shower

[cherod]

just sail south, when sea water temperature hits the mid 20's you will look forward to a cold shower,we never had hot water on 2 circumnavigations,showers were in salt water with a fresh water rinse,in the days before watermakers

this is the plan

 

[cherod]

There are 2 type of instantaneous gas water heaters.

In the UK room sealed gas heaters are needed and need both air inlet and exhaust completely sealed from the room.

Here is a room sealed gas water heater

Morco F-11EL Room Sealed LPG Water Heater | Narrowboats, Horseboxes & Shepherd Huts

I think these are required on inland waterways in the UK


There is also a fear of gas in a boat.

Like you neeves I have a bosch water heater and had one on my previous boat without issue.

Yes gas is an extra cost for water heating and that i why I have both a gas water heater and a calorifier to heat water from either ny engine or shore power.

The use of solar for water heating is a way to reduce or eliminate the cost of water heating. Where I live its viable may be not so much in the UK so free water heating may not be as viable as in other parts of the world.

Here's a way of combining water heating and solar PV panels in the same unit.

Kit - Radiant Solar Water Heating System Integrated with the Boat Fresh Water System

and throo deck ventilation

 

[cherod]

at £80 a go i'm happy to replace every 5 years or so ,our current one has been in for over 6 years in daily use.

generally it is not the tank that fails,it is the heating element.

tbh , it is the principle which interests me as i would probably custom make my own ( in stainless ) to fit . ty

 

[rogerthebodger]

and throo deck ventilation

Yes

 

[cherod]

Your desire for a hot water shower looks to have developed into something much larger.
. and i have a fridge ..
Yes you can use solar to heat your water, electrical or through the heat from the sun - you presumably will need to think of Pilotwolf's option in the winter

I envisage a whole series of questions I could ask - power for the fridge being one. There was mention of a gen set, I think, - they can be noisy (and upset the neighbours....) and fuel for a gen set costs not much different to gas.

You need to complete an energy audit - and then you might get more informed and focussed answers.

Jonathan

thank you , but i have no intention of developing it into something larger , my whole idea is to keep it simple and long term cheap . as for PW idea i have no intensions of turning my wife into a man !! nor do i plan a genset , and i have a fridge ,, , so let us not over egg the cake , many of the replies , which i thank everyone for , have been very informative , even if some a little off course ..

 

[cherod]

Yes

exactly ,, more complications

 

[Blueboatman]

Whilst you design and build this ‘ ultimate’ shower, one option I have used enjoyably is the humble camping shower bag which lies around in the sun and you then hang from a handy tree: transposing to whizzy catamarans , suspend on a halyard dangling over a deck hatch directly over the loo shower tray ‘ area ‘ and you get one very long shower indeed, topped off with a hot kettle in the mix if the weather is grey.. yours for a fiver whilst building something more built in..
I use this in spite of, or rather in addition to having a fitted calorifier and 240v heating element ..

 

[cherod]

There are 2 type of instantaneous gas water heaters.

In the UK room sealed gas heaters are needed and need both air inlet and exhaust completely sealed from the room.

Here is a room sealed gas water heater

Morco F-11EL Room Sealed LPG Water Heater | Narrowboats, Horseboxes & Shepherd Huts

I think these are required on inland waterways in the UK


There is also a fear of gas in a boat.

Like you neeves I have a bosch water heater and had one on my previous boat without issue.

Yes gas is an extra cost for water heating and that i why I have both a gas water heater and a calorifier to heat water from either ny engine or shore power.

The use of solar for water heating is a way to reduce or eliminate the cost of water heating. Where I live its viable may be not so much in the UK so free water heating may not be as viable as in other parts of the world.

Here's a way of combining water heating and solar PV panels in the same unit.

Kit - Radiant Solar Water Heating System Integrated with the Boat Fresh Water System

the UK relavance re spec and regulations i hope will not be relavant for long .

