Oil - to change or not to change?

[Robert Wilson]

This sounds like madness, but what do the wise-ones think?
Regular oil changes essential, or just a con wasting our money/time?

I was talking with a good friend recently who has owned all sorts of top-end cars. He (like most/all of us) had his BMWs etc regularly serviced and paid painfully for the work and materials.
But he says for three years (approx 50,000 miles) he has not changed the oil in his Trouper 4x4 or his wife's VW Touran. He claims the need for oil changes is a myth foisted on us all by the motor/engine industries. His decision is not money-driven.

Granted in engines of yesteryear when tolerances were worse than the precision stuff we now have there would be more "bits" in the oil, but could modern precision machining prevent all wear?

 

[tinkicker0]

I see good engines destroyed by poor maintenance on a daily basis. Change your oil.

 

[davidwf]

Bmw now sell a five year servicing package for less than the cost of one service. They still change the oil every 18000 ish miles if they thought they could get away without changing the oil they would given they are now paying for it.

 

[dt4134]

My tuppeny worth:

Marine diesels run on poor quality fuel that can have been kept in the tank for literally years, are kept in a damp environment, aren't necessarily used frequently and over the winter can be left unstarted for a few months, are often used just for a short period to get the sails up rather than given a good run, and we want them to last for 30 or 40 years.

Car diesel engines get a much easier life (working them hard is good for them) and are not expected to last nearly as long.

Boat engines are expensive and troublesome to replace. More expensive than to replace an entire car of the same age.

You can get 5l of oil for about £16, less if you buy in larger quantities, and it takes an hour or two to replace it after which you can go to the pub.

Seems prudent to err on the side of caution and replace the oil.

 

[chrishelen]

simples, oil=£s new engine=£££££££££££££££££££££££££££s change your oils.

 

[FWB]

I think it's a valid question.
Like most of us I have the oil changed annually.
It's prudent but is it necessary?

 

[Deefor]

Why not take a sample and speak to http://www.millersoils.co.uk/ or http://www.morrislubricants.co.uk/scripts/default.asp

Both used to offer a sample testing service to tell you what the oil was like. Going back a few years but might be worth a call .

 

[tinkicker0]

I think it's a valid question.
Like most of us I have the oil changed annually.
It's prudent but is it necessary?

 

[Neil]

I think it's a valid question.
Like most of us I have the oil changed annually.
It's prudent but is it necessary?

I've read (sorry no ref.) that modern oils don't breakdown like they used to, and don't actually need to be replaced. What is essential is to replace the filter at regular intervals, but then perhaps only add enough new oil to replace that lost in the changing of it.

However, particularly with marine diesels that are sometimes only run to get out of the marina, the cool oil absorbs more (presumably not filterable) contaminants and gets dirtier quicker. However, there is a general consensus that much good oil is thrown away unnecessarily.

I still change my oil though........

 

[macd]

To the OP: sure you're not frae Fife?

 

[tinkicker0]

I've read (sorry no ref.) that modern oils don't breakdown like they used to, and don't actually need to be replaced. What is essential is to replace the filter at regular intervals, but then perhaps only add enough new oil to replace that lost in the changing of it.

However, particularly with marine diesels that are sometimes only run to get out of the marina, the cool oil absorbs more (presumably not filterable) contaminants and gets dirtier quicker. However, there is a general consensus that much good oil is thrown away unnecessarily.

I still change my oil though........

Not true. contamination is one reason to change because the additives that control acidity and solids suspension get used up.

Another reason is that modern oil tends to have less anti wear additives than old type oils had, so once that's been used up you can kiss goodbye to your cam and tappets ect.

Unless you raggies run on:

 

[kieronriley]

oil change

fifteen years two oil changes,three filters,three air filters and one new water pump impellor.so hope my luck holds out a few more years.(if indeed it is luck) Kieron

 

[Robert Wilson]

To the OP: sure you're not frae Fife?

No lad, from North Yorkshire. Once heard that we were Aberdonians or Fifers with the generosity teken out!

Well, thank you one and all for your responses. I must admit I was astounded when he told me that he doesn't change his oil. I have always done so with all my vehicles' and boats' engines, and shall continue to do so.

I am amazed at the "gungy" oil filter (above thread); I am happy to say none of mine have looked like that. I accept oil is not so expensive as to warrant scrimping on changing, but I just wondered if I was wasting my time.

I shall carry-on as before, enjoying the lovely job of draining hot oil from an awkwardly-placed sump plug via a stupidly tiny space below the engine into a not-big-enough-to-take-a-full-sump-load-of-oil-container and then be thrilled by the task of wiping-up spilt oil in the engine bilge, cabin-sole, handles etc etc. Lovely way to spend a morning aboard!!

Cheers folks. Thanks once again, and have a happy Sunday. Perfect day for a sail up here, if not quite enough wind to make it worthwhile trying to persuade SWMO that the Christmas Cards can wait..................

 

[stuhaynes]

My tuppeny worth:

Marine diesels run on poor quality fuel that can have been kept in the tank for literally years, are kept in a damp environment, aren't necessarily used frequently and over the winter can be left unstarted for a few months, are often used just for a short period to get the sails up rather than given a good run, and we want them to last for 30 or 40 years.

Car diesel engines get a much easier life (working them hard is good for them) and are not expected to last nearly as long.

Boat engines are expensive and troublesome to replace. More expensive than to replace an entire car of the same age.

You can get 5l of oil for about £16, less if you buy in larger quantities, and it takes an hour or two to replace it after which you can go to the pub.

Seems prudent to err on the side of caution and replace the oil.

My 60+ year old engine (and hydraulic transmission) demands the most basic SAE30. £7 bloody 99 per litre HTF does that work?

 

[PCUK]

It's the additives in fresh oil that need to be renewed.

 

[GrahamM376]

I shall carry-on as before, enjoying the lovely job of draining hot oil from an awkwardly-placed sump plug via a stupidly tiny space below the engine into a not-big-enough-to-take-a-full-sump-load-of-oil-container and then be thrilled by the task of wiping-up spilt oil in the engine bilge, cabin-sole, handles etc etc. Lovely way to spend a morning aboard!!

Sounds like you need a nappy or two - no not for you, they're great for soaking up or catching oil spills.

 

[Robert Wilson]

Sounds like you need a nappy or two - no not for you, they're great for soaking up or catching oil spills.

So I hear. Funnily enough I have a packet (left by daughter in summer - for her one year old) - I shall take them to the boat, and leave in the "grab bag" for real emergencies

Amazing technical help on these forum(s) !!

 

[lynall]

I always tell people oil cheap, engines/gearboxes expensive, then the mechs time.
Basically what ChrisHelen says above.


Lynall

 

[Boo2]

Bmw now sell a five year servicing package for less than the cost of one service.

How on earth can they do that ?

Boo2

 

[maxi77]

How on earth can they do that ?

Boo2

Compare what they charge and what it costs them, and they get hold of your vehicle for 5 years just think of the extras like brake pads, etc that will get added in. They WILL get their money out of you