Propeller fell off after 1 hour, what to do?

volvopaul said:
Hi Neil, firstly id say unless the engineer had trouble getting the props off or he didnt have the correct puller or tools if a sterndrive boat hes charged you way over the odds.

If its a shaft drive boat and your prop has just fallen off then its obvious it was not fitted correctly as the nut must have wound its way off the thread, I dont like locktabs at all , a castle nut and split pin is much safer. Aside that there are thefts around the coastal marinas, ive had 2 emails from Hant police today as im signed up to project kraken, in fact a jet ski was stolen on 100yards from my boat this past Saturday from RK marines yard.

Maybe in your engineers defence someone had attempted to steal your prop or props and had the nut undone but could not pull the prop, yes it happens, infact the boat ive serviced today at Port Solent has had its battery master switch keys stolen over the weekend, ive also heard about drive anodes being stolen after engineers like myself have fitted them, so now I always take photos after ive fitted them with the boat name clearly in the pic, as after ive fitted them its not my responsibility for any further loss in my opinion.

However I would not state his email as law, I d invite the engineer to be at the time of lift and have every chance to examine the shafts before anyone else can comment, thats what I would insist on. Im there tomorrow for an 08.30 launch.
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I've often wondered why boat owners leave the props on when on the hard, it's like one big advert - take me. I take mine off as soon as it is out of the water and put back on just before relaunch along with the anodes.
 
Only just seen this. Sheesh

As others have said it seems to me your contract is with the main fixer not the prop guy. Your actions may be destroying your chance of arguing that though?. I would buy the new prop and chase them not him for reimbursement

When you lift out, it would be nice to see pics of the shaft taper, to see if any scoring or other evidence to shed light on this

Yes the original will have been Teignbridge/Clements (=Brunswick). FL have bought those for at least 10 years. You should have with the ships papers the certificates for the originals, on flimsy pink paper iirc, to make it easy to match them. Will be over £1k for sure, maybe 2.

Good luck with getting back on the water soon
 
Scubadoo said:
I've often wondered why boat owners leave the props on when on the hard, it's like one big advert - take me. I take mine off as soon as it is out of the water and put back on just before relaunch along with the anodes.
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You're not alone. It's even more alluring to the magpies if your props are stainless.
 
Right it just got more fun.

Ordered a replacment (or will be tomorrow) for 1683 + vat with 2 weeks to make time, so i can live with that.

The fun bit is I just got a call from someone random telling me a certain prop guy is a really dilligent young man and to only deal through his solicitor now.

Followed by a story about how gypsys were definitly there trying to remove my props (at a time i was onboard working i might add), and thats why they fell off.
And then told that i should have noticed the missing nuts on the prop shaft when it was launched.... He was shocked when i pointed out i was at the launch and have a picture of the shafts with nutts attatched.

He couldn't explain when he finally listened to me why the people trying to steal my props had put the nuts back on nice and tight for me but not taken the props.

Main dealer says its not his problem as he told me to pay direct, however this came about a few weeks after we agreed for him to go ahead and have his guy do the props so i would think theres no real case there.

Either way, I will fix it myself now and then have a final bill of all the costs to proceed with. I can't say how or who that will go of course as I will have to leave that to my legal side.


Will update the thread once im done! And yes will get pics of it coming out of the shafts for all you detectives ;)

Thank you to all for the helpful replies and information!!!
 
nrbx said:
Right it just got more fun.

Ordered a replacment (or will be tomorrow) for 1683 + vat with 2 weeks to make time, so i can live with that.

The fun bit is I just got a call from someone random telling me a certain prop guy is a really dilligent young man and to only deal through his solicitor now.

Followed by a story about how gypsys were definitly there trying to remove my props (at a time i was onboard working i might add), and thats why they fell off.
And then told that i should have noticed the missing nuts on the prop shaft when it was launched.... He was shocked when i pointed out i was at the launch and have a picture of the shafts with nutts attatched.

He couldn't explain when he finally listened to me why the people trying to steal my props had put the nuts back on nice and tight for me but not taken the props.

Main dealer says its not his problem as he told me to pay direct, however this came about a few weeks after we agreed for him to go ahead and have his guy do the props so i would think theres no real case there.

Either way, I will fix it myself now and then have a final bill of all the costs to proceed with. I can't say how or who that will go of course as I will have to leave that to my legal side.


Will update the thread once im done! And yes will get pics of it coming out of the shafts for all you detectives ;)

Thank you to all for the helpful replies and information!!!
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Well, it's a craaap situation but well done for attacking it so positively. Fingers crossed for the new prop being delivered on time to get you back on the water asap. And good luck for an equitable resolution with your suppliers.

Cheers
Jimmy
 
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When you refit the prop is there any reason not to use a castlelated nut along with a split pin? Imho there's no way that should ever come off. And do the same with the remaining prop.

And just one more thought, if diving to search for the missing prop is not possible then I would certainly be making contact with someone to dredge the area it went missing. A few sweeps would take no time at all. Pleased that Teignbridge seem to have come up trumps for you. Hope it all works out.
 
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nrbx said:
Either way, I will fix it myself now and then have a final bill of all the costs to proceed with. I can't say how or who that will go of course
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I agree with this approach. It would be a greater annoyance to stop doing what you want (i.e. using the boat) just to build a case which you may or may not win and even if you do, you've still got to enforce against someone who might or might not have any assets. But before the new prop goes on I would get as much evidence of what the prop fell off as you can.
 
DAKA said:
Searush is right.

You dont need proof in a small claims court, the judge will listen and make his assessment.
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Whatever gave you that idea? The law - and the evidence requirements are exactly the same. It is unclear who the contract was with, what it was for and there seems so far very little proven evidence of negligence.

