prv
Well-known member
Idle thought - do these modern boats have motor-must-be-running interlocks because at 14+ volts the builders can get away with the next cable size down and still just sneak under the limit of acceptable volt drop?
Pete
Should I run the engine when using the anchor winch
- Thread starter KAM
- Start date
Idle thought - do these modern boats have motor-must-be-running interlocks because at 14+ volts the builders can get away with the next cable size down and still just sneak under the limit of acceptable volt drop?
Pete
alan17
New member
I alas have engine running whilst using windlass for all of the above reasons battery voltage etc. but it is my practice to motor slowly towards anchor whist retrieving anchor chain. This substantially reduces load on the windlass itself.
affinite
Well-known member
I always run the engine when using the windlass for all the reasons given above and also because most of our anchoring is med-moor so impractical to sail off the quay anyway.
Bit of Fred Drift but my bow thruster controller actually disconnects itself from the charging circuit when operating and reconfigures the 2 thruster batteries as a a 24v bank; so my engine doesnt do anything to boost the bow thruster when operating. No idea what happens with the windlass !
(Strange system)
Bit of Fred Drift but my bow thruster controller actually disconnects itself from the charging circuit when operating and reconfigures the 2 thruster batteries as a a 24v bank; so my engine doesnt do anything to boost the bow thruster when operating. No idea what happens with the windlass !
(Strange system)
maby
Well-known member
I'm not aware of any relevant regulations but, as others have already commented, it is common these days. Thw winch does have a manual option - so you can always crank it the old fashioned way.
jwilson
Well-known member
My Jeanneau came like that, but a very simple wiring alteration in the windlass motor/electrical space allows windlass use without engine in an emergency. Also useful when recovering chain from ground below boat after winter layup - I always take anchor and chain off the bow to the ground on layup.
Heckler
Active member
My Bene 381 has a relay attached to the output on the alternator. So engine not running, no output, winch doesnt work!
Stu
Twister_Ken
Well-known member
Glad to say that Arconas are not wired that way.
maby
Well-known member
I guess that, whichever way it is wired, you risk an unpleasant consequence - with the interlock that is usually installed these days, you could find yourself having to manually raise the anchor in the event of an engine failure even if there was still charge in the battery bank. Without the interlock, you risk being unable to start a working engine after using a poorly charged battery to raise the anchor.
Elbow grease?
prv
Well-known member
Tranona
Well-known member
On my Bavaria the windlass is powered from the house bank and the engine start battery is entirely separate. So no more danger of not being able to start the engine. Useful to be able to use the windlass independent of the engine, for example when adjusting lines to pull away from a quay at night when moored stern to. Quick burst of windlass pulls the boat out and then adjust stern lines to suit.
As with others always have the engine running when retrieving the anchor, and usually using bursts of power to reduce the load on the windlass.
jdc
Well-known member
I find the answers above quite extraordinary. Of course you can run the winch without the engine running - if not then the set up is poor and/or the batteries insufficient or damaged. There's no 'interlock' on my boat thank goodness - it would be just another damn thing to go wrong.
Numbers from my boat, but pretty typical I guess:
Windlass motor is 1kW, so 80A. Batteries capable of delivering CCA of a few hundred amps each, and I've 4 in parallel, so the windlass pulls less than 10% of max current. No big deal. Besides many people have 1kW inverters and think it normal enough. And why should one be frightened of 80A? I charge the batteries at this current!
As for the windlass drawing lots of energy, let's do some sums. 0.5 m/s winching rate say. 50 metres to pull, so 100 seconds. Not all at max load usually, let's guess 1/2 max load on average, ie 40A. 100 secs x 40A = 40 x 100 / 3600 = 1.1Ahr. Battery bank nominal capacity 440Ahr so 1.1Ahr is 0.25% of capacity. Peanuts.
Will the Voltage fall on cranking? Yes, a bit. To 10.8 V while winching is perhaps a bit low and may imply slightly too small a battery bank or too high an internal resistance (1.6V drop at 80A would be 20 milli-Ohms), but the starter motor pulls more than the windlass, and as already noted in a post above 9V is not unusual while running the starter.
Numbers from my boat, but pretty typical I guess:
Windlass motor is 1kW, so 80A. Batteries capable of delivering CCA of a few hundred amps each, and I've 4 in parallel, so the windlass pulls less than 10% of max current. No big deal. Besides many people have 1kW inverters and think it normal enough. And why should one be frightened of 80A? I charge the batteries at this current!
As for the windlass drawing lots of energy, let's do some sums. 0.5 m/s winching rate say. 50 metres to pull, so 100 seconds. Not all at max load usually, let's guess 1/2 max load on average, ie 40A. 100 secs x 40A = 40 x 100 / 3600 = 1.1Ahr. Battery bank nominal capacity 440Ahr so 1.1Ahr is 0.25% of capacity. Peanuts.
Will the Voltage fall on cranking? Yes, a bit. To 10.8 V while winching is perhaps a bit low and may imply slightly too small a battery bank or too high an internal resistance (1.6V drop at 80A would be 20 milli-Ohms), but the starter motor pulls more than the windlass, and as already noted in a post above 9V is not unusual while running the starter.
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maby
Well-known member
If you were to buy a new boat, you would almost certainly have to do some rewiring before you could use the winch with the engine stopped - they almost all seem to include an interlock these days.
Twister_Ken
Well-known member
Why? The windlass is fed by the domestic bank - 3 x 110ah.
maby
Well-known member
I have to say that I did wonder about that after I posted - honestly don't know which bank ours is connected to!
Twister_Ken
Well-known member
Jeanneau has been quoted as having an interlock, Bavaria and Arcona don't. What about other builders?
Lakesailor
New member
You avatar appears to be an arse, seen through a very old net curtain. Do you have clearer view?
maby
Well-known member
Beneteau certainly do. It would be interesting to know the ages of the Bavarias and Arconas being quoted - I was under the impression that the current versions of Bavaria do. I do believe it is something relatively recent - I don't think ten year old Jeanneaus bothered with it.
jwilson
Well-known member
Agree fully with the posts about the draw from a windlass being fairly trivial compared to typical battery capacities. Mine is wired to 170AH of domestic batteries, and maybe 50 amps for a couple of minutes is nothing. Even if it was wired to the 70AH starter battery it would make little difference, assuming the engine does get run later to top up the battery.
In practice I do normally either run the engine or have the shorepower charger on when using the windlass, but it is useful to be able to do so without on occasion. Last week I temporarily rerigged the main halyard to the electric windlass drum for some maintenance that required repeated hoists of a fairly big person up the mast - pure luxury compared to cranking a winch. I did this without engine noise to aid communication deck-masthead.
In practice I do normally either run the engine or have the shorepower charger on when using the windlass, but it is useful to be able to do so without on occasion. Last week I temporarily rerigged the main halyard to the electric windlass drum for some maintenance that required repeated hoists of a fairly big person up the mast - pure luxury compared to cranking a winch. I did this without engine noise to aid communication deck-masthead.
maby
Well-known member
Interestingly, although Beneteau will not let me run the anchor winch without the engine running, they are quite happy to let me run 1kw sheet winches all day with it stopped!