shower

[cherod]

i dont ned anti freeze , i dont need any copper pipe as i have no other way of heating the water, ( if i did i would not need the calorifier !! ) i need to know if the water heater is just a tank with an element in it , a cold water in , a hot wtar out and a pressure release valve , do you have any relevant exprience like that stuff

 

[pvb]

is it possible to get a 2k electric shower , does not have to be domestic standard but useable

2kW isn't enough for instantaneous shower heating. But a water heater (tank with immersion element) would work fine. Only needs to be fairly simple, but adding a thermostatic mixer valve would make it safer and more practical.

Instantaneous gas heaters are best avoided.

 

[cherod]

2kW isn't enough for instantaneous shower heating. But a water heater (tank with immersion element) would work fine. Only needs to be fairly simple, but adding a thermostatic mixer valve would make it safer and more practical.

Instantaneous gas heaters are best avoided.

t y ,, good simple strait forward reply

 

[atol]

is that an on demand type or is there a storage tank ? ty

that type has a 10 liter tank,enough for a shortish hot shower (30 liters) ,reheats fairly quickly~20 minutes,very compact about the size of a walk on airline suitcase
there are larger capacity ones but they have bigger heating elements~3-4 kw

just google "under sink water heater" lots of options, not expensive,easy installation and works teed into existing pressurised system

see also link a bit more expensive,but smaller element that would run off a small generator
,Motorhome caravan campervan Propex 240v Electric water heater 10litre boiler NEW | eBay

 

[Neeves]

I note the comments that instantaneous gas hot water heaters are best avoided - I wonder why.

We have a an Bosch gas instantaneous hot water heater and have used it for 20 years. The catamaran has not, yet, caught fire nor have we been asphyxiated. It is simply plumbed into the existing domestic water pipe work and runs of a normal Shurflo, or equiivalent, We have a standard mixer type tap in the shower and the same in the galley. It works off the standard bottled gas that we use for our stove and oven. The boiler works off a pilot light and we switch the gas off when we do not need hot water. We have separate pipe work, copper, for the gas and both the galley equipment and hot water boiler have dedicated cut off valves. The water itself is standard 'Guest' pipework and fittings.

As far as I am aware the same boilers are used in motor homes and caravans. Many of which also use gas for refrigeration.

The boiler is vented outside (which is more than be said of our galley stove/oven). Our boiler is located on a bulkhead, the bulkhead is the inside of the saloon and outside of the cockpit - if that makes sense. It could conceivably have been installed 'outside'.

The Bosch unit is contained in a 'standard white goods' casing about 750mm high and 200mm square. Our boiler is then contained in dedicated space in the 'furniture' and the space is lined with aluminium plate. There is no tank - the water is heated in the boiler and runs straight to the various, mixer, taps. To save water we have Navy showers and collect the initial cold water which is then used to rinse dishes or veg etc.

For insurance purposes (here in Australia) our gas installation was certificated by a registered plumber.

We don't have a calorifier for either of our engines. We have thought of it but the instant hot water suits us, it was going to be slightly more complex to have 2 sources of hot water and we have never liked the idea of the need to run the engines to have a shower. - It is the 21st Century and granddaughters firmly believe a hot shower is a birthright (they have grown used to Navy showers) - and we have become accosted to the convenience and quite happily have 2 showers a day (despite the advise that instant gas water heaters are best avoided?).

You need to make sure the boiler is suited to the gas you are going to use. Our boiler is 20 years old and there may be more compact units available - I'd look at what is currently used in caravans, large motor homes or small inner city apartments.

The advantage of our unit is that if you have the space you simply cut into the exciting pipe work feed to your shower and install the boiler. You don't need to run hot and cold to the shower as the temperature can be controlled, or set, at the boiler. It is obviously more convenient and 'sophisticated' to have a hot and cold feed - but unnecessary.

Jonathan

 

[cherod]

that type has a 10 liter tank,enough for a shortish hot shower (30 liters) ,reheats fairly quickly~20 minutes,very compact about the size of a walk on airline suitcase
there are larger capacity ones but they have bigger heating elements~3-4 kw

just google "under sink water heater" lots of options, not expensive,easy installation and works teed into existing pressurised system

see also link a bit more expensive,but smaller element that would run off a small generator
,Motorhome caravan campervan Propex 240v Electric water heater 10litre boiler NEW | eBay

thank you ,, yes , checked your links,, very interesting

 

[cherod]

I note the comments that instantaneous gas hot water heaters are best avoided - I wonder why.

