Brian_Moffat
New member
What was the question ?
Seacocks - open or closed?
- Thread starter jonathankent
- Start date
pvb
Well-known member
Hmmm...
Yet another helpful answer, Brian. The mental picture is building...
Yet another helpful answer, Brian. The mental picture is building...
Brian_Moffat
New member
Re: But that\'s the very point...
Dear oh! Dear oh! Dear Peop;e -
If you could just shut your mouth (or in this day and age your 'keyboard' and give it a bit of brainpower - you would have the solution
Bring back the Gaffers - at least they knew what they were doing!
Dear oh! Dear oh! Dear Peop;e -
If you could just shut your mouth (or in this day and age your 'keyboard' and give it a bit of brainpower - you would have the solution
Bring back the Gaffers - at least they knew what they were doing!
Ships_Cat
New member
They should be closed when the boat is not attended. Any advice to the contrary is foolish.
Here in NZ the greatest number of sinkings or partial sinkings occur while the boat is unattended and while I have not seen the statistics for NZ, in the USA I have seen insurers figures indicating that 4 times as many boats sink at the dock than while at sea.
Not all these flooding would be prevented by closing seacocks (and as has been pointed out, in many boats cockpit drains may need to be left open). Obviously, when the boat is sailing or otherwise attended then if flooding occurs it will normally be noticed. However, despite peoples' claims of faith in their hoses and plumbing arrangements a goodly many are from failed or dislodged hoses or siphoning (while not a yacht type problem but indicative of the unexpected, a major cause of backflooding here is the habit of many fishing boats leaving hoses over the side).
Your question regarding the seacocks being new means they can be relied on left open is either an April Fools joke or shows a lack of understanding of their purpose. Being relied on means relying on them when closed to keep water out, not relying on them when open to let water through.
John
Here in NZ the greatest number of sinkings or partial sinkings occur while the boat is unattended and while I have not seen the statistics for NZ, in the USA I have seen insurers figures indicating that 4 times as many boats sink at the dock than while at sea.
Not all these flooding would be prevented by closing seacocks (and as has been pointed out, in many boats cockpit drains may need to be left open). Obviously, when the boat is sailing or otherwise attended then if flooding occurs it will normally be noticed. However, despite peoples' claims of faith in their hoses and plumbing arrangements a goodly many are from failed or dislodged hoses or siphoning (while not a yacht type problem but indicative of the unexpected, a major cause of backflooding here is the habit of many fishing boats leaving hoses over the side).
Your question regarding the seacocks being new means they can be relied on left open is either an April Fools joke or shows a lack of understanding of their purpose. Being relied on means relying on them when closed to keep water out, not relying on them when open to let water through.
John
ShipsWoofy
New member
Always close those below the waterline.
Even the bog gets shut when we go to bed, as does the gas.
Some may say I am over cautious, I don't care, I feel better if they are shut.
Have left engines open when overnight on an anchorage where I was worried about the weather and we were waking regularly to check the situation. Engines were ready to go with keys in ignition etc.
But that is the exception.
Is it a problem for you to close them, maybe a re-location might be in order before you put her back in....
Even the bog gets shut when we go to bed, as does the gas.
Some may say I am over cautious, I don't care, I feel better if they are shut.
Have left engines open when overnight on an anchorage where I was worried about the weather and we were waking regularly to check the situation. Engines were ready to go with keys in ignition etc.
But that is the exception.
Is it a problem for you to close them, maybe a re-location might be in order before you put her back in....
longjohnsilver
Well-known member
Trust your sea cocks
Hmm, someone in Exmouth docks a few years ago in a nice refitted sailing boat did just that, trusted his recently replaced seacock and reterned about 6 weeks later to see most of his mast sticking up out of the water. Seems that something went badly wrong and the seacock tail failed with fairly dire consequences..........................
This was the second boat I know that sank in the docks cos the seacocks had been left open. Why take the risk, I always close mine.
Hmm, someone in Exmouth docks a few years ago in a nice refitted sailing boat did just that, trusted his recently replaced seacock and reterned about 6 weeks later to see most of his mast sticking up out of the water. Seems that something went badly wrong and the seacock tail failed with fairly dire consequences..........................
This was the second boat I know that sank in the docks cos the seacocks had been left open. Why take the risk, I always close mine.
Gin
Active member
Re: Best way...
skin fittings are below the water line and open seacocks are nothing more than a hole in the boat with a bit of plastic pipe maintaining watertight integrity- if you are happy with that state of affairs, fine.