The reason why small claims can be more successful is that the defendant fails to put up a good defence so obviously the magistrate is more likely to find in favour of the claimant.

The major advantage of using this route is the low cost and relative lack of formality - but don't think it is carte blanche for unsubstantiated claims. When making your claim you have to demonstrate that you have use every available means of resolving the issue - negotiation, arbitration or whatever else is appropriate.
 
Tranona said:
Whatever gave you that idea? The law - and the evidence requirements are exactly the same. It is unclear who the contract was with, what it was for and there seems so far very little proven evidence of negligence.

The reason why small claims can be more successful is that the defendant fails to put up a good defence so obviously the magistrate is more likely to find in favour of the claimant.

The major advantage of using this route is the low cost and relative lack of formality - but don't think it is carte blanche for unsubstantiated claims. When making your claim you have to demonstrate that you have use every available means of resolving the issue - negotiation, arbitration or whatever else is appropriate.
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I am happy to agree with your statement and also happy to stand by my post, it wasnt my intention to suggest unsubstantiated claims would be paid.

I accept perhaps I could have explained in more detail but this is a forum which should be used in order to get pointed in the right general direction , I wouldnt expect anyone to accept my advice without further research.

There is a common misconception that civil claims demand the same proof beyond reasonable doubt as criminal courts.
I was merely attempting to convey in civil courts the magistrate will view the evidence and make a judgement on most likely probability.
The mechanic appears to be taking the argument of 'you cant prove it', which isnt a defence in civil court only criminal court (as I understand it).

In my opinion once small claims court summons is issued it will not be defended.

I doubt the mechanic has service indemnity cover and will most likely have to pay himself, so may surprise by turning up to defend himself.
 
Although "proof" is different in civil actions you still need evidence. In this case the evidence is circumstantial, but of course that may change when the boat is hauled. The biggest problem is likely to be proving who the contract was with.

The fact that the fitter has stopped responding suggests that a negotiated settlement is not possible so the claimant has to show that he has done everything to resolve the issue. Filing the action should wake him up that he needs to do something and if he denies and there is not clear evidence he is both liable and negligent there is no guarantee that the claimant will win.
 
nrbx said:
Hi All,

I have agreed a urgent 2 week option from Teignbridge propellors, just going to give the prop fitter a chance to acctually get back to me before i proceed with that.

They made the current ones on the boat apparantly so there is a good chance the new one will match well!

I've offered to go halves on the lifting fee with the guy if he pulls his head out of the sand and orders this prop, nut and washer. Although there is no chance he is fitting it!

So far his phone remains firmly off!
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I bought some new props from Teignbridge at the end of last year (still got to fit them and get my boat back in the water yet) but they amazed me at how quickly they made them and shipped them to me. And to look at them they are a work of art and should really be on my mantelpiece (not as large as your props mind)
Nick Heath
 
I was servicing a boat 2 up from yours today, she does look well after her refurb, its a real shame this has happened, just a thought have you tried Fairline Essex as they had many props for sale a time ago, even if its and inch out on the pitch it could be altered quicker than making a new one.
 
nrbx said:
Hi Rafiki,

Unfortunatly not, I believe IF i can get a refurb which is unlikely as they are quite rare it will be 700-900 GBP, a new one could be 2000 - 3000 GBP.

Coupled to this i then need to get the other one off to check and to send away to be balanced with the new one before installing them both back on.

Throw in a lift and if we have to go new it could be reacing 4k to resolve this.

The hardest bit seems to be working out what propeller I am meant to have on there even at present to get a price!!
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The prop you need is the same dimensions as the one that you have not lost but the other hand
Probably made by Clements or Teignbridge possibly £1,600 obviously Fairline will tell you who manufactured it
 
Tranona said:
there is no guarantee that the claimant will win.
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No guarantee but the stake is £100, odds are 200:1 and chances of winning at least £1000 are 70%

From the defendants point of view he must realize by now he has cocked up and stands a 70% chance of having to pay , he gambles a days pay and his reputation.

Lets just suppose the mechanic is your client, would you be recommending he offers 1/2 cost or full cost to sweep it under the rug ?

Now a question as I dont know but..............

the propeller has not been supplied by the contractor or the mechanic, therefore the resultant damage (loss of prop ) is the mechanics fault even if the claim for lost locking washer may not be.
I think the mechanic is the target for action.
 
DAKA said:
Searush is right.

You dont need proof in a small claims court, the judge will listen and make his assessment.

The boat was in a compound while lifted out reducing the chance of theft.

Props are specialist and second hand values low.

Buying a locking washer isnt proof he remembered to lock the tabs or managed to push them far enough.

sending a diver down to recover the prop could be throwing good money after bad.

The locking washer will be miles away, having spun off the prop would stay on held on by 200 hp of forward thrust.
The fact that it fell off when in astern shows that it would have easily come off if someone tried to steel it.
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Couple of points here, if you start small claims and he takes on a solicitor and you lose you could be no better off and have his legal costs, if you start it thinking you will call his bluff and then stop the action you could also be liable for his costs.

If you take on a diver you would be lucky to find it, after a few mins it will be covered in mud, if it didn't sink into silt, spending more money and you could be no better off.

If you are rya send the info to gus in legal he/they maybe able to advise on the the legal side.

I know its hard but you may have to bite the lead.
 
I have legal cover insurance so fees wise I have no risk, and they have been asked to investigate and advise.

I have emailed him asking for his solicitors details as nobody gave me em earlier, and offered to finance the work and let him pay me back over six months should he wish to change his mind.

I think for now I will go down the route of where he admitted liability to me with some witness statements as the easiest option?

Oh well I won't loose sleep over it, but I sure as he'll will hope he is.
 
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