Rocna Anchors acquired by Canada Metal Pacific

[toad_oftoadhall]

Hi you said Grant admitted the allegations, is that what you meant

No, allegations "plural" wasn't really what I meant. There was one single allegation Grant admitted. I'd completely forgotten the other allegations which weren't very memorable and were not admitted as far as I know.

So I meant he'd admitted one allegation which was nothing to do with Anchors and was the one that stuck in my mind. (And one that got the thread pulled judging by the timing.)

In my defence I corrected myself within 15 minutes, after I refreshed my memory about the post Snooks is talking about.

Sorry, to everyone for that plural, especially Grant.

 

[toad_oftoadhall]

Not the ones that Steve put in about Grant stealing money from Rocna. They weren't true.

The others had no relevance to the thread, or this discussion

Those were my words Snooks and I've already put the hair shirt on for that.

In my defence I corrected myself very quickly.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Let's move on folks. This is getting nowhere.

Edit. Lazy Kipper obviously had the same thought.

Edit again! Then he edited his last post!

 

[Colvic Watson]

Let's keep it to the dodgy anchors chaps, that's the news

I will give an example:

Boyd Boats ( UK) order placed 26 Feb 2010 and shipped 13 may 2010

5x 4kg Q420
5x 6kg Q420
25x 10kg Q420
35x 15kg Q620
15x 20kg Q420
10x 25kg Q620
1x 33kg Q420
2x 40kg Q420
2x 55kg Q420
1x 70kg Q620


Suncoast Marine Canada order placed 1 March 2010 shipped 23 April 2010

20x 4kg Q420
40x 6kh Q420
70x 15kg Q620
60x 20kg Q420
70x 25kg Q620
20x 33kg Q420
25x 40kg Q620
12x 55kg Q420
4x 70kg Q420
2x 110kg Q420
1x 150kg Q420


Watertight Marine Spain order placed 29 Jan 2010 shipped 13 may 2010

2x 4kg Q420
8x 4kgRRR Q420
3x 6kg Q420
8x 6kgRRR Q420
6x 10kg Q420
6x 15kg Q620
6x 20kg Q420
10x 25kg Q420
8x 33kg Q420
7x 40kg Q420
5x 55kg Q420
3x 70kg Q420
6x 15kg stowable Q420

New Zealand order placed 22 Jan 2010 and 12 March 2010 shipped May 2010

10x 20kg Q420

24x 4kg Q420
24x 6kg Q420
24x 10kg Q420
20x 15kg Q620
6x 20kg Q420
12x 25kg Q620
6x 33kg Q420
4x 55kg Q620
10x 4kgRRR Q420
20x 6kgRRR Q420

order placed 22 March 2010 shipped 17 may 2010

6x 15kg stowable Q420
10x 4kgRRR Q420
20x 6kgRRR Q420

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Let's keep it to the dodgy anchors chaps, that's the news

You're not going to edit it yet again are you?


back to anchors.

That order to Boyds is interesting , and worrying. We have been categorically assured that no 420's were sent to UK.

I wonder if RocnaOne would care to comment?

 

[Elessar]

OK...I've just had a skim read of all 20 pages or all 768 posts which it why it has taken a bit of time. If there is anything in there that anyone is unhappy with PM me and I'll edit it.

The thread is back and locked and will remain locked

You can however view the link here

I have had to edit the unfounded allegations about Grant King that were on Steve Banbury's post. I'm sure everyone understands why

Snooks,

we were told very clearly it was far too much work and far too much of a burden to do this to threads, even important ones.

You did this over and above your busy day job.

And it's not your first time either.

So a big thank you from this forum user.

 

[LittleSister]

Thanks to Snooks!

Snooks,

we were told very clearly it was far too much work and far too much of a burden to do this to threads, even important ones.

You did this over and above your busy day job.

And it's not your first time either.

So a big thank you from this forum user.

+1

 

[snooks]

It was Rigger's idea.

I was merely the conduit...

At the time there were many stories flying around, I can understand why the thread was pulled.

 

[Rigger Mortice]

Conduit or not, many thanks. It's appreciated.

 

[Neeves]

And again thanks, Snooks and the team at YBW.

To return to, some of, the issues.

I recall someone saying (or did I imagine it?) that WM, and anyone else, had had few returns over WM's Specification Notice. (As an aside, was it only on the website - or did they send it by post to their customer base, and who reads the recall notices on Websites?)

I also note that since the Specification Notice was issued we seem to have sufficient evidence to suggest that the out or spec, or below spec, material used was Q420 steel (a product with half the strength of that advertised by WM and Rocna, and half the strength demanded by the designer). The specifc material was not mentioned in the Specification Notice. I also note that Grant is stating that in 2010 Suncoast received 288 of these 420 shanked anchors (and WM was by far the largest customer for Rocna anchors in N Am).

