People helping to catch your lines

[flaming]

Many years ago when I was young and looked younger, I was once berthing a boat in a situation where I had a big powerboat with a very shiny stern just in front of our anchor tipped bow, and nothing behind me.

A helper started telling me that I needed to get a spring on to stop us going backwards as that's the way the wind was blowing. I replied that yes, it was, but for whatever reason this boat was trying to go forwards right now, and that in any case I didn't really care if we went backwards a bit, as there was nothing behind us. And asked him if he could take the line he'd reached for and taken out of the hands of my crew and use it to stop us going forwards. He insisted that he use it to stop us from going backwards, using the immortal line "I know what I'm doing, I am a dayskipper you know!"
My reply of "I hold a yachtmaster and am the skipper of this boat" caused him to simply drop the line and leave in a huff.

Whenever I go to help someone with their lines I take the line, take a turn round the nearest cleat and then ask the skipper if he's happy with that. Only rarely do I ever offer any suggestions, and then only when it is clear that the skipper is panicking.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Even against a pontoon, cleats are not always spaced at textbook intervals.. So 'one size fits all' advice offered so readily will not always be suitable and you need to be able to adapt.

Port Bannatyne is weird in that there is no cleat at or near the pontoon end of the finger. There are a couple on the poontoon, betwee the fingers, and one half way along the finger, but nothing you can easily use to hold the pontoon end of the boat to the finger with. It can be ... entertaining ... to watch new visitors discover this.

 

[Cheeky Girl]

Port Bannatyne is weird in that there is no cleat at or near the pontoon end of the finger. There are a couple on the poontoon, betwee the fingers, and one half way along the finger, but nothing you can easily use to hold the pontoon end of the boat to the finger with. It can be ... entertaining ... to watch new visitors discover this.

Thats just put me of going in there then

 

[Poignard]

Many French marinas have short catways with no cleats on them. At the outer end is a curved piece of steel tube sleeved in plastic.

Unless you have a line-threading boathook with jaws wide enough to pass over the tube, someone has to step onto the catway to pass a line around the tube and either pass it back on board or tie it with a knot.

Duncan Wells, a practical sailor if ever there was one, uses a folding grapnel which he attaches to a midships spring and drops it through the hoop. I haven't tried that but there's no reason I can see why it wouldn't work.

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A technique I have seen the French use is to have a bow fender rigged and just slowly motor up until the fender is in contact with the walkway at the inner end of the catway, leave the engine in slow ahead and lash the tiller over to the side where the catway is.

The boat will then sit there without moving for as long as required while the crew rigs shore lines.

While this technique might cause purists of the old school to raise their hands in horror (as they invariably do when anyone suggests anything new ) , it works perfectly, is quite safe, and does no damage . It is ideal for the single-hander.


The only problem is when someone comes to help you and doesn't understand what you are doing. You then get the situation of someone desperately trying to keep your bow off the walkway while the engine is pushing it on and shouting "arrière" at you.

It all adds to the fun of sailing.

 

[dom]

Many French marinas have short catways with no cleats on them. At the outer end is a curved piece of steel tube sleeved in plastic.

Unless you have a line-threading boathook with jaws wide enough to pass over the tube, someone has to step onto the catway to pass a line around the tube and either pass it back on board or tie it with a knot.

Duncan Wells, a practical sailor if ever there was one, uses a folding grapnel which he attaches to a midships spring and drops it through the hoop. I haven't tried that but there's no reason I can see why it wouldn't work.

Boring .

Arrived into Cherbourg a couple of years back in the middle of the night with a few forumites as crew. My good lady - an ex gymnast - decided jumping off would be easier than trying to fish a line through in the darkness. The French pontoon designers were however ahead of her and it promptly sank with her standing atop.

Whereupon another member of this parish blearily appeared in his boxers moored on the other side of his now slowly submerging pontoon to see what on earth was going on ?

 

[doug748]

Those horizontal loops, on the not very buoyant fingers, seem to be being phased out and I shall be glad to see the back of them.


Vannes holds the gold standard for degree of difficulty. For an Olympic diver, it's the 4 1/2 somersault in the pike position.
They have a single, small, shallow, closed, steel staple at the end of a very thin, finger, the staple is in the vertical position. The fingers are very short even for a 10m boat, are bouncy and unstable.
To concentrate your efforts, the head of the berth is an aluminium extrusion with an edge that could slice parmesan cheese.

