simple question - what is the most dangerous thing on a boat?

[FWB]

I would expect primus stoves, with the dangers of flaring, to be orders of magnitude more hazardous on a boat than gas. Even worse if you preheat with meths.

They don't flare if you know how to use them. If preheated correctly, takes 4 minutes, they will not flare. During preheating I put the kettle on the burner. When the meths goes out I light the stove just as if it were gas. They are very easy to use. If you only want a mugful, the preheat will boil the water without introducing the paraffin.

 

[JumbleDuck]

They don't flare if you know how to use them.

And gas won't blow up your boat if you know how to use it.

 

[FWB]

And gas won't blow up your boat if you know how to use it.

If it leaks it could

 

[Searush]

If it leaks it could

That's part of knowing how to use it isn't it? Turning off at the source when you leave is one precaution, a leak detector would be another. I take a good sniff whenever I arrive & push the hatch back. Not likely to find gas as that will still be turned off, but it can warn of other troubles.

 

[Elessar]

How is it a bonus, to wilfully avoid something which is convenient and reliable and which, given simple undemanding precautions, is perfectly safe?

Presumably you don't smoke on petrol station forecourts? Isn't that the same type of obvious, effortless precaution? Or, do you not bother with cars at all - as a "bonus"?

Sorry Elessar, I don't like sounding sarcastic. And I like to be safe...but I believe safety is best accessed by reasonable care, rather than by avoidance of a big potential benefit.

Err read what i said. I said i find it INconvenient.

 

[Woodlouse]

I would expect primus stoves, with the dangers of flaring, to be orders of magnitude more hazardous on a boat than gas. Even worse if you preheat with meths.

Only a danger if you have flammable items above the cooker like curtains or something. Otherwise any flare ups are contained and the worse that will happen is you'll get a sooty deckhead. I think you'd have to look quite hard to find an account of someone being killed by their primus exploding. You have to look a lot less hard to read about people being killed in gas explosions.

 

[Seajet]

Just wondering, a genuine question; how many primus stoves are proper marine units with gymbals and pan clamps, not loose items plonked on a table ?

The latter certainly applies to the modern convenience gas single burner jobs with aerosol style refills...

 

[FWB]

Just wondering, a genuine question; how many primus stoves are proper marine units with gymbals and pan clamps, not loose items plonked on a table ?

The latter certainly applies to the modern convenience gas single burner jobs with aerosol style refills...

The reference is to Taylors stoves which work on the Primus principle.

 

[Seajet]

Fair enough, they're fairly pukka if heavy and expensive !

I had horror visions of the primus stoves I played with when a schoolboy...

I expect you know the gas cookers I mean, usually flogged with their own little attache case, single burner with aerosol sized refills the style & size of WD40 tins; what horrifies me is I've seen a lot of small sailing boats & mobos with these plonked on a tiny table - one tug going past upsetting this when going under a pan, and voom, call Red Adair !

Here's one example but there are loads very similar;

http://www.gasproducts.co.uk/acatal...g_Stove.html?gclid=CN-o1uvx0sICFSMFwwodBYkAqw

 

[Woodlouse]

Just wondering, a genuine question; how many primus stoves are proper marine units with gymbals and pan clamps, not loose items plonked on a table ?

The latter certainly applies to the modern convenience gas single burner jobs with aerosol style refills...

Never seen a primus on a boat that wasn't a marine unit. They're not always gimbaled but they've always got pan clamps and they're never not bolted down.

 

[Seajet]

I suspect there may be examples not quite so worthy as you think Woodlouse, I'm a fan of gas if properly done, and if one's sailing area suits - see my amended post above - but I get the idea primus stoves are like favourite anchors...

Let's say almost anything is a good safe bet and a hearty friend if installed and handled properly, and any cooker is a phsychopathic killer out to get you if you don't give it due respect !

 

[FWB]

Let's say almost anything is a good safe bet and a hearty friend if installed and handled properly, and any cooker is a phsychopathic killer out to get you if you don't give it due respect !

The perceived danger isn't so much in the use or misuse. It's what could go wrong if there is a leak. With gas it could lead to an explosion, with paraffin you get a puddle.

 

[Woodlouse]

I suspect there may be examples not quite so worthy as you think Woodlouse, I'm a fan of gas if properly done, and if one's sailing area suits - see my amended post above - but I get the idea primus stoves are like favourite anchors...

I don't doubt it and I can only go on my personal experience. However, the primus is becoming something of a rare beast and not one you generally find in the possession of someone with little idea of what is suitable on a boat and what is not.

I'm happy sailing on boats with gas, you have to be these days but there's always that knowledge in the back of your mind that you're sailing with a bomb on board. Possibly unreasonable I know but I remember seeing all the windows blown out in Penryn twenty odd years ago when a barge in the harbour blew up because of a gas leak.

 

[Seajet]

foeu,

I have seen a boat explode and burn to the waterline, fortunately after the crew bailed over the side, that was a gas cooker which went tits up for some reason; uninsured mobo on maiden voyage.

I am trained with hydraulics & gas etc ( though don't have any certificates in the latter ); I am extremely careful with my boat's gas installation, for a start I changed the stowage of the bottle to a well ventilated drained position, the pipe run is 1 piece and the flexible pipes at each end - 1 end to let the cooker swing in its gymbals, the other end to attach to the regulator - is changed every Spring, for a few quid from a caravan shop it'd be madness not to.

When using the cooker it is only turned on when in use, then turned off at the regulator the moment I'm finished with it, all in easy reach from the cooking position through the main hatch.

The regulator is the recent ' M ' marine spec and there are gas & carbon monoxide alarms.

I only wear the tin foil hat and cricket box if there's no lightning about.

 

[Searush]

The perceived danger isn't so much in the use or misuse. It's what could go wrong if there is a leak. With gas it could lead to an explosion, with paraffin you get a puddle.

You only get an explosion if it is the right mix of gas & air and an ignition source, OK it's a fairly large window of "right mix", but if you add the ignition source to that "puddle" of yours you will have a pretty dangerous fire - especially if it has soaked into furnishings & woodwork.

I can ventilate & bale spilt gas out of my boat quite easily, try getting that paraffin out.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Only a danger if you have flammable items above the cooker like curtains or something. Otherwise any flare ups are contained and the worse that will happen is you'll get a sooty deckhead. I think you'd have to look quite hard to find an account of someone being killed by their primus exploding. You have to look a lot less hard to read about people being killed in gas explosions.

Exploding, no, but the yachting world of old was full of tales of fires caused by primuses (primae?), Sure, they work fine in competent hands, but I bet there are proportionately a heck of lot more primus fires than gas explosions. It's fifteen years since the Lord Trenchard went bang, and that was down to incompetence.

 

[JumbleDuck]

With gas it could lead to an explosion, with paraffin you get a puddle.

Or a four foot column of naked flame.

 

[jpcarter30]

I have to say that I was always a little paranoid about the gas leaking when i had the kids onboard. Alone, I tend not to worry but when the kids were on it was another thing to be concerned about along with the fear of being flung overboard and the eldest not being able to do anything about it.

 

[Scotty_Tradewind]

How many of you posting and looking at this thread, DO NOT have gas alarms on your boat?

S.

 

[Woodlouse]

How many of you posting and looking at this thread, DO NOT have gas alarms on your boat?

S.

I don't. But then I have a primus.

A more telling question might be how many on this thread have tested their gas alarms recently? As far as I'm aware they contain ferrous metals and being positioned in the bilge isn't the best location for the longevity of electrics.