raggies

[hlb]

Re: Time to quote the actual rules verbatum

Can tell you what the Defence police boat said to me when going Up the river at ten knots (speed Limit.) When this bloody big ship sneeked up behind me at 14 knots!!! If it helps /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

 

[landaftaf]

Re: Time to quote the actual rules verbatum

a nice seamanship term is not to 'embaress' the other vessel ..... wots the dicky say about that robust nautical term ?

 

[Micky]

Re: Time to quote the actual rules verbatum

I think all this is quite easy to understand.

We have Gary boy drivers in cars, and Gary boy sailors in boats.

Neither can read digits to know their speed or know their left and right, and many can't tell the difference between Red and Green.

I have a motor sailer so it depends on my mood what i use, I am also a keen sea angler and get pi55ded off with both Mobos and raggies. Mobos = wash, Raggies tacking too close, but HEY thats life, or at least that's the way i can always remember it since i have been playing with boats, which is on/off some 40 years.

 

[landaftaf]

Re: Rule 9b

in theory, if a mobo is constrained by her draught but is not showing 3 red lights etc at night ... or a cylinder etc in daylight , she is not recognisably constrained by her draught, I cant remember seeing a mobo displaying these signals anywhere ........ have you ?

 

[hlb]

Re: Rule 9b

But then I've never seen a fire ball with a chart, almanac, horn, radio or Col reg book!!!

 

[tcm]

Re: Rule 9b

constrained by safety, not draft

 

[landaftaf]

Re: Rule 9b

ahm afraid I dont know the constrained by safety bit ....... I was talking about rule 9b and 28 - have I missed something ?

 

[fireball]

Re: Rule 9b

Yes - it would appear that dinghy sailors should be able to mind read and know that the powered vessel is constrained by safety, even if it isn't obvious in terms of length & breadth...

 

[landaftaf]

Re: Rule 9b

could easily be mistaken as the guiness pennant I suppose, but still dont understand the safety rule, know the 'navigate in the channel/constrianed by draught ............ is it a local byelaw down you way ?

 

[l'escargot]

Re: Rule 9b

[ QUOTE ]
But then I've never seen a fire ball with a chart, almanac, horn, radio or Col reg book!!!

[/ QUOTE ]

Where does it say a dinghy has to carry them?

 

[fireball]

Re: Rule 9b

Its 9b again ... not a local by-law ...
(b) A vessel of less than 20 meters in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway.

 

[tcm]

Re: Rule 9d (not b) !

You're getting as boring as me now! Note - this needn't ever end...until you go sailing for a few days and the thread slips away.

We haven't even stated on 9d - crossing a narrow channel or fairway. argh!....

 

[fireball]

Re: Rule 9d (not b) !

Too many variable definitions ... perhaps we should just all go boating!

 

[tcm]

Re: Rule 9b

yeah - you've assumed "constrained" is alweays "by draft" cos you learnt the lights by rote. Don't worry - loads of others did the same about 100 posts ago!

 

[hlb]

Re: Rule 9b

It dont. But without some sort of knowledge about the depths, or the regulations and maybe a tape measure to assertain 20 metres or more....erg I'm about to side with fireboloxs!!!! ArrGGgggg /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[fireball]

Re: Rule 9b

Don't worry - fireballs usually know the depth - they measure the amount of mud they have to wash off their sails after an inversion /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

 

[Ships_Cat]

Re: Rule 9b

One should assume that any vessel proceeding up a channel is doing so for safe navigation reasons. A good start I would have thought, so if oneself is under 20m (we are so ourselves) then one must not impede them.

If you know that it is safe for you to stray out of the channel then you can make that decision only for yourself, you cannot make it for any other vessel. If you can decide that it is safe for you to navigate outside of the channel then you have to ask yourself why it is that you are navigating up the channel in the first place - it is not for safety and therefore in every case you must not impede any other vessel proceeding up the channel unless you are over 20m or you have specific outside advice that the other vessel is not there for safe navigation reasons.

It seems to me that those who are most upset about the safe bit are those with the smallest boats (driven by envy, I wonder), even dinghies and bilge keelers, and for whom it is the least likely for a need to proceed up a channel for safe navigation reasons. In one case the poster claiming that anyone, stranger or not, proceeding up a channel should have an exact knowledge of the waters outside of the channel in case they have to leave the channel to avoid some bilge keeler or whatever. That claim is obviously very silly as such knowledge requires exact knowledge of the tidal height at that moment and exact and continuous plotting of ones position as one proceeds up the channel - vessels quite rightly proceed up maintained channels so that they do not have to maintain that exact knowledge.

Those same small vessels are almost always ones of short range so they only frequent local waters and so may have an intimate knowledge of depths outside of channels, other traffic/movements, etc - that does not mean that they should expect the same of all other vessels they come across. It is good practise when entering a strange port to always proceed up the marked channels if any doubts whatsoever about the unmarked and unmaintained waters outside of those and one does that for safety. You are proceeding up the channel for safety reasons and no vessel or sailing vessel under 20m should impede you from doing so. No other vessel under 20m should decide that you are only in the channel for mundane reasons and stand on to you.

I would have thought that all that was just common sense and good behaviour to ones fellows, but apparently some do not /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif. It is of such little consequence to a small vessel not to stand on to other (usually larger) vessels in a channel that I have to wonder what it is that drives their frequent whinging.

John

 

[l'escargot]

Re: Rule 9b

[ QUOTE ]
One should assume that any vessel proceeding up a channel is doing so for safe navigation reasons....

[/ QUOTE ]

Shouldn't make assumptions for other vessels John - been on the catnip again? /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[Ships_Cat]

Re: Rule 9b

I think it is very clear that my claim was that one should not make assumptions that they are NOT proceeding for safety of navigation reasons. Which, of course, means that one must assume that they are proceeding for those reasons.

Didn't think that the mental gymnastics in understanding that were particularly difficult /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif.

John

 

[hlb]

Re: Rule 9b

But would this not be true for any vessel coming from sea. I invariable follow the channel as working out new tide hights whilst piloting and looking at the scenery. I have little time or inclination for anything else!