 

[cherod]

Whilst you design and build this ‘ ultimate’ shower, one option I have used enjoyably is the humble camping shower bag which lies around in the sun and you then hang from a handy tree: transposing to whizzy catamarans , suspend on a halyard dangling over a deck hatch directly over the loo shower tray ‘ area ‘ and you get one very long shower indeed, topped off with a hot kettle in the mix if the weather is grey.. yours for a fiver whilst building something more built in..
I use this in spite of, or rather in addition to having a fitted calorifier and 240v heating element ..

presumably you do the laundry and the dishes at the same time ? and i dont have a convenient hatch over the toilet / shower area ,, ty

 

[cherod]

IF space is not a problem I would fit a calorifier even if not connected to the engine. The normal 1kw element will raise 20 lit to a nice temperature within a reasonable time - it's what I do. And it should be insulated to hold water for other uses.

PWG

ty , but i still do not have a definative answere re a calorifier if it is something which needs to be connected to an engine , i am not going to buy one if i dont need it or is no use to me !!

 

[cherod]

PVB reply is more what i am looking for , simple box with heating element, that i can make and fit myself , no expensive complications . Atol with the shop made one is interesting , need to compare prices etc, stainless one would outlive me and elements are cheap .

 

[cherod]

I may be wrong but I thought they were two separate things. I thought the calorifier was the bit attached to the engine cooling system that passes engine cooling water through a small tank which has domestic water pumped through it. The output of that is the hot water tank which is separate. That hot water tank also has a conventional electric 1.5kw element in it for heating the water when the engine is not on.

I agree with the poster that direct solar heating would be a lot more efficient than my solar electric arrangement but it would also take up some real estate on the boat and be a bit faffy. As my batteries come to float by lunchtime most days I thought I would play with the electric solution as the bits for that are all hidden and look after themselves. I’ve been very pleased with the results over the last few weeks - my solar daily output has risen from about 0.8kwh to almost 2kwh (and above that if we wash clothes mid afternoon).

so the calorifier is just a water heat exchanger ? the solar pannels will be there anyway so no extra space needed / taken up .. ty

 

[Neeves]

You do seem to contradict yourself

This was your opening thread

hi , i am looking at fitting a shower into my boat , space is not a problem but not enough for water back boiler solid fuel type ,, ,, considering gas but would prefer electric , problem is my electric supply will be 2k at best , either from rectifier or from 2k generator . is it possible to get a 2k electric shower , does not have to be domestic standard but useable , or should i just go gas , not sure which is more practical and cheapest to run . any ideas anybody would be appreciated.
PS , raw water 1 GM Yanmar so colorifier not poss

thank you , but i have no intention of developing it into something larger , my whole idea is to keep it simple and long term cheap . as for PW idea i have no intensions of turning my wife into a man !! nor do i plan a genset , and i have a fridge ,, , so let us not over egg the cake , many of the replies , which i thank everyone for , have been very informative , even if some a little off course ..

You mention gas - but now, in the space of a few hours - you don't want gas. You mention a 2k generator - but are now, not going to have a genset? You would get better replies if you were more accurate in defining your needs.

In any event - good luck with your quest.

Jonathan

 

[cherod]

You do seem to contradict yourself

This was your opening thread

hi , i am looking at fitting a shower into my boat , space is not a problem but not enough for water back boiler solid fuel type ,, ,, considering gas but would prefer electric , problem is my electric supply will be 2k at best , either from rectifier or from 2k generator . is it possible to get a 2k electric shower , does not have to be domestic standard but useable , or should i just go gas , not sure which is more practical and cheapest to run . any ideas anybody would be appreciated.
PS , raw water 1 GM Yanmar so colorifier not poss



You mention gas - but now, in the space of a few hours - you don't want gas. You mention a 2k generator - but are now, not going to have a genset? You would get better replies if you were more accurate in defining your needs.

In any event - good luck with your quest.

