Selling - wet or dry?

[dje67]

I'm possibly about to sell my Evasion 32 and, if I buy the next boat before selling, I'm going to be looking for the cheapest way to sell the Evasion whilst the new boat takes my existing berth. I'm looking for views on whether the best way to sell the Evasion is keeping her in the water or on the hard-standing.

Initial discussions with a broker suggest that hard-standing is cheaper, but obviously she cannot be sailed easily. In the water means a potential buyer would need to cover haul-out costs for survey and cannot be sailed.

So some questions:-

Would you prefer to buy a boat that is initially out of the water, or does the fact that the boat is not in her natural environment make any difference to your impressions?

Would you expect to test-sail a boat before buying and would you consider making an offer on a boat that cannot (easily) be sailed?

What's best - "wet" or "dry"

Thanks all,
David

 

[Bajansailor]

If I was looking for a boat, I would not be too bothered about taking her for a test sail, especially if she is a popular type and I have a good idea as to what her sailing performance might be like as a result of general feedback from the other boats in service.
Re sailing ability of your Evasion, it should be possible for interested parties to get information from owners of (near) sisterships (eg JellyEllie and her Colvic Victor 34).

When we acquired our boat 12 years ago she was propped up ashore, after sustaining fire damages, and the first time we went sailing on her was almost a year later - and we were happily surprised.
We did start the engine ashore first though (after re-doing the electrics), and we had to repair a mysterious big split in the leading edge of the rudder (which we probably would not have seen if she was not ashore), and we took the opportunity to slap on a couple of coats of epoxy after she had been ashore for 10 months.

 

[sighmoon]

Provided she looks ready to go, it wouldn't bother me either way.

However, if, for example, the mast was unstepped and the broker didn't know which one it was, the sails and bunk cushions were not available to inspect (perhaps sensibly at the owner's house), then suddenly it starts looking like a pig in a poke.

 

[Wansworth]

I would be happier withthe boat in the water;just to see how she is stability wise,seeing everything in place and a trial sail if possible,although I bought all my boats without I may not, on reflection, have bought one of them.All depends on the owner I can have a boat lifted out and suspended in the slings and relaunched for the cost of an out andin, at local marina and you can run the engine in the water without problems.

 

[youen]

I prefer to see the boat out of the water if possible .So i can see if there is blisters and have moisture measurements because I dont want to buy a boat whith osmosis.The problem is to survey the engine if the engine is winterized and the oil new, so you cant have an oil analysis but if the engine is winterized and the boat is for sale perhaps its a sign which show that the engine is well look after

 

[wotayottie]

always sold them out of the water since that avoids the joy riders. serious customers will always want an out of the water survey anyway. as for what attracts customers, make sure the boat is really clean and shiny and non smelly - and offer it at a sensible price.

 

[vyv_cox]

I have owned three boats and all were bought out of the water. In each case I had had a winter of working on them before ever experiencing the pleasure of sailing them. I would much prefer to examine the underwater components on the hard over the brief experience of a test sail, that really tells very little in most cases.

 

[Pete7]

We bought in water but did take her for a test sail. I wanted to be sure the engine ran okay at speed and not just a quick blip along side the jetty. I also wanted to see the sails up etc. Previous owners eye sight was failing and wasn't confident anymore so hired a yachtmaster for a Sunday morning. This worked really well it meant the Yachtmaster sailed the boat whilst I was able to walk around the yacht looking at the rigging see the engine under load and talk with the owner about things without having to worry about other boats and what was happening around me.

There were costs on both sides, half a day yachtmaster for PO and I paid for the lift and survey. However on a £30k purchase you want to be sure.

What was far more important was condition, at a secondhand boatshow we had the advantage of looking at 5 identical boats on one day all similarly priced. Naturally we bought the one that was spotlessly clean and very well looked after.

Pete

 

[Ubergeekian]

I've just bought one ... in a mud berth. Best of both worlds!

