Penton Hook to Limehouse - first time on the river and a new boat - help!

[NickTrevethan]

We are getting closer to the purchase of a boat at Penton Hook (not a Broom), which we will keep at Limehouse. But I just learned that Chertsey Lock will be shut until Feb 14.

That's not a bad thing -- the river is far too full and fast for us to venture out, and by then hopefully will have returned to its bed.

But I am not used to rivers, and not used to twin engines, or wheels. Boats with keels and flappy stuff on sticks are my thing so looking for some advice.

Assuming the water settles and they take down the red and yellow boards, we plan to bring the boat down on Feb 22 over two days -- its only 13 odd miles from Penton Hook to Teddington, but given the time to cycle locks, the speed limit and limiting ourselves to daylight, I think that's probably realistic.

Highwater on the 23rd is 7.50am I think - we'd go through around 9 am. Airdraft is 11 feet, so I am a little anxious about the first three or four bridges downstream from Teddington. Anything to stress about? There should be plenty of water under us.

Other things I need to remember are the restrictions on speed to wandsworth, I guess. Anything else?

Have I forgotten anything?

Like I said, the whole trip is contigent on SHepperton Lock being open and normal river conditions.

The other thing I am looking for is someone who can give swmbo and me an hour or two training on handling twin engine stern drives, docking especially. Any suggestions - formal or informal -- informal could be paid with a good meal and drink or two!

Cheers

Nick

 

[oldgit]

My main concern would getting out of the lock early enough to make sure of arriving at Limehouse during their tidal window.
Will leaving an hour after high water give you sufficent time if there are any mishaps.
Your boat has presumably been upstream for some time and if (Sorry when ) it get bounced around in the pool it may clog the filters.
Usually you can crawl to you destination at reduced speed and still get in.
Nothing worse than desperately pushing your motors to get to your safe mooring.

 

[Chris_d]

I think the Locking at Limehouse is +/-4hours of HW at Tower Bridge and you need to book it there is nowhere to wait outside. Therefore I would leave
as early as possible and punch the tide to arrive at limehouse say 1-2hours after HW Tower Bridge. Remember HW at Richmond is 1.5hrs after HW Tower
Bridge so you need to plan and get your timings right. You can only do 8knts max down to Wandsworth and your SOG is likely to be much less
as you punch the tide and slow down for rowers, moored craft etc... Even when past Wandsworth you can't make much more than 8knts in a planing boat
anyway.

With regards to twin outdrives, if you have not used them before you need some practice, there is lots of wheel twirling required to direct the thrust but you
need to know what you are doing. Don't let anybody used to twin shafts tell you to leave the wheel straight ahead and steer with the levers it won't work!
Its a great trip but you need to plan correctly.

 

[NickTrevethan]

Thanks guys, I had planned to run the tidal section pretty slow, and catch lime house 2-3 hours after low water at around 3.30 in the afternoon. If we arrive very early, I thought we could run down towards Greenwich and waste some fuel.

Boat has a bow thruster. Not used one of those either!

Better work out access to filters and make sure I can change them. Would fuel polishing help? My old lister Hr4w would drink anything. These whizzy boats seem more highly strung.

 

[Cashbuyer]

Bowthruster on a planing hull is a real bonus, but don't use it to steer with. Use it, sparingly, to push your bow off or into a mooring or lock side. Or to stop that dastardly wind blowing the bow away from your intended position. And if you turn the 'outer/offside' drive ie the one furthest away from the mooring, towards the mooring/lockside at the same time and go gently into reverse you can slip sideways and show off your mooring skills! Main thing to remember is to take it slowly and gently and ease the power in with small movements otherwise the person on the bow will be heading towards the water. Just in and out of gear is fine. So basically if you are mooring port side to, you would gently push the bow towards the mooring with the thruster and turn the wheel to port and put the offside drive into reverse for a short time just to pull the back in whilst the bow is doing the same. As Chris says think about turning the wheel before you start moving. Think of the drives as pushing and pulling you around with the wheel turning at the same time. Sorry to waffle - hope this helps and makes sense!
Have fun.

 

[alruss]

You will have to check your clearance under Hammersmith bridge if you are near high water. As for maneuvering, with two out-drives you can leave the wheel and use drive only to turn the boat. You will find that on the tidal river you will not use the bow thruster much because with the tide running you can move sideways easily by ferry gliding. I would not attempt to move your boat, with no experience, with a strong tide behind me, punch the tide initially because with it behind you you don't stop, and locks and bridges don't move. You could try raising Greenwich Yacht club to wait at, they have visitor moorings and are open on the weekends. Good luck and enjoy the tidal river.

 

[byron]

As for maneuvering, with two out-drives you can leave the wheel and use drive only to turn the boat

Jeez! That's just about the worst advice you can give someone with outdrives. Chris D. step in here, you have outdrives.

 

[Elessar]

Jeez! That's just about the worst advice you can give someone with outdrives. Chris D. step in here, you have outdrives.

so true. some instructors teach that way though! I despair when they do.