We have a an Bosch gas instantaneous hot water heater and have used it for 20 years. The catamaran has not, yet, caught fire nor have we been asphyxiated. It is simply plumbed into the existing domestic water pipe work and runs of a normal Shurflo, or equiivalent, We have a standard mixer type tap in the shower and the same in the galley. It works off the standard bottled gas that we use for our stove and oven. The boiler works off a pilot light and we switch the gas off when we do not need hot water. We have separate pipe work, copper, for the gas and both the galley equipment and hot water boiler have dedicated cut off valves. The water itself is standard 'Guest' pipework and fittings.

As far as I am aware the same boilers are used in motor homes and caravans. Many of which also use gas for refrigeration.

The boiler is vented outside (which is more than be said of our galley stove/oven). Our boiler is located on a bulkhead, the bulkhead is the inside of the saloon and outside of the cockpit - if that makes sense. It could conceivably have been installed 'outside'.

The Bosch unit is contained in a 'standard white goods' casing about 750mm high and 200mm square. Our boiler is then contained in dedicated space in the 'furniture' and the space is lined with aluminium plate. There is no tank - the water is heated in the boiler and runs straight to the various, mixer, taps. To save water we have Navy showers and collect the initial cold water which is then used to rinse dishes or veg etc.

For insurance purposes (here in Australia) our gas installation was certificated by a registered plumber.

We don't have a calorifier for either of our engines. We have thought of it but the instant hot water suits us, it was going to be slightly more complex to have 2 sources of hot water and we have never liked the idea of the need to run the engines to have a shower. - It is the 21st Century and granddaughters firmly believe a hot shower is a birthright (they have grown used to Navy showers) - and we have become accosted to the convenience and quite happily have 2 showers a day (despite the advise that instant gas water heaters are best avoided?).

You need to make sure the boiler is suited to the gas you are going to use. Our boiler is 20 years old and there may be more compact units available - I'd look at what is currently used in caravans, large motor homes or small inner city apartments.

The advantage of our unit is that if you have the space you simply cut into the exciting pipe work feed to your shower and install the boiler. You don't need to run hot and cold to the shower as the temperature can be controlled, or set, at the boiler. It is obviously more convenient and 'sophisticated' to have a hot and cold feed - but unnecessary.

Jonathan

my issue with gas as opposed to elecrtic is cost , i would hope eventually to run the water heater from solar power , gas is an ongoing expense .

 

[vyv_cox]

all reports say that there is a considerable amount of effort in using the raw water route , 5 ltr is really the minimum, ty

All reports by whom? It is perfectly straightforward, a couple of plumbing fittings and a used pump from Ebay. Look at my website.

 

[cherod]

All reports by whom? It is perfectly straightforward, a couple of plumbing fittings and a used pump from Ebay. Look at my website.

i will check your web site mate ,, thank you .. , but that still means runing the engine to get hot water, ( as opposed to free solar power ) i have also read that a marine engine , esp the Yanmar 1 GM is designed to run at a low temp , i know that my exhaust water is cold, that will not heat my water ?? anyway , i will check you web page now ,, ty

 

[rogerthebodger]

There are 2 type of instantaneous gas water heaters.

In the UK room sealed gas heaters are needed and need both air inlet and exhaust completely sealed from the room.

Here is a room sealed gas water heater

Morco F-11EL Room Sealed LPG Water Heater | Narrowboats, Horseboxes & Shepherd Huts

I think these are required on inland waterways in the UK


There is also a fear of gas in a boat.

Like you neeves I have a bosch water heater and had one on my previous boat without issue.

Yes gas is an extra cost for water heating and that i why I have both a gas water heater and a calorifier to heat water from either ny engine or shore power.

The use of solar for water heating is a way to reduce or eliminate the cost of water heating. Where I live its viable may be not so much in the UK so free water heating may not be as viable as in other parts of the world.

Here's a way of combining water heating and solar PV panels in the same unit.

Kit - Radiant Solar Water Heating System Integrated with the Boat Fresh Water System

 

[PilotWolf]

Be a man and take a cold
shower!

Never thought I would as love a hot powerful shower.

But since getting the virus I was having awful sweats and just burning up. So started taking them and cold baths out of necessity I actually started to enjoy it. Albeit it much warmer here...