 

[jbweston]

I've just had to make the same choice as dje67,the original poster.

I'm just about to put my Sadler 34 up for sale and I've decided to put her on the hard. The way I see it is that most serious viewers will want to have a good look at the condition of her hull and sterngear, and it's hard to see much with her in a berth. If they don't like what they see, it's saved them the cost of a lift out. If they do like what they see, ditto, so the survey will cost them less.

I reckon that many buyers looking for a well-known type will have a pretty good idea how she sails and looks on the water. If they want to check the engine and gear in use then they can do that as part of the post-contract sea-trial. In the meantime, she's safer on the hard over the winter. Also she'll be more visible to potential buyers. And she'll cost me less in storage.

Perhaps if she were an unusual type and I though potential buyers might need to try her out to see if they liked her, I'd leave her afloat.

Certainly as I've been looking for her replacement, it's been a lot easier to inspect boats on the hard and I've found it more difficult to make an assessment of condition when they are afloat.

 

[jenku]

I've bought all my boats on land. With the last one I had a clause in the contract that the boat would float and sail or I'd get my money back.

 

[Racecruiser]

Interesting question - my much-loved and race-successful Mustang 30 Mk 2 is now on the market as of last week so anyone shout if you're interested. She's dry-sailed so that's the best solution I think - a buyer can see her in the cradle and then she can be swung in for a test sail!

Looked at a boat on a swinging mooring last week - broker says if price is agreed then come back for a trial sail then have a survey out of the water. While I'd expect to pay for the survey I would want the seller to pay any lift costs and I'll be there to poke around underneath myself while the survey is happening.

 

[photodog]

Sold the last one dry and Bought the last one dry...

i wanna see a nice clean bottom... wiggle the rudder.... check for moisture... look at the bits...

 

[Racecruiser]

Selling - wet or dry - photo

Incase anyone wants to see my Mustang 30 which is for sale as the previous post mentions!

 

[weaver_fish]

While I'd expect to pay for the survey I would want the seller to pay any lift costs and I'll be there to poke around underneath myself while the survey is happening.

Really? I always thought the buyer paid the lift costs?

 

[Racecruiser]

Really? I always thought the buyer paid the lift costs?

I guess most things are open to negotiation when buying and selling - must admit I don't know if there is any convention on who pays lift costs.

 

[Ubergeekian]

I guess most things are open to negotiation when buying and selling - must admit I don't know if there is any convention on who pays lift costs.

The - or a - convention used to be that the seller paid survey costs if the boat sold and the buyer paid if it didn't.

 

[Daedelus]

When I bought one out of the water it was agreed that I withhold (or the broker hung onto to be precise) about £1000 in case the engine wasn't right and one or two other bits that couldn't be tested ashore.

Worked well as the owner had attempted to service it himself and had extracted the injectors using mole grips. They looked like a shark had had a go and according to the engineer provided a hosepipe jet of water rather than a fine spray mist.

So the money withheld paid for the necessary remedial work. Need a degreee of trust on both sides and the broker needs to work fairly.

 

[dje67]

Sounds like dry is the preferred option, then.

Next question (high-jacking my own thread!) - through a broker or privately? Do many marinas contractually insist that only the on-site broker may be used when selling? Are they allowed to do this?

 

[Koeketiene]

Next question (high-jacking my own thread!) - through a broker or privately? Do many marinas contractually insist that only the on-site broker may be used when selling? Are they allowed to do this?

Have sold 2 boats so far - always afloat.
Always looked ready to go - because she was.
Usually keep boats in the water all year round - found the sailed badly on dry land.
If the buyer wants to look at the bottom - he can pay for the lift out.

Some marinas do indeed have this clause - including one where we were at the time of a sale.
Sold privately - never told the marina the boat was up for sale.
What they don't know, doesn't hurt them.
I don't see how they could stop you selling privately - through a brokerage might be another thing.