Steel boat as a long-term liveaboard (in a warm(er) climate).

[Brent Swain]

Good post ! My points exactly. Nothing which can be welded down should ever be bolted down, on any metal boat, yet some would blame steel as a building material ,for such a screwup. Ditto any covering which hides what is going on under it.
Can anyone show me the post where I said steel is the only choice?
Seems someone has to put words in my mouth, so they will have something to argue against (an admission that they have nothing to argue against in my actual posts.)

 

[Brent Swain]

Yes, this is point I have made many times. Steel is the best choice for full time, off the beaten path cruising, as a way of life, not for land living weekenders.

 

[Brent Swain]

I am afraid again you are talking absolute rubbish.

You seem totally out of touch with modern mass production GRP boat building. Perhaps it is a consequence of living in a relatively remote part of the world and nit being exposed to developments elsewhere. This seems to lead to you relying (as has been pointed out several times) on anecdote and (uninformed) opinion rather than fact.

Plenty of those stock plastic boats near here, in urban marinas, while their owners go to work full time, to pay for them, and their moorage, etc, while we more practical people cruise full time. They do show up here a couple of months a year.

 

[Brent Swain]

Point taken but what is the probability of a 6 mm thick steel boat hull being pierced compared with the thickness of the AWB.

The ductility of steel is more likely to bend and be dented that to be holed IMHO.

I do question how a GRP boat would look like in this event.

This picture shows no holes or leaks of any kind .In this condition , it could be sailed anywhere, safely, if somewhat slower. A plastic boat would have sunk in minutes.

You reckon these folks would have better off in a "ROBUST" stock plastic boat?

 

[rogerthebodger]

Brent I am with you but I do consider that you need the right tool for the job.

My cars are a 2 door coupe and a 4x4 used for very different jobs.

Its like a foam cored GRP boat built light for racing around the cans or a boat designed for crossing oceans and going off the beaten track.
I would not take my 2 door coupe into the wilds of africa but I would and do take my 4x4 into the wilds of africa.

A friend of mine moored next to me in Durban when the marina was destroyed. both his and mine only had minimum damage. His was sails and scratches on the hull. Mine was also sails and scratches on the hull plus bent tubular hand rails

several GRP boats were a total loss, holed and sank.

This is a blog of a friend who not only did this trip to the south atlantic but a couple of yeas before did the north west passage. Has and GRP boats done the north west passage.

http://www.sailblogs.com/member/imvubu/contents/1

www.sail-worldcruising.com/103713

http://theelfadventures.blogspot.co.za/2012/11/royal-natal-yacht-club-rnyc-sailor-of.html

 

[prv]

Has and GRP boats done the north west passage.

I believe Bob Shepton has done it both ways in his Westerly Discus

Pete

 

[Tranona]

Plenty of those stock plastic boats near here, in urban marinas, while their owners go to work full time, to pay for them, and their moorage, etc, while we more practical people cruise full time. They do show up here a couple of months a year.

Does that make them bad boats? You will also find exactly the same model boats that have undertaken long ocean passages including circumnavigations. Many of the European boats in Australia and New Zealand have got there under their own steam.

Not everybody is in a position to live aboard or cruise full time, but that does not mean they are not practical, nor that they are ignorant and inexperienced. They buy boats that suit their requirements.

Full time liveaboard/cruisers are a tiny minority and their requirements are different from. say the weekend sailor. Even then the vast majority of that small minority still choose to buy GRP boats rather than steel, for all the reasons mentioned earlier.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

...... I would not take my 2 door coupe into the wilds of africa but I would and do take my 4x4 into the wilds of africa. ....... several GRP boats were a total loss, holed and sank. ......

I have witnessed in the Rub Al-Khali and Waheba deserts people driving the most unlikely cars, more suited to city roads, routinely through the dunes with goats and family inside. Then there is the 2CV, legendary shit car that has driven everywhere.

Did several GRP yachts survive?

 

[GHA]

Full time liveaboard/cruisers are a tiny minority and their requirements are different from. say the weekend sailor. Even then the vast majority of that small minority still choose to buy GRP boats rather than steel, for all the reasons mentioned earlier.

Maybe Med / Atlantic circuit the *vast* majority. Doubt if anyone could put a figure on it but get away from the marinas and 'must do' anchorages and it's not quite like that, not that many steel around but a lot more than what's left after the 'vast majority' of plastic.

 

[Tranona]

Maybe Med / Atlantic circuit the *vast* majority. Doubt if anyone could put a figure on it but get away from the marinas and 'must do' anchorages and it's not quite like that, not that many steel around but a lot more than what's left after the 'vast majority' of plastic.

Surely if you are looking at what is in the "unpopular" places you are by definition looking at a minority. Maybe a smaller minority or even a majority - but of a very small number out of the total of long distance voyagers.

Whichever way you try and assess the number of steel cruising boats it is always going to be a small number. The constant redefinition of the population to raise the proportion of boats of a particular type really does not change anything except illustrate that people who are biased towards a particular style of cruising in different areas tend to choose boats (and hull materials) they think most suitable. Pity that some who make a choice in this way then try to brand anything else as useless.

 

[rogerthebodger]

I have witnessed in the Rub Al-Khali and Waheba deserts people driving the most unlikely cars, more suited to city roads, routinely through the dunes with goats and family inside. Then there is the 2CV, legendary shit car that has driven everywhere.