.

 

[Robin]

Many French marinas have short catways with no cleats on them. At the outer end is a curved piece of steel tube sleeved in plastic.

Unless you have a line-threading boathook with jaws wide enough to pass over the tube, someone has to step onto the catway to pass a line around the tube and either pass it back on board or tie it with a knot.

Duncan Wells, a practical sailor if ever there was one, uses a folding grapnel which he attaches to a midships spring and drops it through the hoop. I haven't tried that but there's no reason I can see why it wouldn't work.

______________________________________________________________________________________​

A technique I have seen the French use is to have a bow fender rigged and just slowly motor up until the fender is in contact with the walkway at the inner end of the catway, leave the engine in slow ahead and lash the tiller over to the side where the catway is.

The boat will then sit there without moving for as long as required while the crew rigs shore lines.

While this technique might cause purists of the old school to raise their hands in horror (as they invariably do when anyone suggests anything new ) , it works perfectly, is quite safe, and does no damage . It is ideal for the single-hander.


The only problem is when someone comes to help you and doesn't understand what you are doing. You then get the situation of someone desperately trying to keep your bow off the walkway while the engine is pushing it on and shouting "arrière" at you.

It all adds to the fun of sailing.

When regularly using such catways we bought one of those detachable snaphook do-hickeys that attach to a boathook/pole, extra large ones to fit frog-end pontoons were available in their chandlers. Having donated mine with a boat sale and regretting same now with high sided mobo, I bought 2 more from Force 4. Even sans boathook they are useful for the line handler to use in a hurry and allow adjustment from on board. Blue sky thinking out of the box....?

 

[JumbleDuck]

Thats just put me of going in there then

It's a very nice place and the problem is dealable-with. You just have take the bow rope back to the middle-of-the-finger cleat and make sure you have something heading in that direction (on my boat I need a spring, on 10m+ a sternline will do) in the other direction.

That said, it's a bizarre way of arranging things.

 

[Leighb]

We have friends who have lived aboard their boat since their wedding. They do like to do things their own way, she usually does the deck work when mooring etc, and has a “special” line to pass to someone ashore who is vociferously demanding to help. They never cause a problem because the line is not made fast on the boat!

 

[dom]

I dunno if this thread is a fair representation, for the jist of it certainly seems to be that only meddlers proffer help to those coming alongside and that they are generally regarded as an irritation.

Yet I for one am often grateful to see a smiling face on the pontoon, such as the time I came into Cowes two up on an IMOCA with the wind well up. Nothing nicer than to see a line of Ossies in matching shirts and shades ready to safely make the boat fast in 30s flat. Even better to be immediately invited aboard their boat for beers and crisps

So I'll still offer others help and wonder why can't people just say, "You know what, we'd rather just practice ourselves" rather than getting all uppity, rigging decoy lines, and other such antics?

 

[Poey50]

I dunno if this thread is a fair representation, for the jist of it certainly seems to be that only meddlers proffer help to those coming alongside and that they are generally regarded as an irritation.

Yet I for one am often grateful to see a smiling face on the pontoon, such as the time I came into Cowes two up on an IMOCA with the wind well up. Nothing nicer than to see a line of Ossies in matching shirts and shades ready to safely make the boat fast in 30s flat. Even better to be immediately invited aboard their boat for beers and crisps

So I'll still offer others help and wonder why can't people just say, "You know what, we'd rather just practice ourselves" rather than getting all uppity, rigging decoy lines, and other such antics?

"Thanks very much for the offer, but we're fine!" said in a friendly tone works well almost every time. Ignoring is rude and confusing, a false rope just weird.

 

[Skylark]

Reading the thread I’m left with the impression that there are hordes of landlubbers loitering along marina pontoon fingers.?

Cocking up a berthing is all part of the rich tapestry of sailing. If you haven’t, it’s only a matter of time ?

 

[Skylark]

Port Bannatyne is weird in that there is no cleat at or near the pontoon end of the finger. There are a couple on the poontoon, betwee the fingers, and one half way along the finger, but nothing you can easily use to hold the pontoon end of the boat to the finger with. It can be ... entertaining ... to watch new visitors discover this.