However the cockpit drain seacocks are a different thing and in my opinion not comparable. They exit above the waterline and pose little risk when the boat is unattended
skin fittings are below the water line and open seacocks are nothing more than a hole in the boat with a bit of plastic pipe maintaining watertight integrity- if you are happy with that state of affairs, fine.
However the cockpit drain seacocks are a different thing and in my opinion not comparable. They exit above the waterline and pose little risk when the boat is unattended
john_morris_uk
Well-known member
Re: Best way...
[ QUOTE ]
However the cockpit drain seacocks are a different thing and in my opinion not comparable. They exit above the waterline and pose little risk when the boat is unattended
[/ QUOTE ] My cockpit drains exit straight down to seacocks on the lowest submerged part of the hull - as deep as you can get without being part of the keel! Bit difficult for me to leave these closed?
I have replaced them, renewed the hoses, the clips and the bronze hose tails though...
[ QUOTE ]
However the cockpit drain seacocks are a different thing and in my opinion not comparable. They exit above the waterline and pose little risk when the boat is unattended
[/ QUOTE ] My cockpit drains exit straight down to seacocks on the lowest submerged part of the hull - as deep as you can get without being part of the keel! Bit difficult for me to leave these closed?
I have replaced them, renewed the hoses, the clips and the bronze hose tails though...
Benbow
New member
Re: Best way...
i am surprised this is causing any discussion. Why would you not close underwater seacocks when the boat is unattended ?? An open seacock is unquestionably a greater risk to your boat than a closed one.
Cockpit drains with underwater exits are different, if they represent a greater hazard when closed, leave them open.
[ QUOTE ]
If you're going to leave some open, you might as well leave them all open (which is what I do).
[/ QUOTE ]
You are saying 'if you are going to have 2 weak points, why not have 6' /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif Obviously you are free to do what you like, but to me any hazardous activity is about knowing and minimising the opportunities for disaster. To say I am doing one risky thing so I may as well do more sounds a little strange to me.
i am surprised this is causing any discussion. Why would you not close underwater seacocks when the boat is unattended ?? An open seacock is unquestionably a greater risk to your boat than a closed one.
Cockpit drains with underwater exits are different, if they represent a greater hazard when closed, leave them open.
[ QUOTE ]
If you're going to leave some open, you might as well leave them all open (which is what I do).
[/ QUOTE ]
You are saying 'if you are going to have 2 weak points, why not have 6' /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif Obviously you are free to do what you like, but to me any hazardous activity is about knowing and minimising the opportunities for disaster. To say I am doing one risky thing so I may as well do more sounds a little strange to me.
guernseyman
Well-known member
Re: Best way...
For what it's worth, there's a group of people here who have convinced themselves that it's a good idea to leave the engine cooling water inlet stopcock open - because, they say, they might forget to open it when they start the engine.
For what it's worth, there's a group of people here who have convinced themselves that it's a good idea to leave the engine cooling water inlet stopcock open - because, they say, they might forget to open it when they start the engine.
A
angelsson
Guest
A seacock is potentialy a big hole under the waterline, I service mine regularly but treat such potential holes where the ocean can come in through, with great caution and circumspect.
When not in use, a closed seacock is much much safer than an open one, with all the potential results if a failure occurs, why take the risk when it is avoidable.
I must agree with all those, and we seem to be in the majority, who advocate closure when leaving the boat.
Take your pick and good luck.
Mike
When not in use, a closed seacock is much much safer than an open one, with all the potential results if a failure occurs, why take the risk when it is avoidable.
I must agree with all those, and we seem to be in the majority, who advocate closure when leaving the boat.
Take your pick and good luck.
Mike
pvb
Well-known member
Weak points?...
I don't see seacocks as weak points at all. Properly fitted and maintained, they're perfectly secure. In the same way, the stern gland is only held on by 2 hoseclips, but I don't worry about that suddenly coming off and sinking the boat (and indeed, there's nothing I could do about that "risk" anyway). Nor do I worry about the log transducer unscrewing itself and letting water in.
I don't see seacocks as weak points at all. Properly fitted and maintained, they're perfectly secure. In the same way, the stern gland is only held on by 2 hoseclips, but I don't worry about that suddenly coming off and sinking the boat (and indeed, there's nothing I could do about that "risk" anyway). Nor do I worry about the log transducer unscrewing itself and letting water in.
pheran
New member
I rarely close mine as they are ALL at least 18" above the water-line. Gas is another matter - always turned off at the master switch when not in use, whether we are onboard or not.
Tisme
New member
[ QUOTE ]
You know it's lovely to get a nice easy one occasonaly - the answer is yes!
