GTom
Well-Known Member
That has been the case until now. But the EU ruling says otherwise, no red dye in the engine tank at all, if I understood correctly.
Red Diesel - UK Government loses.
- Thread starter Seven Spades
- Start date
That has been the case until now. But the EU ruling says otherwise, no red dye in the engine tank at all, if I understood correctly.
NormanS
Well-Known Member
We don't know when, if ever, the EU ruling will be implemented.
GTom
Well-Known Member
You are right, replace "now" with "20xx". The UK might be O.K. for quite a few years to come, question is if other countries change their policies on visiting red ensign boats.
PhillM
Well-Known Member
Would flying a blue or white ensign make a difference, do you think?
chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
The EU measure will have been voted on by all member states including ours, we had X number of years granted to us to assist in the changeover as we have the longest coastline of a member state in the EU with some fueling points in small remote locations. Our government has had years to sort this out, it has chosen to park its head up its chuff, hence the court case
GTom
Well-Known Member
Those would be difficult to legally fly on a private pleasure craft...
https://www.ybw.com/news-from-yachting-boating-world/uk-sailor-fined-for-red-diesel-in-belgium-55746
savageseadog
Well-Known Member
I have the ideal solution. Marinas should sell white diesel at the same duty rate as red diesel, only for use in boats of course.
maby
Well-Known Member
chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
:encouragement: Now just to convince the marinas and harbours.....
maby
Well-Known Member
I think you would also have to work on HMRC and the EU Commission first. The current dispute is about the misselling of marked fuel - but selling unmarked fuel at zero duty would also be breaking rules. I think that the only solution that would be acceptable to the tax men and did not require two different supplies of fuel at the pumps would be to sell unmarked fuel at full duty to all takers and then process refunds for those that are eligible for reduced or zero duty. But I can't see HMRC being very enthusiastic about that - it would imply extra work for them.
Tomahawk
Well-Known Member
What part of "the EU measure" takes it away from being something that was forced upon the UK by an authority over and above our parliament?
Bru
Well-Known Member
The solution is simple. Where there is a demand for both full duty unmarked diesel and rebated marked diesel install a second bloody tank!
A bunded 2500l tank with pump and meter costs from £1600 to £2000
Installations with hose extensions will add to the cost, of course, but even so the cost is a long long way from being prohibitive.
The marine industry has had 20 years to get its act together on this and has done virtually nothing (because the government allowed them to get away with doing nothing)
A bunded 2500l tank with pump and meter costs from £1600 to £2000
Installations with hose extensions will add to the cost, of course, but even so the cost is a long long way from being prohibitive.
The marine industry has had 20 years to get its act together on this and has done virtually nothing (because the government allowed them to get away with doing nothing)
Champagne Murphy
Well-Known Member
I had a conversation with a marina yesterday (Orwell). They averred that Fame FREE white is not available. Ie it cannot be bought. Presumably, at least until the law changes anyway, it will remain elusive.
maby
Well-Known Member
The government only allowed them to get away with doing nothing because the RYA (and others) bullied the government into it. It would have been far easier for the government to simply enact the required changes to the law. There would have been no loss in revenue - in fact there would have been a small increase. There would have been virtually no loss of votes - the number of leisure sailors in the country is tiny in electoral terms. I could never understand why they were so willing to do what the RYA told them.
Bru
Well-Known Member
Well they are wrong
What they probably really meant was that their local suppliers don't / won't supply it
There is, apart from the costs etc of stocking an additional fuel type, a further disincentive to doing so in that the percentage of FAME they are required to add to the diesel they sell is calculated on total sales, regardless of type or duty
So if they don't put FAME in diesel sold for marine use, they have to put more FAME in the rest of the diesel they sell
So don't believe for a minute that your gas oil / red diesel is FAME free. Unless it's clearly being sold as such it almost certainly isn't.
GTom
Well-Known Member
chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
It requires a unanimous descision..... All states agreeing, if we dont like a measure we object, have it changed or vote no, one dissenter = measure not put into force
Champagne Murphy
Well-Known Member
I sent an email yesterday to the Harbour Master at Ramsgate. Here is his reply, self explanatory really.
Good morning Karl
Thank you for your enquiry.
We presently serve three fuels for leisure vessels at Ramsgate from our own fuel barge; these are FAME free red marine gas oil, white diesel (not FAME free) and unleaded petrol.
We're hoping that in line with the recent ruling, the industry will soon be in a position to be able to provide FAME free white diesel.
Kind regards
Robert Brown.
Harbour Master & Marine Operations Manager
Good morning Karl
Thank you for your enquiry.
We presently serve three fuels for leisure vessels at Ramsgate from our own fuel barge; these are FAME free red marine gas oil, white diesel (not FAME free) and unleaded petrol.
We're hoping that in line with the recent ruling, the industry will soon be in a position to be able to provide FAME free white diesel.
Kind regards
Robert Brown.
Harbour Master & Marine Operations Manager
chrishscorp
Well-Known Member
:encouragement:
dunedin
Well-Known Member
How come nobody else in Europe seems to have an issue in supplying white diesel to yachts. Never had an issue getting diesel anywhere I have been in France, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Germany etc (including FAME free white in many places). So how come we think this is such a soooooo tricky problem in the U.K.
And haven’t seen huge numbers of fishing boats in Lake Solent marinas - nor frankly in most marinas round the U.K., rather the majority of commercial boats tend to be increasing concentrated in a few commercial ports. Plus often the commercial boat pumps have hoses too big for yachts, so have separate pumps anyway.