W.

 

[RupertW]

this is interesting ,, is a colorifier really just a water heater tank , like a giant eletric kettle ( ) if it is i can easily make my own stainless one .

I may be wrong but I thought they were two separate things. I thought the calorifier was the bit attached to the engine cooling system that passes engine cooling water through a small tank which has domestic water pumped through it. The output of that is the hot water tank which is separate. That hot water tank also has a conventional electric 1.5kw element in it for heating the water when the engine is not on.

I agree with the poster that direct solar heating would be a lot more efficient than my solar electric arrangement but it would also take up some real estate on the boat and be a bit faffy. As my batteries come to float by lunchtime most days I thought I would play with the electric solution as the bits for that are all hidden and look after themselves. I’ve been very pleased with the results over the last few weeks - my solar daily output has risen from about 0.8kwh to almost 2kwh (and above that if we wash clothes mid afternoon).

 

[peter gibbs]

hi , i am looking at fitting a shower into my boat , space is not a problem but not enough for water back boiler solid fuel type ,, ,, considering gas but would prefer electric , problem is my electric supply will be 2k at best , either from rectifier or from 2k generator . is it possible to get a 2k electric shower , does not have to be domestic standard but useable , or should i just go gas , not sure which is more practical and cheapest to run . any ideas anybody would be appreciated.
PS , raw water 1 GM Yanmar so colorifier not poss

IF space is not a problem I would fit a calorifier even if not connected to the engine. The normal 1kw element will raise 20 lit to a nice temperature within a reasonable time - it's what I do. And it should be insulated to hold water for other uses.

PWG

 

[Neeves]

Your desire for a hot water shower looks to have developed into something much larger.

Yes you can use solar to heat your water, electrical or through the heat from the sun - you presumably will need to think of Pilotwolf's option in the winter

I envisage a whole series of questions I could ask - power for the fridge being one. There was mention of a gen set, I think, - they can be noisy (and upset the neighbours....) and fuel for a gen set costs not much different to gas.

You need to complete an energy audit - and then you might get more informed and focussed answers.

Jonathan

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

i dont ned anti freeze , i dont need any copper pipe as i have no other way of heating the water, ( if i did i would not need the calorifier !! ) i need to know if the water heater is just a tank with an element in it , a cold water in , a hot wtar out and a pressure release valve , do you have any relevant exprience like that stuff

A calorifier is essentially an insulated tank with a heating coil within, heated by the coolant in your engine, with the additional option of an electric element for when shore power is available. Obviously there is also a pressure relief valve and of course, cold water in, hot water out spigots.

 

[atol]

just sail south, when sea water temperature hits the mid 20's you will look forward to a cold shower,we never had hot water on 2 circumnavigations,showers were in salt water with a fresh water rinse,in the days before watermakers

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

that type has a 10 liter tank,enough for a shortish hot shower (30 liters) ,reheats fairly quickly~20 minutes,very compact about the size of a walk on airline suitcase
there are larger capacity ones but they have bigger heating elements~3-4 kw

just google "under sink water heater" lots of options, not expensive,easy installation and works teed into existing pressurised system

see also link a bit more expensive,but smaller element that would run off a small generator
,Motorhome caravan campervan Propex 240v Electric water heater 10litre boiler NEW | eBay

Those under counter heaters only last about five years in my shops, I don't think they would last that long in a boat.
Corrosion causes leaks in the tank.

 

[cherod]

Be a man and take a cold
shower!

Never thought I would as love a hot powerful shower.

But since getting the virus I was having awful sweats and just burning up. So started taking them and cold baths out of necessity I actually started to enjoy it. Albeit it much warmer here...

W.

i dont mind being a man ,, but that is the last thing i want of my wife !!

 

[atol]

Those under counter heaters only last about five years in my shops, I don't think they would last that long in a boat.
Corrosion causes leaks in the tank.

at £80 a go i'm happy to replace every 5 years or so ,our current one has been in for over 6 years in daily use.

generally it is not the tank that fails,it is the heating element.

 

[cherod]

A calorifier is essentially a
A calorifier is essentially an insulated tank with a heating coil within, heated by the coolant in your engine, with the additional option of an electric element for when shore power is available. Obviously there is also a pressure relief valve and of course, cold water in, hot water out spigots.

and can of course ( obv ) not need any engine water heating or connections for ? just being a glorified kettle ?