Margem
New member
Sealine have been fined more than £30,000 for breach of Health and Saftey regs at their manufacturing plant, I wonder what happened there.
Sealine Fined
- Thread starter Margem
- Start date
petem
Well-known member
Found it in 'cache' on Google.........
"Chemical spill costs £34,000
A LUXURY boat-building company has been ordered to pay nearly £35,000 in fines and costs after an employee was overcome by fumes.
Laminator Virginia West was helping to clean up polyester resin styrene following an accidental spillage at Sealine's Whitehouse Road factory in Kidderminster where 500 people are employed.
She was taken to hospital for treatment but returned to work the next day, although she suffered headaches for four days, said John Cooper, prosecuting for the Health and Safety Executive.
Worcester Crown Court heard the firm failed to provide respirators for the clean-up operation which took place four days after the spillage.
Sealine had admitted two breaches of health and safety regulations when it appeared before town magistrates in August.
But the case was referred to crown court because magistrates felt it warranted more than the £25,000 maximum fines they could impose.
Judge Michael Mott said the spillage had been dealt with in "a rather shockingly slack" way due to lack of training.
But he accepted that delays had not been due to "cynical cost cutting".
He fined the firm £30,000 and ordered it to pay costs of £4,713.
Ian Thomas, defending, said safety procedures had been tightened up.
Mrs West was happy with the way she had been treated by the company since the incident and still worked there.
Mr Thomas said Sealine was a well-respected company making high quality products and added: "The company bitterly regrets that Mrs West was injured as a result of a failure to distribute respirators. Why they were not issued remains a mystery." "
What's even more worrying is that they've got women making boats! Ought to be worth at least an additional £50k fine (IMHO of course).
Even more serious (if that's possible) is the shoddy journalism that these local rags are guilty of. I am of course referring to the statement 'Luxury boat builder"!
"Chemical spill costs £34,000
A LUXURY boat-building company has been ordered to pay nearly £35,000 in fines and costs after an employee was overcome by fumes.
Laminator Virginia West was helping to clean up polyester resin styrene following an accidental spillage at Sealine's Whitehouse Road factory in Kidderminster where 500 people are employed.
She was taken to hospital for treatment but returned to work the next day, although she suffered headaches for four days, said John Cooper, prosecuting for the Health and Safety Executive.
Worcester Crown Court heard the firm failed to provide respirators for the clean-up operation which took place four days after the spillage.
Sealine had admitted two breaches of health and safety regulations when it appeared before town magistrates in August.
But the case was referred to crown court because magistrates felt it warranted more than the £25,000 maximum fines they could impose.
Judge Michael Mott said the spillage had been dealt with in "a rather shockingly slack" way due to lack of training.
But he accepted that delays had not been due to "cynical cost cutting".
He fined the firm £30,000 and ordered it to pay costs of £4,713.
Ian Thomas, defending, said safety procedures had been tightened up.
Mrs West was happy with the way she had been treated by the company since the incident and still worked there.
Mr Thomas said Sealine was a well-respected company making high quality products and added: "The company bitterly regrets that Mrs West was injured as a result of a failure to distribute respirators. Why they were not issued remains a mystery." "
What's even more worrying is that they've got women making boats! Ought to be worth at least an additional £50k fine (IMHO of course).
Even more serious (if that's possible) is the shoddy journalism that these local rags are guilty of. I am of course referring to the statement 'Luxury boat builder"!
boatone
Well-known member
<blockquote><font size=1>In reply to:</font><hr>
What's even more worrying is that they've got women making boats! Ought to be worth at least an additional £50k fine (IMHO of course)
<hr></blockquote>
In the words of one Victor Meldrew.....'' I dont BELIEVE it'' Why on earth shouldnt women make boats if they want to......
Please tell me this was supposed to be humour or summink........
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
What's even more worrying is that they've got women making boats! Ought to be worth at least an additional £50k fine (IMHO of course)
<hr></blockquote>
In the words of one Victor Meldrew.....'' I dont BELIEVE it'' Why on earth shouldnt women make boats if they want to......
Please tell me this was supposed to be humour or summink........
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
LeytonC
New member
I am not supprised, I live quite close the kidderminster site, and they treat
there employees like sh*t. I know a couple of people who have worked there
and could not stand it. Any company who treats people *that* badly does not
care.
Thanks
Leyton
(River Severn / Bristol Channel)
there employees like sh*t. I know a couple of people who have worked there
and could not stand it. Any company who treats people *that* badly does not
care.
