at idle in fwd, or just a very little of acceleration if the wind is real bad. There are only 3 ways to learn that: practice, practice, practice.

The best berthing manoeuvre I have ever seen was by an Italian flagged Itama 75 in St Trop. The boats either side had drifted together a bit so that the gap was narrower than the boat, which looked to be a bit of a challenge until the skipper reversed into the gap between the bows, gave a little wiggle of the hips (the boat's not his own) to push the neighbours apart and then ghosted into the spot... to the applause of the assembled crowd.

 

[MapisM]

It's not easy but IMHO possible, left of the cave entrance, with a landline

Seconded.
Actually, I anchored once in the same place also with no landline, but it takes a LOT of chain, because the bottom is very steep. I threw out almost all of my 100m, IIRC.
And only because we were just myself and swmbo onboard, there was nobody around, and we wanted to have a swim together in the cave.
Besides, sea/wind conditions were amazingly calm. I wouldn't have left the boat in that sort of anchorage with any even slightly worse kind of weather, and/or other boats nearby.
If you can split in two groups, Bart's suggestion is much safer.

But my preferred solution, when I went there with guests, was another one.
With two caveats: a) I'm talking of almost a decade ago, so I can't guarantee that things didn't change in the meantime, and b) I always tried to go there off season. I've been there once at the beginning of August, and there was a queue outside, with a local on a small boat regulating the traffic and fetching a sort of entrance ticket. That's the only time we gave the cave a miss.
First of all, to have a good snorkeling in Bisevo (which btw I would definitely recommend, even if - as Hardmy showed - you can also enter the cave with a small tender) you should go there with fair weather. Winds from the first and second quadrant should be avoided, unless VERY weak. And in any case not after they blew for some time, 'cause the residual wave can even make the entrance dangerous. The ideal moment is after a day of NW wind, which is not unusual in summer, because after that the cave area is as flat as a swimming pool.
Secondly, timing: the best hour is in the early morning, because the sun rises right in front of the submerged entrance of the cave, and the blue water effect is at its best then.
And last but not least, back to anchorage: if you check the timetable of the small ferry which connects the island with Vis (which in my Croatian years was just in the early morning and in the afternoon), you can go to the bay just a few hundred meters N of the cave, book a table and some lobsters at the nearby restaurant, and ask them if you can leave your boat at the ferry dock, right after the ferry left. As you can guess, they're very happy to let you use the dock. Not sure if they have any authority to do so, and maybe you actually couldn't, but that doesn't seem to really mattter...
From there, it's easy to reach the cave with the tender, and either split in two groups to swim inside the cave, or enter directly with the tender, if someone is not confident enough to swim.

Below a few pics taken in the bay/dock/restaurant I'm talking about.
Enjoy the trip, and keep us posted!

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

Thanks to all for very detailed advice

 

[MapisM]

The best berthing manoeuvre I have ever seen was by an Italian flagged Itama 75 in St Trop...

LOL, that must have been the same which my marina squeezed to my port side last year, at the peak of the season.
I was moored in the (normally) last berth of the dock, next to the harbour wall corner.
But they managed to fit such a big boat in the space usually occupied by the 5-6 meters boats used for renting...
A great maneuver indeed, though tbh with some powerful bow and stern thrusters, that's cheating a bit.
Below a pic of that boat. The second one gives an idea of the position of my boat vs. the harbour wall.
Go figure how tight the Itama was...

 

[Hurricane]

The second one gives an idea of the position of my boat vs. the harbour wall.

Do you mean this berth?

 

[MapisM]

Nope, not exactly.
The dock is indeed the same, but last year we were moored where the AZ on the left of your picture is.
And the Itama 75 was on our stbd side, go figure...
The berth they gave you was indeed a luxurious one. In that part of the dock in Jul/Aug they can fit up to 50m vessels...
Though with their own anchor(s), of course. The bow lines can only be used to keep such big stuff from swinging sideways in crosswind.

PS: here's an example of some substantial stuff moored pretty much in the same place where you've been...

 

[hornblower]

Sailed in Croatia acouple of years ago and seem to remember that most lazy lines were suspended fro marker buoys rather than from the quayside. Makes life much easier.
Reverse slowly and crew (on deck amidships)picks up lazy line as you reverse past it and walks to bow , might be harder without side decks. secure line at bow and then crew swiftly nips to stern and secures stern line.

As for those ones where the lazy line is attached to the quayside, damned if i know how to do it without dockside help?

We are permanently berthed in Croatia and I have only once seen the lazy lines suspended from mooring buoys.

one method in a crosswind is to secure your windward stern line first and then go ahead on your engine. The only downside to this is if there are lazylines under the boat that might foul your prop.

 

[Chumley]

Thanks again for the tips. Needless to say there was plenty of crosswind when we needed to moor up!

The first time, Mrs C threw the windward (port) sternline and then made her way through the cockpit and up on to the foredeck via the windscreen. Unfortunately by the time she got there with the boathook in her hand the wind had shifted and was blowing the bow away to port.

I couldn't immediately think of anything sensible to do with the engines (ahead port = fouled lazy line, reverse starboard = hit pontoon) so I just smiled while the people on the next boat rushed to push us away.

The second time we decided to start with Mrs C on the foredeck. As soon as she'd picked up the line and walked to the bow, I left the helm and threw the sternline. This worked so much better because the lazy line was secured much more quickly and obviously the drift at the back end was much slower than at the front.

I wouldn't recommend this approach for a bigger boat with more windage but for our 9m it worked fine and we carried on that way without any problems for the whole week.