Jonathan

sorry for any confusion ,,, as in gen set / generator it is my belief that the genset is a fixed instilation with a diesel motor whereas a generator is a lightweight portable petrol unit , , re gas, i did say that i would " prefer electric ". hope that is clear now , as i said , many of the replies have been very useful , ty for your reply .

 

[Spirit (of Glenans)]

and can of course ( obv ) not need any engine water heating or connections for ? just being a glorified kettle ?

A calorifier is more than a glorified kettle. Here is a definition taken from ASAP's website:
"A marine calorifier is a simple and efficient means of heating water in your domestic system, for use with showers, taps and the galley. Comparable to a domestic boiler, these calorifiers have an inlet for cold water, but then use a link from the engines closed cooling circuit to heat the inner coil and therefore the water. Calorifiers are often also called boat water heaters. The Hotpot range of calorifiers are also supplied with an immersion heater with a built in thermostat, meaning they can provide you with free hot water while motoring or charging the batteries. The calorifier heats quickly as the drop coil technology ensures quick transfer of hear from the coil to the water. The outside of the calorifier is insulated in a polyurethane jacket designed to retain heat for up to 24 hours after the engine is switched off. Each calorifier is rigorously tested to ensure excellent quality and reliability. Water stored in the boat's calorifier reaches the same temperature as the engine, generally about 85°C. When hot water is needed, the calorifier uses a thermostatic mixing valve to combine this water with cold water to give the required water temperature. Hotpot calorifiers are available with capacities from 15 litres all the way up to 90 litres. We stock Hotpot hot water calorifiers with single coil or twin coil options, which are available from stock with horizontal or vertical mounting options. "
IMHO the whole point is to use free engine heat to heat the water, the use of other energy sources is purely secondary.
Also, IMHO, I would rather pay the price of the proprietary article, and go sailing, rather than spend endless hours reinventing the wheel.
If you were to make your own, using standard plumbing fittings, you could incorporate a copper heating coil. I don't know if they are still available as a separate part, but they used to be, when DIY solid fuel C/H systems were in vogue. If not you could make your own, by heating copper pipe and wrapping it around a post, in the manner of the distillers of illicit spirits of old. If you have skills with s/s, a coil in that material would certainly be more compatible.
People familiar with Irish popular culture will know of course, that we have massive anxieties around the use of "th'immersion"

 

[RupertW]

People familiar with Irish popular culture will know of course, that we have massive anxieties around the use of "th'immersion"

I love that last bit. My mother was Irish and putting on the immersion at home was like throwing gold out of the window in her view. I still have that anxiety now in marinas where electricity is included. Hence my new solar rig is a lot about the sheer magic of using free sunlight for th’immersion.

 

[cherod]

yes ,ty , all well and good, so it is just a heat exchanger , well thats it , no point in me buying the wheel when i dont have anything to drive it !! think i will just make my own , dont have to reinvent a " box " with an element and a a few nozzles , custom made to suit and considerably cheaper .

 

[cherod]

The advantage of a tank over instant is that you have the option of heating it more slowly - so for example we have 3 ways of heating the water - engine, mains 1.5kw element and the same element powered at 375w by spare solar energy

am i rite in that you use the same element for mains at 240 v and solar at 12 v ?

 

[RupertW]

am i rite in that you use the same element for mains at 240 v and solar at 12 v ?

The same element yes, but 1.5kW at 12 volts is just 3.75W. Instead I used a building suppliers 240-110v transformer as that reduces the 1.5kW to 375W which works well but a bit slower. The 240V comes from the inverter.

 

[cherod]

The same element yes, but 1.5kW at 12 volts is just 3.75W. Instead I used a building suppliers 240-110v transformer as that reduces the 1.5kW to 375W which works well but a bit slower. The 240V comes from the inverter.

and the 240 can come from either shore power , invertor or genny ? do you just splice the wiring , or what ?