Regarding Schengen visa...this is a tricky one to answer..

[RobbieW]

..."I'm still trying to find where this 90/180 days is coming from that odd people are saying ... the only reference I can find to this is within "
REGULATION (EU) 2018/1806 OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL of 14 November 2018...

The 90 in 180 seems to be the default access that citizens of non-EU countries, ie 3rd party countries in the jargon, can stay in Schengen without problems or some other agreement... Schengen Calculator - Calculate Your Legal Short-Stay in Europe. Whether your residency in Latvia confers broader access is in the detail of the agreements Latvia has with the EU. For those Brits with residency in eg. Portugal the current advice is that that residency confers no broader access to other Schengen states than 90 in 180.

 

[Graham376]

Have you actually looked at the site and read it ...
Its written specifically to detail Brits rights if you have or apply for residency in an EU state. It lists each state so you can see what each will give.
I have never seen any mention of 90 / 180 days anywhere.

I've had permanent residence for quite a while. After Brexit, it doesn't matter what our countries of residence may say, when travelling through other States, it's the Schengen rules which will apply. If you think you will be free to travel without time limits, I suspect you will be disappointed. Unless a deal is reached, we will be treated just the same as any other non-EU citizen.

 

[sailaboutvic]

@ refueler
(I am similar ... UK Passport .. Latvia Resident.

I was told that there should be no change except I cannot work outside of Latvia state in EU. Travel through etc is fine because I have the Latvian residence which is a) EU and b) Schengen.

I will be checking that later again once things settle .... as I like to drive to / from UK instead of flying and its limitations.)

So basically the passport office in Latvia told you there should be no change , that's what you wrote .

There no change while the trans period but more likely there will after that ,
In what form no one knows , not even the Latvia passport office otherwise they would had said .
You me or anyone else don't need resident in another EU country to be able to move freely until the end of this year, so your document give us no new info.

It seen to me and others you was suggestion that resident in another EU state would give you free moment after 2021
If you meant that unintentionally maybe.
This is why I ask you to point out where it said this ,
so not only not to confuse other but also yourself, if you think it may .
Call us "Barrack-Room Lawyers" don't help as many have been working hard to find way Round this whole mess and posting document that are mean less after the end of this year don't help any of us .

 

[Seven Spades]

I think that the question you are all struggling with is, what is the definition of an EU citizen. EU citizens have free movement so does residency mean you are an EU citizen or is it strictly limited to you passport?

 

[Refueler]

All I've read from various here are suppositions and maybe's ... at least I bothered to link to sites that explain interim and possible later effects.

I'd rather believe those docs than barrack room stuff.

But as I said and others - its still early days and a lot of water will pass under the bridge before its finalised.

 

[Refueler]

I think that the question you are all struggling with is, what is the definition of an EU citizen. EU citizens have free movement so does residency mean you are an EU citizen or is it strictly limited to you passport?

Not being funny - but I am not struggling with it at all .... I've had permanent residency here before they joined EU and continued through and still valid ... I've spoken with the authorities here and even their website basically tells me I shall be fine ...

It seems to be others struggling with it ...

 

[Refueler]

Whether your residency in Latvia confers broader access is in the detail of the agreements Latvia has with the EU.

Sorry but this shows you do not read what I post ...

I made it clear - the access depends on agreement between state granting residence and the state or states you wish to move to .... not EU as a whole.

I have resided in Latvia for more than five years. How can I obtain EU long-term residence status?

After Brexit date, your will keep your rights indefinitely if you will change your status by applying for a temporary or permanent residence permit until 31/12/2020 , but you can already apply in parallel for an EU long-term residence permit. This permit will grant you a permanent status, and allow you to enjoy the same treatment as nationals regarding access to employment, education, and core social benefits. This will also allow you, under certain conditions, to acquire the right to reside in another EU Member State. For more information on how to apply for an EU long-term residence permit, please visit this website www.pmlp.gov.lv

 

[Graham376]

I think that the question you are all struggling with is, what is the definition of an EU citizen. EU citizens have free movement so does residency mean you are an EU citizen or is it strictly limited to you passport?

I don't think most of us are struggling, residence is not citizenship, it's just a right to reside in that country and given no citizen benefits.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I don't think most of us are struggling, residence is not citizenship, it's just a right to reside in that country and given no citizen benefits.

Graham , I give up if I was you and let people believe what they want ,
As for the document we are being ask to read , there nothing in it most of us didn't know ,
We can carry on doing what we been doing till the end of the year ,
Not sure what the point bein made. I just wish people wouldn't confuse issues more then it is by even for a second that residence mean free moment , that until the EU say so .
It doesn't help anyone .

 

[nortada]

Graham , I give up if I was you and let people believe what they want ,
As for the document we are being ask to read , there nothing in it most of us didn't know ,
We can carry on doing what we been doing till the end of the year ,
Not sure what the point bein made. I just wish people wouldn't confuse issues more then it is by even for a second that residence mean free moment , that until the EU say so .
It doesn't help anyone .

Agree, this whole subject has been done to death so can’t see why it keeps being resurrected

 

[Graham376]

Graham , I give up if I was you and let people believe what they want ,

I think you're right and time will tell what will happen.

 

[Artic Warrior]

Have you actually looked at the site and read it ...

Its written specifically to detail Brits rights if you have or apply for residency in an EU state. It lists each state so you can see what each will give.