Thanks
Leyton
(River Severn / Bristol Channel)
EME
Active member
Should be fined for building C39 IMHO...
Looks like Playschool version of a real boat
<font color=black>I am WHAT I say I am
Looks like Playschool version of a real boat
<font color=black>I am WHAT I say I am
petem
Well-known member
Since when was your name Emily Pankhurst!
I am of course joking. I'm all for women making boats and I don't just mean the curtains.
Whilst we're on the sexism subject how do you feel about about women fire fighters?
I am of course joking. I'm all for women making boats and I don't just mean the curtains.
Whilst we're on the sexism subject how do you feel about about women fire fighters?
boatone
Well-known member
Re: feel about women firefighters
I find it quite difficult with all that gear theyve got on.........
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
I find it quite difficult with all that gear theyve got on.........
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
c_j
Member
Just for the record I have absolutely nothing against women making Sealines, in fact, it explains a lot.
CJ
chris@stone.uk.com
www.stone.uk.com
CJ
chris@stone.uk.com
www.stone.uk.com
tcm
...
Re: feeling about women fire fighters
I think it may be a bit dodgy if they up a ladder while you are doing the feeling about.
Otherwise, EITHER sealine are excelent equal opportunity company OR pay crap wages hence wimmin take the nasty not-very-skilled laminator jobs.
I think it may be a bit dodgy if they up a ladder while you are doing the feeling about.
Otherwise, EITHER sealine are excelent equal opportunity company OR pay crap wages hence wimmin take the nasty not-very-skilled laminator jobs.
pistonbroke
New member
Having employed both men and women for laminating, I'm afraid that women tend to be better at the job. You tell a women how you want it done and she gets on with it, You tell a man the same thing and he tells you where you are going wrong, and does the job his own way.
Also, you can get away with paying women a lot less, they are good at making the tea and they look much better bending over a mould than a bloke does.
Also, you can get away with paying women a lot less, they are good at making the tea and they look much better bending over a mould than a bloke does.
oldgit
Well-known member
For selling fashion accessories masquerading as boats.?
Designed by Dali ???????????
Please do not add water.
And here is the weekend weather..
Designed by Dali ???????????
Please do not add water.
And here is the weekend weather..
MapisM
Well-known member
Surprised? Now, THAT\'s surprising!
As everyone who had the opportunity to visit some GRP boat plants can confirm, those places are far more dangerous for their workers than any nuclear powerplant around! ...well, apart from some russian ones maybe...
Not that I'm interested in defending Sealine (don't like their boats BTW) but if anyone think that other producers are playing safer with their employees, well, think again.
Our preferred toys are, in general, made by people whose salary is earned at the expense of their lungs.
It might sound rough, but that's the way it is.
As everyone who had the opportunity to visit some GRP boat plants can confirm, those places are far more dangerous for their workers than any nuclear powerplant around! ...well, apart from some russian ones maybe...
Not that I'm interested in defending Sealine (don't like their boats BTW) but if anyone think that other producers are playing safer with their employees, well, think again.
Our preferred toys are, in general, made by people whose salary is earned at the expense of their lungs.
It might sound rough, but that's the way it is.
ccscott49
Active member
Re: Surprised? Now, THAT\'s surprising!
Thats horseshit! All laminators have to have breathing gear etc. It's a legal requirement the company must supply it and ensure it's used. The HSE know all about it, they inspect these places very often and just arrive, no warnings, anybody who laminates boats or any polyester equipment without a full respirator, is a pillock! "Look in the mirror, there you will see the person responsible for your safety".
Thats horseshit! All laminators have to have breathing gear etc. It's a legal requirement the company must supply it and ensure it's used. The HSE know all about it, they inspect these places very often and just arrive, no warnings, anybody who laminates boats or any polyester equipment without a full respirator, is a pillock! "Look in the mirror, there you will see the person responsible for your safety".
pistonbroke
New member
Re: Surprised? Now, THAT\'s surprising!
I'm suprised to hear you say that it is a legal requirement for a company to supply "breathing gear" and to ensure it's used.
Where are you getting this information from ? And what is your interpritation of a full respirator?
As a boatbuilder I have occasional inspections by both my Insurance company and the HSE, and at no time have I been asked about "breathing gear" for the laminators. Infact, the wearing of such apparatus would at times make the job impossible. Having been involved in boatbuilding for around 20 years, I can honestly say that I have never seen "breathing gear" in use at any laminating shop that I have visited.
