awol
Well-Known Member
Don't you have jetties down south? Where do the fishing boats unload?
Response from Chloe Smith (Red Diesel)
- Thread starter Elemental
- Start date
Don't you have jetties down south? Where do the fishing boats unload?
viago
Well-Known Member
scotland and santander
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prv
Well-Known Member
Not many fishing boats in the Solent. There's a few tiny one-man day boats up the river from me which could probably unload into an estate car; there isn't a fish quay as far as I know. There is a pontoon intended for fishing boats at Warsash I believe. Don't know of any anywhere else.
All jetties, pontoons, piers, quays, etc etc etc are owned by someone whose aim is to extract money from anyone who goes near it.
I wouldn't choose to sail in the Solent, I just happen to live here
Pete
Aries
Well-Known Member
Not many fishing boats in the Solent. There's a few tiny one-man day boats up the river from me which could probably unload into an estate car; there isn't a fish quay as far as I know. There is a pontoon intended for fishing boats at Warsash I believe. Don't know of any anywhere else.
All jetties, pontoons, piers, quays, etc etc etc are owned by someone whose aim is to extract money from anyone who goes near it.
I wouldn't choose to sail in the Solent, I just happen to live here
Pete
Lymington Town Quay, Yarmouth Harbour, Portsmouth Camber. All small fishing boat landings. Weymouth Town Quay and Brixham have trawler quays.
PaulGooch
Well-Known Member
That's not correct. The problem is the use of marked fuel. If marinas sold unmarked gas oil at a lower rate of duty, how much do you think would end up in cars ? Besides, we are not allowed to charge more than one rate of duty for the same fuel, unmarked gas oil would be the same as tractor diesel so both would have to have the same level of duty.
Twister_Ken
Well-Known Member
But we do - hence the 60/40 fudge.
PaulGooch
Well-Known Member
That's true. Technically, i suppose we shouldn't be able to charge duty on Red as there is not duty on it for agricultural/plan/heating purposes. But then we can't use it for propulsion without the duty and even then we're not supposed to use it because it's marked.
Elemental
Well-Known Member
"Guess" being the operative ... Altogether too many postings on the red diesel topics that bandy unresearched figures around.
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Koeketiene
Well-Known Member
This is something I don't get.
If it's not to go somewhere, why would you even get a boat?
Surely, you can't keep going round the cans for ever and a day?
Probably just me.
viago
Well-Known Member
ive read this over a few times but it still sounds like gobbledygook to me.
yes, the marking of the fuel has become a problem in belgium but the issue the eu commission has is with duty.
using standard fuel settles the belgum question.
precious little would end up in cars under a well run registration scheme.
the government sells this fuel at varying rates of duty and will, it seems, continue to do so. it seems the government is hoping to assuage the commission under some sort of domestic arrangement clause. fat chance!
around here tractors run on red diesel. i think this is at a significantly lower rate of duty, as it is throughout europe, and even available to hobby farmers!!!
if you really want cheap diesel then get the chippy oil and refine.
i dont have an oil based heat source and so am unable to benefit much from the duty reduction yet still have to fill up with red. i do, however, have an alternator which charges my batteries. if i get an electric blowy heater will that count?
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PaulGooch
Well-Known Member
There are two main issues with our use of red diesel. The first was the matter of duty and the commision appeared to accept our 60/40 split as being OK.
The second issue is that of "marked" fuel. This is the current issue that Belgium is complaining about. Nothing whatsoever to do with duty.
No need to get a blowy heater. If you feel that you are using 40% of your fuel to run the engine for battery charging, claim the split. It isn't a heating allowance, it's for non-propulsion purposes.
viago
Well-Known Member
is that so? thanks for that.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
This is something I don't get.
If it's not to go somewhere, why would you even get a boat?
Surely, you can't keep going round the cans for ever and a day?
Probably just me.
People on the Inland Waterways in most cases own boats that are incapable of a sea passage (yes, I know about the narrowboat that circumnavigated the UK). They probably outnumber sea-going vessels, though that is as valuable as any statistic grabbed off a passing cloud.
People who sail in Scotland or the more northerly parts of the UK are more restricted in their options for foreign passage-making; and in any case, there are stacks of challenging and interesting destinations without ever leaving UK territorial waters. Don't equate "going foreign" with "passage making" - a passage to Northern Ireland from the Clyde is potentially much further than a cross-channel passage, and in terms of weather and tides, at least as challenging (I admit that you don't normally have to dodge big stuff - though there is a TSS and a high speed ferry).
So, realistically, this is a problem that affects south and east coast sailors. I am, of course, sympathetic and understand the problem - but why should many sailors who have no intention or capability of going to the EU pay higher duty? If I were thinking of going overseas, I'd be looking at the Faeroes, Iceland and Norway (none of which are EU countries), and I guess the same is true of many others who sail. The only other foreign destination of interest is Eire, and people seem to be saying that red diesel is not likely to be a problem there!
st599
Well-Known Member
Who said anything about higher duty. HMG can allow marinas to sell the white diesel with a 60/40 split. It's about supply of the white diesel.
AntarcticPilot
Well-Known Member
As I understand it, no they can't because EU regulations require reduced duty fuel to be marked in a very specific way.
Chris_Robb
Well-Known Member
It is also about the government of our country forcing us to be ILLEGAL on mainland Europe.
Chris_Robb
Well-Known Member
That is the absolute point here. Duty free diesel is designated throughout Europe by marking. This principle cannot be compromised, although the UK thinks it can! I don't know what the way forward is.
viago
Well-Known Member
oh, is that right? well they also require that none of that specifically marked stuff gets into our boats but one doesnt always have to comply.
i must say, i am pretty impressed with that letter which is surprisingly frank and comprehensive. well done to the government thus far.(i personally prefer the nigel farage approach but at least there seems to be some resistance)
Beadle
Well-Known Member
Perhaps if the Govt were to change to green dye instead of red the problem would go away.
I'm led to believe that green is acceptable in Euroland.
Beadle
Well-Known Member
The obvious solution is not to go there.
There isn't a real problem. There is a situation that has been deliberately created from a sense of malice. As you well know the red dye used in diesel is designed to be persistent. So any boat that has used red diesel will test +ve for red even after many tanks full of white.
Personally if I see any european yacht fill up with red diesel I will write to the commissioners and report it. Lets see how many non British boats get "dipped"
Bet it its not many
