RNLI pay

I used to complain about all the money the RNLI has but over the years I have changed my mind. People complain about response times for the police/ambulance and the lack of resources. You never get these complains about the RNLI.

The fact is they are there 24/7, their equipment is superb and the guys who volounteer are well trained and properly kitted out. The "service" works and we should be proud that we have such a world class service which is suported by voluntary contributions. To run such an efficient and extensive network of services requires good people who have the correct management and technical expertise, and to get those people you need to pay them at market rates.
 
toad_oftoadhall said:
So you're saying Mike is wrong and there *are* suitable alternative vessels available - that's exactly what I'm saying.
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Still not quite sure what you're trying to prove here? RNLI uses bespoke designe boats built/designed to their requirements - so (aparrantly) does Spain. Are you suggesting it would be cheaper/better to buy a one-off design from elsewhere, rather than home-grown? Are you sure the design requirements would be the same? (There being some difference in conditions between the Med and the North Sea </simplistic>)
 
Bajansailor said:
...And very often it is not just the cost of a new boat, but also the cost of a new boathouse and carriage or slipway to suit the new boat, and these all add up enormously...
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This is all too true!

I can't remember the exact figures, but, the Lizard RNLI is getting a new boat - cost about £500k. It doesn't fit in the current lifeboat house, so that needs to be rebuilt - cost about £3.5M (same design as Padstow).
 
mikefleetwood said:
Still not quite sure what you're trying to prove here?
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You said:

Yep, I'm sure there are many boats available off the shelf - 40-50', capable of 25kn+, self-righting and safe(ish) in almost any sea conditions, carrying crew and 20+ "passengers" in the dry (no need for berths), and, of course, ready to go within minutes - all for under £500k.
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Which I took to be a claim that there are not viable alternatives to designing and building bespoke boats locally in Britain. (If it wasn't saying that what was your point?)

I said other nations manage fine without the RNLI designs. Then Capn Sensible gave the Spanish as an example of a nation that doesn't use RNLI designs. I can't be arsed to check but I'm sure there are other nations that don't use RNLI designs.

So I'm sticking with my original claim that there *are* available alternatives.

I'm flattered that you want my views on whether or not the RNLI *should* buy boats in. Since you ask FWIW while there's plenty of cash for it I think the RNLI should buy British & design and build locally just because the money's donated out of the British Economy and should stay here, boosting our own marine business. Not that I would expect or want the RNLI to take the slightest bit of notice of my views on this.
 
toad_oftoadhall said:
(snip) A load of Diesel must get burned behaving as a free sea-start service (what percentage of shouts are for engine breakdowns?) Rescuing dogs can't be cheap.

(snip).
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Neither of these are in the RNLI "remit" but they are sometimes carried out as a goodwill gesture & as realistic training excercises. A situation where there are lives in danger would clearly be given priority over such calls.

I am a Shoreline member & such "rescues" regularly appear in the magazine & can offer excellent photo-opportunities & usefull positive publicity.
 
Toad;
The RNLI aims to use the very best possible equipment to save lives & protect their volunteer crews. As a member, I approve of that aim. It means being at the leading edge of lifeboat design. That is why they employ specialist designers. Many overseas life saving organisations are Govt run & less focussed on "the best equipment" and therefore buy retired RNLI boats or use their designs. In both cases, the RNLI should benefit from some aditional income.

You say the RNLI are not interested in your views - I presume you are not a member then? Please join, it isn't that expensive, you will get a better understanding of their aims & principles, you can have an input to their magazine if you have strong views & your money will be spent keeping the RNLI the best in the world.
 
Searush said:
Toad;
The RNLI aims to use the very best possible equipment to save lives & protect their volunteer crews.

You say the RNLI are not interested in your views
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With respect, you seem to be reading words into my posts that are not there.

I haven't said the RNLI should not have the best equipment they can afford, I've merely expressed doubts about the apparent claims that there are no alternatives to bespoke design.

I haven't said the RNLI are not interested in my views. (How would I know that they weren't?) As it happens I can't see any reason why they would be interested in my views, but if they are they are welcome to PM me and I'll give them my mobile number and monologue for as long as they can stand it!
 
Regarding the pay of the RNLI said:
Agreed, and he took over from an ex-Brigade Commander who is one of the few Brits to have fought in Vietnam.