I wonder, now that the issue of exactly what the out of spec material was and the numbers involved (and the few returned) whether WM are having a re-think over their Specification Notice.

Possibly a better defined, or better worded, notice might have crystallised the minds of owners and possibly a greater number of anchors might have been returned.

As things stand WM, and other importers/chandlers, look a bit exposed if anything really go wrong.

The evidence has been posted (there has been no, public, denial), the implications of a safety issue appear clear (to me). At this point, 'CMP' (CMP, Bambury, Smith(s)), the importers, the chandlers all have a responsibility that is going to be very difficult to deny?

Jonathan

 

[vyv_cox]

That order to Boyds is interesting , and worrying. We have been categorically assured that no 420's were sent to UK.

Technically that is correct, although Boyd Boats were the distributor for UK they were based in Ireland. Mine came from them well before the dates under discussion.

 

[GrantKing]

Technically that is correct, although Boyd Boats were the distributor for UK they were based in Ireland. Mine came from them well before the dates under discussion.

Boyd Boats were the Master Distributors for UK, Ireland and Greece.

I will state again for those wh either didn't get it, or choose to ignore it, all Chinese Rocna Anchors from 2008 until late 2009 were either 400 or 420 shanks. From the period late 2009 - mid 2010 there was a gradual change from 420 to 620 shanks instigated by myself ,against the wishes of Bambury, because of the failures of 420 shanks and the public risk factor of continuing to use it.

During the early period of 2010 the production sheets carried an identifier for the material of the shanks ( either 420 or 620), this was to identify the different prices for the 2 shanks and once the prices were matched the identifier code was removed from the sheets.

There was also a code sticker applied to the shank noting either 420 or 620. There is a photo of this in one of my photo albums on this forum but it still locked awaiting moderator approval.

Everyone needs to understand once and for all that 620 was not introduced into the production line until late 2009 in small numbers and from that time on there were mixed shanks in every order sent from China.

The shipments quoted in my previous posting are not all of the mixed shipments, only a snapshot example from that time and show that Bambury was more than a little reticent with the truth.

 

[snooks]

There was also a code sticker applied to the shank noting either 420 or 620. There is a photo of this in one of my photo albums on this forum but it still locked awaiting moderator approval.

All approved

 

[JayBee]

I bought a 20kg Rocna from Boyd's Boats in 2008. Since then I have swung around this anchor in fair weather and foul, in strong tidal streams over many different holding grounds.

So far the anchor has easily outperformed a genuine CQR and Bruce of the same weight.

The anchor shank is unbent and the galvanising is good. Does this mean that my Rocna is a NZ produced, Bisalloy 80 model, or should I now start worrying??

 

[macd]

I bought a 20kg Rocna from Boyd's Boats in 2008...The anchor shank is unbent and the galvanising is good. Does this mean that my Rocna is a NZ produced, Bisalloy 80 model, or should I now start worrying??

From what Grant wrote two posts above yours, it would depend on precisely when your anchor was shipped, which would be hard for you to know -- although if you bought it very early in '08, presumably it might be a good 'un.

Clout the shank with a centre punch. Search this thread for how and why.

 

[macd]

Just one thought, provoked by JayBee's post above:
this can of worms would be far less worrying to customers if Rocnas (and other anchors) had a unique ID stamped or inscribed on the them, or at least carried on accompaying paperwork. If £20 electrical appliances can have that, why not £500 anchors?

 

[JayBee]

From what Grant wrote two posts above yours, it would depend on precisely when your anchor was shipped, which would be hard for you to know -- although if you bought it very early in '08, presumably it might be a good 'un.

Clout the shank with a centre punch. Search this thread for how and why.

Yes, that's what I suspected.

Another thing, my centre punch is almost certainly Chinese.

 

[Bosun Higgs]

1800 posts in the two threads! unbelievable! never seen so much bile on a subject before.

 

[FishyInverness]

And all because one person thought that the best form of marketing was to ensure that every time an anchor thread popped up on a forum, he was there to tell everyone gathered that any other anchor discussed is inferior to the product he was 'affiliated' with, in very brash and sometimes unsubstatianted terms...having read pages, and pages and pages through sheer bloody minded interest, I can imagine why there is Bile to be spewed...

 

[misterg]

The anchor shank is unbent and the galvanising is good. Does this mean that my Rocna is a NZ produced, Bisalloy 80 model, or should I now start worrying??

I believe I read earlier that you can tell a NZ produced Rocna because it has a fabricated blade, rather than cast (i.e. it won't have the word "ROCNA" cast into it).

I don't believe there is any questionmark about the NZ produced Rocnas, but there are HUGE questionmarks around the Chinese Rocnas made of Q420 steel.

Oh, and sorry to be pedantic, but Neeves - Q420 is 60% of the strength of Bisalloy, not 'half'.

Andy