I have never seen any mention of 90 / 180 days anywhere.

It's been on the UK gov site for the last 18 months saying we will have to abide to a Schengen style visa. 90 days in every 180

 

[Refueler]

It's been on the UK gov site for the last 18 months saying we will have to abide to a Schengen style visa. 90 days in every 180

I don't doubt that at all ... but why would I look at a UK site when I have Residency in an EU state .. I am more interested in what the EU Residency gives than what I know already my UK passport gives....

 

[Refueler]

People have to get this ridiculous FREE MOVEMENT term out of mind .. its been one of the mis-represented and misused terms in all the EU palaver.

Stop mixing FREE MOVEMENT (which conjures up all sorts of crap) with free to travel ....

 

[Ningaloo]

Agree, this whole subject has been done to death so can’t see why it keeps being resurrected

Probably because there are many people like me currently making plans for this summer and the winter of 2020/21 and we need to know how the loss of rights to travel in Schengen block will affect us. Do I stick to my original plans and spend is summer in Scotland or return to EU where I have been since 2004? Because of the VAT implications of overwintering in the UK I probably need to overwinter in EU (as I intend to sped the next 10 summers crusing in Atlantic Europe and Med). But having done so, will I then be restricted to a sailing season of 3 months rather than my preferred 5? And as my boat is my UK/European home, what do I do once my 90 days are up?
This also affects all my crew planning for the year as I needs to give them an indication of where I may be sailing.

It really does look like Brexit will force me to leave the UK permanently. At least the sun always shines in WA!

 

[Graham376]

Probably because there are many people like me currently making plans for this summer and the winter of 2020/21 and we need to know how the loss of rights to travel in Schengen block will affect us.

No-one knows what the outcome of any negotiations will be, all we can do is act on the info we have at the moment. Simple answer for this year is to apply for residence in your EU country of choice which will allow you to spend as much time there as you want and to visit other Schengen countries for 90/180 and make sure the boat is in EU on 31/12/2020. As long as the boat remains in your ownership, there are no VAT implications if sailing it back to UK.

 

[nortada]

Probably because there are many people like me currently making plans for this summer and the winter of 2020/21 and we need to know how the loss of rights to travel in Schengen block will affect us. Do I stick to my original plans and spend is summer in Scotland or return to EU where I have been since 2004? Because of the VAT implications of overwintering in the UK I probably need to overwinter in EU (as I intend to sped the next 10 summers cruising in Atlantic Europe and Med). But having done so, will I then be restricted to a sailing season of 3 months rather than my preferred 5? And as my boat is my UK/European home, what do I do once my 90 days are up?
This also affects all my crew planning for the year as I needs to give them an indication of where I may be sailing.

It really does look like Brexit will force me to leave the UK permanently. At least the sun always shines in WA!

Typically, this post adds nothing to what has been covered before in this and allied threads.

Trouble is folk will insist on introducing confusion where no confusion previously existed.

Bottom line.

It is mostly guesswork so we will all have to see what materializes. Only time will tell.

 

[nortada]

No-one knows what the outcome of any negotiations will be, all we can do is act on the info we have at the moment. Simple answer for this year is to apply for residence in your EU country of choice which will allow you to spend as much time there as you want and to visit other Schengen countries for 90/180 and make sure the boat is in EU on 31/12/2020. As long as the boat remains in your ownership, there are no VAT implications if sailing it back to UK.

Thanks Graham.?

All encapsulated in a nutshell. ✔

 

[Star-Lord]

And as my boat is my UK/European home, what do I do once my 90 days are up?

My exact same dilemma. Not everyone wishes to become resident in Spain or wherever because for some people the cruising lifestyle is the freedom to go anywhere whenever, at the drop of a hat, and not be shackled to one spot. So my solution, for the next year or two, will be to head east.

3 months in Greece and 2 months in Turkey would be your easiest choice perhaps? Or vice versa.

There are talks - on other threads - that maybe the CA is having talks with Greece about a 6 months visa for boaters who want to stay in Greece all summer (without having to apply for residency). Time will tell.

This year I am headed to Greece. I think this will be good positioning for 2021 to move North to Albania, Montenegro and Croatia or South to Turkey, Cyprus and Israel.

Goodbye to Western Europe and all that.

 

[sailaboutvic]

My exact same dilemma. Not everyone wishes to become resident in Spain or wherever because for some people the cruising lifestyle is the freedom to go anywhere whenever, at the drop of a hat, and not be shackled to one spot. So my solution, for the next year or two, will be to head east.

3 months in Greece and 2 months in Turkey would be your easiest choice perhaps? Or vice versa.

There are talks - on other threads - that maybe the CA is having talks with Greece about a 6 months visa for boaters who want to stay in Greece all summer (without having to apply for residency). Time will tell.

This year I am headed to Greece. I think this will be good positioning for 2021 to move North to Albania, Montenegro and Croatia or South to Turkey, Cyprus and Israel.

Goodbye to Western Europe and all that.

Here where the Crunch of the matter lies when it comes to us brits .
There not many of us that actually cruisers around .
You find a small among around Portugal, Spain and Turkey the bulk of British sailors are around Greece , so for then getting registered in tho countries is a way forwards for the small group of British cruisers left in the Med who want to have the freedom to move around we going to have to find a way around it ,
I still hopefully this will happen although it may mean bending the rules slightly.