There are times when a face mask is used, but that is normally when dust is involved, such as when grinding, drilling or some types of filler.
In America, some states have strict regulations regarding laminating, forcing companies to install sophisticated air filtering systems. Some companies have moved there factories to avoid this, whist others have changed to Epoxy processes, which has increased the cost of their boats considerably.
There is talk of "open mould" moulding being outlawed by the EEC, and although this is unlikely to happen, if it did the costs involved to convert to an alternative system would force the majority of boat builders to either cease production, or transfer their production to overseas contractors. Either way the costs of boats would have to increase dramatically. I believe Genmar have experimented with a type of injection moulding, similar to the way a Lotus Esprit is moulded.
I agree that the wages for a laminator are poor, currently around £9.00 per hour, but a pay rise would only get added to the cost of the boat making our products far more expensive than the foriegn competition.
I'm suprised to hear you say that it is a legal requirement for a company to supply "breathing gear" and to ensure it's used.
Where are you getting this information from ? And what is your interpritation of a full respirator?
As a boatbuilder I have occasional inspections by both my Insurance company and the HSE, and at no time have I been asked about "breathing gear" for the laminators. Infact, the wearing of such apparatus would at times make the job impossible. Having been involved in boatbuilding for around 20 years, I can honestly say that I have never seen "breathing gear" in use at any laminating shop that I have visited.
There are times when a face mask is used, but that is normally when dust is involved, such as when grinding, drilling or some types of filler.
In America, some states have strict regulations regarding laminating, forcing companies to install sophisticated air filtering systems. Some companies have moved there factories to avoid this, whist others have changed to Epoxy processes, which has increased the cost of their boats considerably.
There is talk of "open mould" moulding being outlawed by the EEC, and although this is unlikely to happen, if it did the costs involved to convert to an alternative system would force the majority of boat builders to either cease production, or transfer their production to overseas contractors. Either way the costs of boats would have to increase dramatically. I believe Genmar have experimented with a type of injection moulding, similar to the way a Lotus Esprit is moulded.
I agree that the wages for a laminator are poor, currently around £9.00 per hour, but a pay rise would only get added to the cost of the boat making our products far more expensive than the foriegn competition.
ccscott49
Active member
Re: Surprised? Now, THAT\'s surprising!
I believe some materials used by some boatbuilders, require the use of full respirators, but a fume mask is meant to be used with polyester, if you don't then fine, thats the way you do it. If the employee see's fit to ignore safety standards that is also OK, for you. Here it is instant dismisal to not use safety equipment supplied. No excuses. We take safety very seriously.
I believe some materials used by some boatbuilders, require the use of full respirators, but a fume mask is meant to be used with polyester, if you don't then fine, thats the way you do it. If the employee see's fit to ignore safety standards that is also OK, for you. Here it is instant dismisal to not use safety equipment supplied. No excuses. We take safety very seriously.
boatone
Well-known member
Re: Surprised? Now, THAT\'s surprising!
UK law requires all companies to comply with the regulations re Control Of Substances Hazardous To Health (COSHH) and I am sure that Sealine is no exception. The regs are very specific and exact requirements will depend on the nature of the substances involved. HSE inspectors have wide powers of entry to inspect prermises and procedures and can in extreme cases issue a prohibition order shutting down a process completely until requirements are complied with.
I would certainly expect face masks to be in use as yoiu say where dust hazard is present but where fumes are a hazard these would most likely be dealt with by air extraction and exhaust - ie keep the fumes away from the worker.
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
UK law requires all companies to comply with the regulations re Control Of Substances Hazardous To Health (COSHH) and I am sure that Sealine is no exception. The regs are very specific and exact requirements will depend on the nature of the substances involved. HSE inspectors have wide powers of entry to inspect prermises and procedures and can in extreme cases issue a prohibition order shutting down a process completely until requirements are complied with.
I would certainly expect face masks to be in use as yoiu say where dust hazard is present but where fumes are a hazard these would most likely be dealt with by air extraction and exhaust - ie keep the fumes away from the worker.