I berthed there for the first time last year. I was skippering a commercial charter and had a payload of 4 ladies celebrating a 50th birthday. We arrived just at the turn of midnight. Can’t say that I recall an issue with berthing/tying-up but it was a fun packed weekend watching the ladies celebrate ?

 

[capnsensible]

Reading the thread I’m left with the impression that there are hordes of landlubbers loitering along marina pontoon fingers.?

Cocking up a berthing is all part of the rich tapestry of sailing. If you haven’t, it’s only a matter of time ?

It's easy to gather a crowd, a bit like in a seagull less sky throwing one crust of bread away.

Once you are in the berth, re rig the lines as necessary and go back out again. Repeat this so that everyone on board has had a turn. The audience will grow. Tip, have lots of fenders.

 

[Poignard]

One time we arrived in Cherbourg on a breezy day, rather tired, and my wife positioned herself at the shrouds with a line ready to take ashore smartly as the catway was to windward, when I saw a man on a nearby British yacht leap smartly out of his cockpit and march purposefully towards us.

"No need to get off yet" said I to her "this kind man is coming to take our lines."

He marched straight past us without a glance and we drifted across to the boat on our lee side.

 

[NormanS]

If you do want someone on shore to be helpful, it's much better and easier for all, if your lines have eyesplices or bowlines. If you want to rig doubled lines to make leaving easier, that can easily be done later. Handing a great bunch of knitting to someone is asking for delay just when you don't want it.

 

[xyachtdave]

Hold on..I've just remembered an interesting moment on Halfpenny Pier, Harwich!

The tide is rushing out of the rivers Stour and Orwell in the same direction as the stiff breeze. I'm safely tucked up on the inside of the pontoon when I notice a yacht steaming around in circles like a hungry shark before approaching the pontoon down wind and down tide.

He comes in at about 6 knots, I don't offer assistance unless someone asks/needs it, but he shouts for help and throws a line which is in a right state, bits of hosepipe on it, tangles etc.

I'm doing my best to untangle his spaghetti and get his stern line on cleat as he's scraping his way down the pontoon at speed, I get a section of free rope, get a turn on a cleat and attempt to gently slow the boat down.

Unfortunately he hasn't attached the other end of the rope to his boat, so it falls in the water and he steams off for another attempt. The shouting at me to 'hurry up!' and 'what are you doing?' etc wasn't really making me that keen to help further.

Eventually he comes back, rams the pontoon, splinters some fibreglass and attaches himself to the pontoon.

An hour or so later an elderly couple are having trouble with an enormous steel ketch, being blown off a ridiculously tight berth but do get into it without drama etc and the skipper of the fail boat above stands next to my boat and tries to start a conversation along the lines of 'He's cocked that up, should of...'

I give him 'both barrels' and tell him 'at least they've remembered to attach their lines to the boat and put some fenders out.'

He stands on the pontoon for a bit before sulking off.

 

[capnsensible]

A lot of tides ago, I was sat aboard at the dock by the Captiniere (?) at Cherbourg. Just sort of gazing. An elderly French chap rocked up on a worn mid twenties feet something yacht. With no expression or words, he gently bumped onto the dock in front of me. He secured the boat with his main sheet and nipped below. He returned with two fenders around the size of milk bottles, rigged them and went off ashore somewhere.....

 

[prv]

A technique I have seen the French use is to have a bow fender rigged and just slowly motor up until the fender is in contact with the walkway at the inner end of the catway, leave the engine in slow ahead and lash the tiller over to the side where the catway is.

The boat will then sit there without moving for as long as required while the crew rigs shore lines.

That‘s exactly how I always return to my home berth when singlehanded. No drama, no split-second work with lassoos and boathooks, no slewing around on a single misplaced line. I have a known mark on the pontoon abeam the cockpit when the bow‘s in contact, so I can judge a smooth and soft arrival.

I switched to this from my old ”midships line” technique when I noticed how the professional skippers at work are not shy about leaning their boats on a fender as they manoeuvre.

Pete

 

[JumbleDuck]

So I'll still offer others help and wonder why can't people just say, "You know what, we'd rather just practice ourselves" rather than getting all uppity, rigging decoy lines, and other such antics?

If it looks appropriate I'll always offer to take a line, usually saying "My boat's just down there ..." so they know I have at least some experience. If they say "No thanks" I smile and walk on.