[/ QUOTE ]
Brian,
As the question was "Is it best to leave seacocks open or closed when leaving the boat?" your answer is no help at all!
You know it's lovely to get a nice easy one occasonaly - the answer is yes!
[/ QUOTE ]
Brian,
As the question was "Is it best to leave seacocks open or closed when leaving the boat?" your answer is no help at all!
Benbow
New member
Re: Weak points?...
[ QUOTE ]
I don't see seacocks as weak points at all.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK, then good luck.
[ QUOTE ]
In the same way, the stern gland is only held on by 2 hoseclips, but I don't worry about that suddenly coming off and sinking the boat (and indeed, there's nothing I could do about that "risk" anyway). Nor do I worry about the log transducer unscrewing itself and letting water in.
[/ QUOTE ]
The stern gland is of course a risk, not much of a risk when not underway as the propshaft is blocking the hole and nothing is turning. That analysis tells you that there is something that you can do about it - 1. attach a jubilee clip to the prop shaft so that if the coupling fails it won't fall out. 2. Keep a softwood bung close by. I have seen a propshaft coupling fail.
Similarly for the log transducer - you could, keep a bung or a blank nearby. It is also probably less of a risk than a seacock as there is less pipe and less tail to fail.
You can't reduce risk to zero, indeed you probably don't want to. But personally, I don't get much of a thrill from the thought that a seacock may fail and fill the boat with water. I prefer to take my risks elsewhere. Of course it is entirely up to you how you run your boat.
Best wishes
[ QUOTE ]
I don't see seacocks as weak points at all.
[/ QUOTE ]
OK, then good luck.
[ QUOTE ]
In the same way, the stern gland is only held on by 2 hoseclips, but I don't worry about that suddenly coming off and sinking the boat (and indeed, there's nothing I could do about that "risk" anyway). Nor do I worry about the log transducer unscrewing itself and letting water in.
[/ QUOTE ]
The stern gland is of course a risk, not much of a risk when not underway as the propshaft is blocking the hole and nothing is turning. That analysis tells you that there is something that you can do about it - 1. attach a jubilee clip to the prop shaft so that if the coupling fails it won't fall out. 2. Keep a softwood bung close by. I have seen a propshaft coupling fail.
Similarly for the log transducer - you could, keep a bung or a blank nearby. It is also probably less of a risk than a seacock as there is less pipe and less tail to fail.
You can't reduce risk to zero, indeed you probably don't want to. But personally, I don't get much of a thrill from the thought that a seacock may fail and fill the boat with water. I prefer to take my risks elsewhere. Of course it is entirely up to you how you run your boat.
Best wishes
Phoenix of Hamble
Active member
Re: Weak points?...
I'm gobsmacked that anyone thinks it makes sense to leave 'em open.....
And totally agree.... use 'em regularly and they'll keep operating freely and effectively for when you really need 'em...
My shaft seal bothers me a load more than the seacocks I have to admit though....
I'm gobsmacked that anyone thinks it makes sense to leave 'em open.....
And totally agree.... use 'em regularly and they'll keep operating freely and effectively for when you really need 'em...
My shaft seal bothers me a load more than the seacocks I have to admit though....
l'escargot
New member
Re: OK...
[ QUOTE ]
....You reckon that boats primarily sink from leaving seacocks open...
[/ QUOTE ]
No, what I said was that a boat was more at risk from sinking through a failed open seacock than a failed closed one. I still can't see any good argument for leaving a seacock open on a moored boat unless it is draining water out of the boat. I close mine when I am sleeping on the boat, let alone when I am not there.
[ QUOTE ]
....You reckon that boats primarily sink from leaving seacocks open...
[/ QUOTE ]
No, what I said was that a boat was more at risk from sinking through a failed open seacock than a failed closed one. I still can't see any good argument for leaving a seacock open on a moored boat unless it is draining water out of the boat. I close mine when I am sleeping on the boat, let alone when I am not there.
l'escargot
New member
Re: But that\'s the very point...
That is an interesting response to my post, what does it mean?
That is an interesting response to my post, what does it mean?
Boathook
Well-known member
Close them when leaving the boat. If liveaboard/holiday operate once a week. I had a new heads inlet hose that did not seal this weekend so the seacock had a lot of use - even on the mooring !!
Heckler
Active member
if i am on the boat (ie weekend or longer) cocks stay open at all times, when we go home they are shut, result, nice and free seacocks and piece of mind, no way for sea to come in. benes dont have drains requiring seacocks.
stu
stu