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boatsontheweb.com/galleryframes.html> BoatsOnTheWeb Photo Gallery</A>
jfm
Well-known member
They dont wear breathing gear
Ccscott, I visited one of the fairline plants in Corby last year. The laminators did not wear any breathing apparatus. Neither did we, visiting punters, and we were standing next to the laminators talking to them as they worked. There was overhead fume extraction kit installed in the building, naturally
Ccscott, I visited one of the fairline plants in Corby last year. The laminators did not wear any breathing apparatus. Neither did we, visiting punters, and we were standing next to the laminators talking to them as they worked. There was overhead fume extraction kit installed in the building, naturally
ccscott49
Active member
Re: They dont wear breathing gear
Pity their lungs then working with modified polyester resin fumes, that close up even with extractor systems. You would not see me doing it, I have more respect for my health. As I said if they wish to risk their health, so be it, just don't try and sue the company later, when the long term effects of exposure start showing up. They said asbestos was safe, nuclear radiation, coal dust, etc. etc.
Pity their lungs then working with modified polyester resin fumes, that close up even with extractor systems. You would not see me doing it, I have more respect for my health. As I said if they wish to risk their health, so be it, just don't try and sue the company later, when the long term effects of exposure start showing up. They said asbestos was safe, nuclear radiation, coal dust, etc. etc.
G
Guest
Guest
Information is easily available from HSE website (prosecutions) giving details of which 2 Acts were breached.
Robbie W
Robbie W
MapisM
Well-known member
Horseshit? I\'d be happy if it was!
Colin, judging from your reply, it seems that my post was read as a sort of justification of what Sealine (and/or many others) do. If so, I have to explain that better.
I had the privilege to visit 4 boat plants in Italy (besides two wooden boat builders, but here GRP is what we're talking about); one in Spain, another couple in France and three in the US.
I'm not mentioning the names - just PM me if interested - but some of them have quite a reputation in boating industry.
None in UK unfortunately (but I guess that the situation should be similar to the rest of EU or US), nor in Far East (where I can bet that the situation could only be worse).
In NONE of the above I've ever seen more than a few face masks (not even in the US).
And that was in laminating areas. In those areas, visitors are (usually) just allowed to look into from some windows.
In the assembly areas, where I walked around without any restriction, not even those masks were used, nor I was ever offered to wear one. But the resins smell was always quite strong also in assembly areas, not to mention inside the boat cabins.
I never said this is correct, but, I repeat, that's the way it is.
And I fully agree with you - anyone should take care of his own safety in the first place.
But some workers in this industry are just poor people who spent their whole life to turn the dreams of rich people into reality.
I knew one of them a few years ago. A very nice guy, just retired. He told me about his work experiences, ranging from wood boats at the beginning, to the first GRP hulls, up to custom sportboats made for Ayrton Senna and others (football players, actors, etc.).
Since the boatyard where he worked was one of those which I visited, I asked him how he could stay there for many hours a day, and he replied smiling that it was just a matter of getting used to the smell, avoid smoking, and drinking milk regularly.
He recently died of lung cancer. A coincidence it might well be; who will ever know?
Colin, judging from your reply, it seems that my post was read as a sort of justification of what Sealine (and/or many others) do. If so, I have to explain that better.
I had the privilege to visit 4 boat plants in Italy (besides two wooden boat builders, but here GRP is what we're talking about); one in Spain, another couple in France and three in the US.
I'm not mentioning the names - just PM me if interested - but some of them have quite a reputation in boating industry.
None in UK unfortunately (but I guess that the situation should be similar to the rest of EU or US), nor in Far East (where I can bet that the situation could only be worse).
In NONE of the above I've ever seen more than a few face masks (not even in the US).
And that was in laminating areas. In those areas, visitors are (usually) just allowed to look into from some windows.
In the assembly areas, where I walked around without any restriction, not even those masks were used, nor I was ever offered to wear one. But the resins smell was always quite strong also in assembly areas, not to mention inside the boat cabins.
I never said this is correct, but, I repeat, that's the way it is.
And I fully agree with you - anyone should take care of his own safety in the first place.
But some workers in this industry are just poor people who spent their whole life to turn the dreams of rich people into reality.
I knew one of them a few years ago. A very nice guy, just retired. He told me about his work experiences, ranging from wood boats at the beginning, to the first GRP hulls, up to custom sportboats made for Ayrton Senna and others (football players, actors, etc.).
Since the boatyard where he worked was one of those which I visited, I asked him how he could stay there for many hours a day, and he replied smiling that it was just a matter of getting used to the smell, avoid smoking, and drinking milk regularly.
He recently died of lung cancer. A coincidence it might well be; who will ever know?