 

[byron]

so true. some instructors teach that way though! I despair when they do.

I would challenge them their credentials to teach then.

 

[Elessar]

I would challenge them their credentials to teach then.

they have a nice little certificate with their picture on.

It is possible to do YM sail, then a conversion course on a single engined shaft drive boat.

 

[byron]

they have a nice little certificate with their picture on.

It is possible to do YM sail, then a conversion course on a single engined shaft drive boat.

Boat handling is an art form in my opinion. Some people are just naturals others will never learn. I've taught people before now who just sit on a boat and become part of the boat. Others can do it while you stand over them but just can't do it alone and never will.

 

[Chris_d]

Jeez! That's just about the worst advice you can give someone with outdrives. Chris D. step in here, you have outdrives.

I saw that but thought better of it, you can leave the wheel straight ahead but the boat is much less controllable. If you know what your doing with outdrives
you make a boat dance like no other and turning the wheel is essential. To leave the wheel the straight ahead is like having sex on your own, you can do it but you can't beat
doing it properly.

 

[thames cruiser]

The other thing I am looking for is someone who can give swmbo and me an hour or two training on handling twin engine stern drives, docking especially. Any suggestions - formal or informal -- informal could be paid with a good meal and drink or two!

Cheers

Nick

There are quite a few good boat handling instructors based on the River thames, and you would have no problem engaging one of them to provide a day of one-to-one tuition tailored exactly to your needs. Another option would be to have a skipper assist you with the passage, but I would only really recommend that if you were 'desperate' as 'doing it yourself' is all part of the fun and excitement!

Bisham Abbey Sailing school would be one organisation (frequently recommended by many). There is also a chap based at Penton Hook, trading as Charlie Delta Marine, whose details I'd be happy to give you if you PM me. Lastly, if you bought the boat from Penton Hook Marine Sales, they should be able to help you too (all their staff are qualified and experienced).

Hope this helps.

 

[Cashbuyer]

You will have to check your clearance under Hammersmith bridge if you are near high water. As for maneuvering, with two out-drives you can leave the wheel and use drive only to turn the boat. You will find that on the tidal river you will not use the bow thruster much because with the tide running you can move sideways easily by ferry gliding. I would not attempt to move your boat, with no experience, with a strong tide behind me, punch the tide initially because with it behind you you don't stop, and locks and bridges don't move. You could try raising Greenwich Yacht club to wait at, they have visitor moorings and are open on the weekends. Good luck and enjoy the tidal river.

Not brilliant advice re leaving the wheel. You'll go round in circles...

 

[RichardN]

Have a look at http://www.thamescruising.co.uk/wordpress/. It is primarily written for narrowboats but the links to the bridge guides etc should be useful.

 

[alruss]

The statement that you can not control a boat without the wheel on out-drives is not correct, I have only had out-drives and on the tidal river, where this boat is going, you do not always need to use the wheel.

 

[Chris_d]

The statement that you can not control a boat without the wheel on out-drives is not correct, I have only had out-drives and on the tidal river, where this boat is going, you do not always need to use the wheel.

I don't think anybody said you couldn't control it without turing the wheel, but it would make the boat much less manouverable and you would need to be much more carefull.
I certainly wouldn't want to transit any of the locks the OP is planning on doing e.g Limehouse, with my wheel locked straight ahead.

 

[Elessar]

I don't think anybody said you couldn't control it without turing the wheel, but it would make the boat much less manouverable and you would need to be much more carefull.
I certainly wouldn't want to transit any of the locks the OP is planning on doing e.g Limehouse, with my wheel locked straight ahead.

OK I'll bite.

take a 35 fter

Inboard props are a metre forward of the stern. Props are large and handed. So using the port engine forward pushes the bow to starboard, and the prop kicks the stern to port, emphasising the turn. The cntre of effort of the boat, ie the resistance to turning or the effort of the wind, is amidships so about 4 metres forward of the props. The rudders are small and useless astern, and limited in use forward.

Outdrive props are aft of the stern. Usually duo prop so no prop wash, or limited by a smaller prop. The cntre of effort of the boat, ie the resistance to turning or the effort of the wind, is amidships so about 5.5 metres forward of the props. So using the port engine forward pushes the bow to starboard a little, but less than the inboard, as the lever the boat has to overome the props is longer. And the prop doesn't kick to help out. The props can be vectored and are effective in forward or reverse when the boat is in gear.

Conclusion, the turning moment offered by an out drive boat without turning the wheel is much less than that of a shaft drive. Yes it can work if it isn't windy, but wind will quickly overcome the boat. Learn to manouvre with the wheel, using one engine at a time, and only the correct engine, and you will instinctively make a sterndrive dance your tune in any conditions.

 

[Ramage]

I dont know if the original poster is familiar with the "Lake" at Penton Hook Marina, but he might be well advised to practice these sorts of manoevers there (if that is permitted) before his trip.

 

[Sulley]

Bisham is good for own boat tuition, if not have a chat with the boys at Penton Sales I am sure Darren or Nick can help. +1 for the "Lake" at Penton Hook.