Radar – is it worth it on a 40 year old 30 footer?

[jonjo8]

I started sailing round the CI over 40 years ago without any significant electronic aids - that is when I wasn't too busy with RORC races, ton cups, Coaching and other things.

Hang on, you started this thread seeking elementary advice on the need for a radar, next you posted some misleading doubts about the utility of AIS for your proposed ventures and now you present yourself as a yachting Bear Grylls of the English Channel.

Your 2018 season voyaging plans sound sensible and your now excellently fitted yacht is well up to the task without radar. All these anxieties about the perfect equipment mix will fade away as soon as you get out there and strut your stuff beyond Portland Bill. If however lack of radar keeps you in port then fit the extra gadget and cast off. This debate is similar to the bow thruster debate, if the lack of a bow thruster keeps you in port on an otherwise good singlehanded sailing day, then ignore the internet experts, fit one and get out there.

 

[Babylon]

We each have different ways of managing our sailing, and different boats lend themselves to different approaches, so there is little point in trying to lay down the law for operating procedures.

That's so true.

Although I'm usually singlehanded, I'm always never on the tiller (except when in heavy close-quarters traffic, on a narrow river, mooring or berthing); on passage the autohelm or windvane do all the steering. As my boat is small, I can lean into the companionway from the cockpit and see both chart-plotter and radar screens mounted above the chart-table, and its but a brief bounce down below to adjust the knobs then back up again. Similarly, I just have to lean back from my 'huddle-point' under the sprayhood to tweak the autohelm or windvane.

I've long since stopped hankering after a bigger, faster boat!

 

[Boathook]

Age and size of boat has little to do with radar. It's whether you want it fitted on board. I have the small basic Furuno 1623 and it does a good job and is visible from the helm.

 

[Heckler]

I have spent a small fortune and many man weeks upgrading my Achilles 9M and the previous owner did the same. Now apart from the hull & deck, mast and boom and the engine (1997 and in good nick) everything of importance is less than c 2 years old. I have a new plotter, AIS Receiver etc.

The only thing left is Radar. The question is, is it worth c £3k? For various reasons, including power requirements, I think it has to be broadband on a pole rather than a cheaper traditional pulse radar up the mast, and most of the cost would be lost when I finally give up sailing when the body will not cope any more in 5 – 10 years time.

I don't feel the need for radar to help with Navigation having a pencil, compass, echo sounder, charts etc. plus 3 independent marine GPS systems (Plotter, iPad & PC) plus the phone when I am away from base for any length of time.

Most sailing is in and around the Solent with hopefully 3 to 5 weeks a year, perhaps a bit more, cruising in the channel and perhaps up to the Scottish Isles and up the east coast to visit old haunts at some time, all single handed. I don’t intend to sleep when at sea but could get caught out.

When outside of the Solent, AIS should give warning of merchant shipping - I am not impressed with AIS in the Solent as everything is delayed too long and there is at least one large sightseeing boat that should have a cat A AIS that on 2 occasions in the last couple of months has had nothing showing when she has past me close by going into Portsmouth.

My worry is hitting a buoy, small fishing boat or similar. Yes I know you should keep a look out but s&&t happens and I have had one cat A airprox (the worst) @ c 50 foot spacing @100 knts, driving a light aircraft and I could have done nothing about it without technology in both aircraft - the powered glider came from below me and I could not have seen it without going almost inverted, god knows where he was looking! So I am rather sensitive to the issue!

So how good is modern radar for collision avoidance vs small targets? Discuss please.

Both my boats came with radar fitted from new by previous owners. Its handy on a day to day basis for checking distances but not indispensable. However on a couple of occasions it has been a godsend, Late at night creeping in to Lagos, combining with the chart plotter it was superb. It saved another night at sea. Then a few months ago coming in to Gib the fog came down as we approached the anchorage to the east, again late at night, knackered after 36 hrs non stop. Radar on, combined with AIS , unbeatable! So not a necessity but when you need it, superb!
Stu

 

[JohnDL]

Hang on, you started this thread seeking elementary advice on the need for a radar, next you posted some misleading doubts about the utility of AIS for your proposed ventures and now you present yourself as a yachting Bear Grylls of the English Channel.

Your 2018 season voyaging plans sound sensible and your now excellently fitted yacht is well up to the task without radar. All these anxieties about the perfect equipment mix will fade away as soon as you get out there and strut your stuff beyond Portland Bill. If however lack of radar keeps you in port then fit the extra gadget and cast off. This debate is similar to the bow thruster debate, if the lack of a bow thruster keeps you in port on an otherwise good singlehanded sailing day, then ignore the internet experts, fit one and get out there.

As previously stated I have no experience of modern marine radar (having been off flying rather than sailing for some years) it is not therefore unreasonable to ask for “elementary advice” on the subject. And the result will have no material affect on my sailing plans just on how much it costs.

With regards to AIS, that is what I have found coming to it for the first time and if no one else has had similar problems in very congested waters (which I had been warned by someone who should know was a looming issue) then I will need to check out the cable run to the aerial as the only likely problem other than a duff ais unit (the radio appears to work well which would imply the aerial is ok). I have written more than once, including in the original post, that my ais works fine when things are less busy.

I did not bring up, in any detail, my previous experience until someone made rathe disparaging comments.

 

[lw395]

I don't both with AIS in crowded waters, at least not when the crowding is mostly yachts.
But I like it for mid channel.

 

[JohnDL]

I don't both with AIS in crowded waters, at least not when the crowding is mostly yachts.
But I like it for mid channel.

I did notice in the hour or so I spent doing detailed checking (waiting for the tide on the hamble) that the class A transmissions were all timely, but the sample was rather small - almost all ferries of one sort or another.