C08
Well-Known Member
My sailing club following advice from the QHM Portsmouth has decreed that we can visit our boats for essential repairs/maintenance but are not allowed off the pontoon or to stay overnight!
RYA Says we can go sailing - but only with our household.
- Thread starter oldharry
- Start date
Tomaret
Well-Known Member
Your sailing club seems to be reading too much into LNTM 30/20. QHM would clearly prefer us not to go sailing, with spurious comments about the Harbour Patrol not operating (which is normally a weekend operation anyway) and no lifeguards on beaches, but realises it can’t actually say we can’t. It remains to be tested whether the MoD Police follow government guidance and allow free passage or QHM’s view and come over to “ ‘ave a word”. My boat yard in the Harbour has sent us a “Welcome Back to Sailing“ email that reflects the Government’s latest advice, which allows us to sail, but not to stay away from home overnight, so in that regard your sailing club is following government advice.
Daverw
Well-Known Member
Just read the following from Defra website
There are no restrictions on how far you can travel to get to the countryside. However you should not stay overnight. Campsites and caravan parks are closed and you cannot visit a holiday or second home.
i notice is says should not stay overnight and not cannot stay overnight,
There are no restrictions on how far you can travel to get to the countryside. However you should not stay overnight. Campsites and caravan parks are closed and you cannot visit a holiday or second home.
i notice is says should not stay overnight and not cannot stay overnight,
Tomaret
Well-Known Member
I think that you are suggesting that this is a recommendation from government, which would reflect one meaning of “should“. I suggest that it was written with the other meaning - obligation or duty - in mind. It is entirely consistent with the Government’s actions and statements to date that they issue guidance that is susceptible to different interpretations. For now I shall take it as an obligation. When the weather gets warmer I might take a different view.
Lucky Duck
Well-Known Member
The difference between should, shall, must/must not is demonstrated in the introduction to the highway code which explains which terms are legal obligations and which are good advice.
As pretty much every harbour authority has said they are not accepting overnight visitors that doesn't leave many places to go in Lake Solent and immediate vicinty and while my home berth is a pleasant place the prospect of having to debate the issue the marina staff isn't overly appealing.
I suppose I could hide under the duvet and keep the lights off so nobody sees me..
As pretty much every harbour authority has said they are not accepting overnight visitors that doesn't leave many places to go in Lake Solent and immediate vicinty and while my home berth is a pleasant place the prospect of having to debate the issue the marina staff isn't overly appealing.
I suppose I could hide under the duvet and keep the lights off so nobody sees me..
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
To me it says you can go sailing as long as the Government says you can and you follow their guidance. In fact it goes further - it only "encourages you to consider" Government guidelines.
QHM aren't really interested in leisure boaters unless they are causing a problem in my very limited experience of them but they can certainly tell you whether or not you can sail - the best you can hope for is a long and expensive judicial review of whether or not QHM is exceeding it's mandate to protect the harbour, the Matelots in it, Grey Funnel, etc.
Queen's Harbour Master Portsmouth
LNTM NO 30/20
Recreational Boating During Coronavirus - Revised Guidance
1. NOTICE IS HEREBY GIVEN by the Queen’s Harbour Master Portsmouth that following the Government’s revised social distancing measures aimed at reducing the spread of the COVID-19 Coronavirus, we are continuing to review our advice to recreational boaters in concert with industry bodies and the regional ports and harbours. Further clarity is currently being sought from the Department for Culture, Media and Sport who are setting details of how facility operators and water users will be required to comply, and our advice will be updated in line with this guidance.
2. In the meantime, QHM Portsmouth continues to operate an open port policy, the primary purpose of which is to protect defence output and commercial activity including vital transport, trade routes, and industry. Some leisure facility providers within the Dockyard Port are considering the feasibility of re-opening while addressing how to manage constraints which may be imposed to meet the Government’s requirements. Individuals whose circumstances permit them access to the water are encouraged to consider the following:
- Whether your activity is being carried out in conformance with Government regulations for social distancing and exercise, including on the shore when accessing the water?
- Whether sufficient maintenance has been conducted on your vessel to ensure it remains serviceable and seaworthy, reducing the risk of needing external assistance?
- Any other aspects which increase the risk of depending on emergency responders including experience levels and prevailing conditions.
- The fact that at present there are no RNLI lifeguards on beaches, no Volunteer Harbour Patrol in Portsmouth Harbour, and although volunteer lifeboat crews are fully operational should they be needed, it is important that anyone visiting the coast understands the risk and takes the necessary steps to keep themselves safe.
Tuesday 12 May 2020
G A F Sherwood
Queen's Harbour Master
ashtead
Well-Known Member
I cannot see anything in QHM notice which prevents leaving Portsmouth and travelling to Chi or that chi would prevent entry if you were happy to tie up to a buoy somewhere . It might be you then have to row ashore and spend the night in the car park.
Fantasie 19
Well-Known Member
JumbleDuck
Well-Known Member
There are 26 ICU beds in two wards at the Derriford Hospital in Plymouth, but presumably nobody from Cornwall would dream of using them. Mind you, the death rate in Cornwall by 1st May was 35% higher than the death rate in Devon, so that's an additional incentive for Devonians to blockade the Tamar bridges.
matt1
Well-Known Member
I'm deffo a "dove" on the whole unlock and convinced we have just sown a future 2nd wave, so am not fussed about overnighting BUT......I am very concerned about Hrb mstrs exercising powers I don't they have (or should have) AND …….Lumping us in with 2nd homes because we can sleep on our boats. Dangerous precedent IMHO. Come the tax rises which will follow this we don't want our vessels taxed because we have the ability to sleep on them. I think the RYA need to really push back on this dangerous association now, even whilst accepting we won't overnight. Just don't lump us in with 2nd homes and caravan parks
Poignard
Well-Known Member
Presumably members of one's household includes staff?
tugger
Well-Known Member
Just out of interest, can you justify on what grounds they shouldn't?
matt1
Well-Known Member
Fair point, especially as I'm someone who has never agreed with the reduced tax on diesel used for an entirely discretionary pastime. But I do think taxing boats would likely be regressive and could prove the death knell for the sport and industry, which already has dwindling participation.
Hacker
Well-Known Member
Personally I would drive past Derriford in favour of the RDE. If you didn’t watch the BBC programme Hospital this week (2 episodes) I suggest you do. Whilst the risk of catching CV19 might be low the impact can be devastating. As someone who worked for the NHS for 43 years and has a son working on a Covid ITU I’m going to take great care to keep away from Covidiots.
chubby
Well-Known Member
I went out today from my swinging mooring in Portsmouth which I could access in a socially isolated way and went round to anchor in Stokes bay for lunch and back, multiple MOD police launches buzzing around as one carrier alongside and one anchored in Stokes bay but they paid absolutely no interest in me other than a friendly wave, there were maybe 6 other boats out in the east solent and a couple anchored in Stokes bay (NE wind) so no problem so long as you follow the rules and stick to the boat channel etc.
grumpy_o_g
Well-Known Member
One reason could be that resources such as the NHS are allocated based on the primary home. A big influx of people of people to their homes in Devon or Cornwall especially in Winter could cause an issue for the local services perhaps - just guessing. A second home means that family has now potentially infected two homes instead of just one - basically the surface attack vector has just doubled - less critical for a boat where it's less likely to have anyone coming in but second homes usually employ cleaners, etc. From the point of view of staying overnight on a boat, unless one has a pretty large boat, it's a very confined space in which to put a family which must increase the chance of cross infection I would have thought.