I have no problem with salary level as long as they produce the results - which, in the case of the RNLI, they do.
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I wonder why 'designed just for them' appears to be mis interpreted or not understood!

Oh well, I reckon the RNLI are an organisation that the UK can be justly proud of. There aren't many other coastal nations in the world that take such care of their own and other seafarers.

Eleven out of ten :)
 
dylanwinter said:
it would be nice to know what their job descriptions are

but we live in a country where a primary school head is apparently worth over £200,000 a year

and a middle ranking BBC spread sheet jockey is worth double that

and that is before we stray into the territory of the city of London

so my measuring stick of value is clearly in depeerate need of re-calibrating

Dylan
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I am a middle ranking spreadsheet jockey and wish I were worth/paid half that never mind twice. How do I get a job at the BBC on that sort of salary?:-)
 
toad_oftoadhall said:
For people interested I'd strongly urge a read of this entire thread:
http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk.rec.sailing/msg/4efd051856744800

Rob Cullen & Marshall Rice both seem to have some pretty useful comment.
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Interesting reading.

I have to say that I am not against paying senior managers and the CEO of the RNLI the "market rate" and I fully support the RNLI at a operational level.

However you only have to spend a little time looking at the Financial History http://www.charity-commission.gov.u...steredCharityNumber=209603&SubsidiaryNumber=0

and the last 5 years accounts to question whether there is a case for the Trustees to undertake to spend a little less on Fundraising and Marketing and therefore slow down the revenue stream a little while continuing to deliver the quality service they provide.
 
islandsailor said:
Interesting reading.

I have to say that I am not against paying senior managers and the CEO of the RNLI the "market rate" and I fully support the RNLI at a operational level.

However you only have to spend a little time looking at the Financial History http://www.charity-commission.gov.u...steredCharityNumber=209603&SubsidiaryNumber=0

and the last 5 years accounts to question whether there is a case for the Trustees to undertake to spend a little less on Fundraising and Marketing and therefore slow down the revenue stream a little while continuing to deliver the quality service they provide.
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If there were such a case (I haven't looked in detail) one course of action might be for the RNLI to consider financially assisting other similar organizations in the UK. (Sandown and Shanklin? Gaffirs? Freshwater? I'm sure there are countless others.)
 
john_morris_uk said:
Regarding the pay of the RNLI, the chief exec is my old boss - ex Commanding Officer of Frigates and before that Nuclear Submarines. (He's also a yachtsman and has an Island Packet and wrote a very good book on IRPCS for yotties.) You don't recruit people of his calibre with £20k salaries.
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So his salary is just a little top up to his generous navy pension then?

In the current climate charities will alienate a lot of their donors if they are seen to be paying generously. A lot of the salaries offered for comparison are quangos and public sector which are also open to justification.
 
toad_oftoadhall said:
... I've merely expressed doubts about the apparent claims that there are no alternatives to bespoke design.
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Sorry to harp on about this, but, the only example of an alternative given so far, was itself a bespoke design. I think it a reasonable assumption that the lifeboats used by other countries are, in the main, also bespoke designs. The RNLI has been going longer than most (all?) other such institutions and has always had a policy of innovation and improvement, to provide the best that current technology can offer. Why would they want to look elsewhere?

What I was really taking issue with was the implication that RNLI could save money by buying "off the shelf" designs (your words, I think). What I was trying to say, in a tongue in cheek way, was that you cannot turn up at your local dealer and say "I'd like to look at your off-shore lifeboats please". By their very nature, they will always be a bespoke design (although there is an outside possibility that someone might be able to offer a standard hull).
 
All this is well and good but Mr. Cameron’s new Big Society will put pay too all the high salaries, we will have locals living on the coast taking over the lifeboats and using them for pleasure cruises around the pier head, mackerel fishing and sundowners and all for a small donation to the Conservative Party and city bankers.
 
fireball said:
I would think that because in any organisation (charity or not) there are certain roles that require a lot of time, effort, experience etc which will equate to a full time job (and then some!). It is then entirely reasonable to fill those roles with paid staff.
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I would like to challenge that. If I am qualified for one of those jobs and offer to be paid 50% could I challenge their position?
 
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