Did several GRP yachts survive?

Yes of cause several GRP boats survived but no metal boats were damaged more that getting scratched.

What need to be considered is what was the condition of a GRP boat and a steel of aluminium boat following the same type of impact.

I remember I took my mini on to South Shields beach once and had to have the mini man handled off the beach as it bottomed out and lost drive.

I don't think anyone would get a non 4x4 over this "road" despite the road sign

 

[GHA]

Surely if you are looking at what is in the "unpopular" places you are by definition looking at a minority. Maybe a smaller minority or even a majority - but of a very small number out of the total of long distance voyagers.

Whichever way you try and assess the number of steel cruising boats it is always going to be a small number. The constant redefinition of the population to raise the proportion of boats of a particular type really does not change anything except illustrate that people who are biased towards a particular style of cruising in different areas tend to choose boats (and hull materials) they think most suitable. Pity that some who make a choice in this way then try to brand anything else as useless.

Think we must be hanging out in different anchorages if you think the "vast majority " of world cruisers are on plastic boats. Or have different definition of 'vast'. .....

Get down somewhere like Brasil and watch the boats coming in from SA or anchor up in Lajes Das Flores and do a count there, 'vast majority' might be over egging it a bit...

 

[rotrax]

Think we must be hanging out in different anchorages if you think the "vast majority " of world cruisers are on plastic boats. Or have different definition of 'vast'. .....

Get down somewhere like Brasil and watch the boats coming in from SA or anchor up in Lajes Das Flores and do a count there, 'vast majority' might be over egging it a bit...

Dont recall seeing a steel boat when I sailed in the Caribean.

I have a steel boat. Its ok. Looks to me to be a pro hull with an experienced amateur fit out. Kiwi built, ideal for local conditions as is. I would not wish to sail it in Europe. It would do the job of getting from place to place but its such an ugly barsteward! The sailing you guys have your steel boats for is right for them.

Easy to fix, strong and watertight. They have to be as you have little sailing infrastructure compared to other parts of the world.

Prepare one of your boats for sale, advertise it with lots of pics in Europe or the USA for the same sort of money a GRP vessel the same age and size would be expected to fetch and you wont get an offer.

Its obvious that only the real afficianados, like yourselves appreciate them..............................

 

[rotrax]

There are a lot of rubbish stock plastic boats, in fact most of them.

We have a saying " You can fool some of the people some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time. I an 70 years old, have owned and used boats made from steel, wood, GRP and a mixture of wood and steel during 53 years of that period.

The first part of the above may well be correct. The second bit is total bolleux.

You have very narrow vision.

Ships are made from steel almost exclusively.

Boats are made from a range of materials for very good reasons.

I wont go into them here as it is obvious you wont want to hear them...............................................

 

[GHA]

Dont recall seeing a steel boat when I sailed in the Caribean.

Thinking about it, can't remeber seeing too many up there either. Thousands of American grp, easy for them to get down there, barely an overnighter. Loads European grp as well. Caribbean ain't the world though, nor is the Med.

 

[rotrax]

Thinking about it, can't remeber seeing too many up there either. Thousands of American grp, easy for them to get down there, barely an overnighter. Loads European grp as well. Caribbean ain't the world though, nor is the Med.

And, nor is the Southern Hemisphere.

You world girdling superheroes in your steel boats-so sorry we dont measure up to your exacting sailing standards.

Our summer cruise, over 1700 NM, South and West of Ireland, big swells coming 3000 miles across the Atlantic, huge rise and fall of tide, streams running at up to 6 kts-must seem to be a piece of cake to you guys. Rocks-did I mention the rocks........................

 

[GHA]

And, nor is the Southern Hemisphere.

You world girdling superheroes in your steel boats-so sorry we dont measure up to your exacting sailing standards.

Our summer cruise, over 1700 NM, South and West of Ireland, big swells coming 3000 miles across the Atlantic, huge rise and fall of tide, streams running at up to 6 kts-must seem to be a piece of cake to you guys. Rocks-did I mention the rocks........................

Chill.

Not having a go at anyone's choice of boats, it's taronas idea that the vast majority of world cruisers are in plastic that doesn't match the real world, people can and do sail in anything, good on them for getting out there.

 

[rotrax]

Chill.

Not having a go at anyone's choice of boats, it's tranona's idea that the vast majority of world cruisers are in plastic that doesn't match the real world, people can and do sail in anything, good on them for getting out there.

I think you will find he is right........................

 

[GHA]

I think you will find he is right........................

Not my experience so far round the N/S Atlantic. Certainly in some areas but overall, not what I've seen. Hardly the sort of thing you can get accurate numbers for though.

 

[rotrax]

Well, Jean Socrates is going round for the third time, in a plastic boat, on her own.

This is getting just like the British/American v what was known as " Japcrap " in the motorbike world.

I know a great deal about motorbikes, far more than I know about boats, having earned my living for well over 30 years selling and repairing them.

50 years ago it was widely believed that they would not last. Brit and American iron would keep going, and was easy to fix.

Well, let me tell you, Japanese motorbikes dont very often wear out, they are neglected and abused to death. Overall, they are far more reliable and longer lasting than their detractors would have.

A bit like boats really..................................