Salvage

[chevey]

As far as i know there was something wrong with the engine. Water in the fuel?
The person who was in charge of the boat sailed towards the harbor entrance When they got close they radioed the coast guard for assistance.
The coast guard refused to send help as it was not a life threatening incident.
They could still of got there with the sails.
There was nothing wrong with the boat other than the engine wouldn't run.
The Coast Guard either called the man with fishing boat or gave his number to the person in charge of my friends boat
The person in charge of the boat has a yachtmaster certificate with a commercial endorsement so should know what he is doing.

This is all the information i have i have
I was just trying to find out the law on this.
It seems a bit unfair for him to be out of pocket by over £800 when he was not there and he was only contacred after the event to be asked for the money.

Paula

 

[savageseadog]

It's a not uninteresting point that the the total legal costs would have been at least three times as much as the award, maybe even higher.
I wonder if this was all covered by insurance, I notice that a QC represented the defence.

 

[tazzle]

I'd suggest they have available the boat's exact positions and states of wind and tide at the time. It may also be useful to ask the many expert raggies on here for their opinions as to whether in the circumstances he could have made it in on sail alone.

Was 10 miles out mentioned? Was this when the engine failure was discovered or when it was decided to motor in rather than sail in due to the prevailing circumstances? If the harbour entrance was a difficult one would it not have been more feasible to ask a tow to stand-by outside the harbour rather than take a tow for 10 miles? Was it not possible without a tow to have made shelter?

I think the answer to this lies in the 'sailmanship' issues. Many on here (but not me) will be well qualified to comment.

 

[Seagreen]

[ QUOTE ]
"While he was out sailing he ran into problems and radioed for a tow in."

[/ QUOTE ]

So, was he dismasted? Hampered by press of weather? In imminent danger of sinking?

I think the "friend" had a nonstarting engine ( shredded the impellor, perchance?) and got bored or didn't want to miss closing time, and (as of another post hearabouts) wanted the RNLI to tug him home.

Non of this is in the detail. I think negotiations with the insurers and a trip to the small claims court by the owner, taking his erstwhile "friend" with him are the order of the day.

Oh.and I usually offer a tow to other yachts if they are going my way - you never know who you'll meet. Last time I helped anyone (neaped Cornish crabber) I got a litre of whisky. Nice.

 

[abdiel]

If the boat beeing towed was within the jurisdiction of a port authority salvage cannot be claimed.
If the tower didnt report the 'salvage' to the reciever of wrecks he is in forfeit.
Finaly, the salvor is only the custodian of the property being salvaged untill the rightfull owner is found and then it is up to the owner to reward as they deem fit. ie was the salvage easy or difficult; was the weather bad; how far was the tow !!
All of this was featured in a past copy of PBO some time agoif some of you eagle-eyed yachties will remember.

 

[rich]

[ QUOTE ]
Go see a solicitor - they are trying it on.

[/ QUOTE ]

It will be cheaper to pay the £800 /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[landaftaf]

interesting - and to my mind that was a salvage award (as it meets the basic three criteria I already mentioned)

some time ago I read an extraordinary tale whereby a contract tow parted and the towing tug re-attached herself and successfully claimed salvage - unfortunately I cant remember the details ....... maybe ships gear which parted and tugs gear used to save her

but going back to the original post - if the coastguard deemed the situation was not safety related, the yacht was not in peril so it is not salvage action.

unless maritime law has completly changed the meaning of 'marine salvage'

so - I repeat, challenge it

 

[tazzle]

Yes, the CG decided that there was no risk to human life or of the vessel being lost, but it seems it's not just 'peril' that can turn a commercial act into a salvage act in UK law; was the boat in a 'situation which would expose it to damage' - clearly this is something more than scratching the gel coat, but something less than total loss.

Agree wholly with challenging the claim - but suggest this is done on the basis of the facts (if they support this), e.g.

- the boat was in no or at negligible risk of damage
- a 'reasonable person' would not have taken a tow on salvage terms.

 

[landaftaf]

without sounding pedantic - in the previous case the coaster was deemed to be in peril in that she would have grounded at some imminent stage, causing loss/damage

peril - click here

unless the yacht was in danger of sinking, disappearing over the horizon never to be seen again or had someone in need of immediate medical assistance (which it wasnt/didnt), it wasnt in peril.

under normal circumstances the owner (or his rep - in this case the skipper) should have attempted to negotiate a fixed tow.

the tug could refuse and wait until the yacht became imperilled ....... maybe sooner but probably later, in which case the CG could re-appraise the situation and call the Lifeboat Secretary .........

more than likely the tug would 'try it on' about salvage then accept a contract tow, so for 3 hrs work it should not have been too much.

IMO of course ......... I expect we are saying the same thing but in different ways.

so - small claim court, pay for an expert witness statement regards it not being an act of salvage, and recoup the costs from the claimant ......... then offer him a reasonable sum or let him go to arbritation.

the cheeky opportunistic and greedy scroat.

 

[fisherman]

The insurance company might be approached, mine has £1000 excess except for towage or salvage, obviously to encourage people to accept help rather than imperil the vessel.

 

[cliffordpope]

I vaguely recall a national drama many years ago - late 50s? - with a coaster drifting helplessly, and the captain, the only remaining man on board, stubbornly negotiating with various circling tugs, each hoping to get the contract for the tow. There were pictures in the papers of the captain alone on the sea-swept bridge.
I can't recall the outcome - I think he held out until the owners' tug arrived.

A bit of a contrast with today, when people just seem to treat the coastguards and lifeboat as a kind of motor recovery service.

 

[fisherman]

Not the Flying Enterprise? Subsequent opinion suggested he should have hopped into one of the two, Cadgwith and Lizard, lifeboats that stayed with the ship until crews and fuel were exhausted.
The other similar case was the Union Star..........since when the CG has powers to force the ship to take a tow.