New liveabord need some help

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rolfbudd

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Hi everyone, I have had an unexpected major change in my life and have made the decision to give the dream a go. I have never owned a boat and have limited sailing experience, been chartering for 10 years and a few trips of the East coast. But I would rather regret the things I have done than the things I havent. With that in mind we are planning to buy a boat in the Med and give it a go for at least a year, if after that we still like it then we will consider going further afield, the dream being a circumnavigation. The challenge is to find the right boat and get on board, our budget is about £50k and we have found a few boats that look like they would make a good live aboard. Has anyone heard of a Franchini Sintesi 47? center cockpit with large aft cabin (center line bed very desirable by the other half). Cant find much about this yacht anywhere, or a Beneteau 40cc. I know there will be those who advise against doing it with my limited experience but if I dont do it now I may never get the opportunity again, so any advice and news on the boats mentioned, or do you know of a yacht in the Med that might fit the bill. Help me out a bit here folks I really want to give this a go.
 
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The Med is full of boats for sale that will meet your requirements, although centre cockpit boats are relatively rare. The Franchini at that sort of price may well be past its best. Many of the boats are for sale because of failed dreams or the owners have worked though their dreams and are going back to shore life. As a consequence many are well worn and the environment is not kind to the fabric. You really need to go and have a look at a good selection to get a feel for what your money would buy. The two biggest items of expenditure for a liveaboard are mooring fees and maintenance, so size and condition are important to keep control over those two.

You may consider an ex charter boat between 36 and 40' and you should get a 6-10 year old one in that budget. Wont have a big aft cabin but will be well equipped and maintained with modern gear. There are good charter deals going at the moment and may be worth taking one in, say the Ionian to get a taste of the life and be able to see what sort of boats are available. There are active brokers in Corfu and Levkas and a bit of internet research will throw up a whole range of boats for sale, both ex charter and privately owned. Now is a good time to look as a lot of boats come on the market at the end of the season.. If you don't fancy Greece, Spain and to a lesser extent Portugal are good places to look.
 
1bobt said:
Tranona
Why do you always give sensible advice? ...... Boat owners/ buyers are rarely sensible...lol

cheers bobt
Click to expand...

Was with a mate yesterday who is even more sensible. Bemoaning the fact that there are no good boats around for him "not to buy". He loves looking at boats, eagerly anticipating what he will do with them when he gets them . Usually comes to the conclusion they are not worth it and walks away before actually parting with the money. Does this about twice a year. Says it gives him all the pleasure, but none of the downside and expense! Trouble is he rarely goes sailing.
 
Im a bit biased, but old Moodys can be a bargain. Tough as old boots and simple. Lots of good priced ones around, sometimes ex liveaboard.

Try Gibraltar Boatshed for a lived on 39 centre cockpit????

CS
 
capnsensible said:
Im a bit biased, but old Moodys can be a bargain. Tough as old boots and simple. Lots of good priced ones around, sometimes ex liveaboard.

Try Gibraltar Boatshed for a lived on 39 centre cockpit????

CS
Click to expand...

We're biased also and have been living aboard our M47 for 6 months now...currently in Gib before heading to the Canaries. I'm amazed at the build quality and toughness of these boats. You could do a lot worse.
 
Look at lots of boats.Thing to bear in mind is ongoing cost . Marina charges for a 47ft boat ----horrendous.And you will ,at some point ,go in marinas,especially if you are inexperienced. My advice is stay under 12 metres, look at condition,not age. If you are buying in the Med ,pay attention to the engine state----you will motor a lot in the Med,and the previous owner will have done the same!
Experience? we all started with none ! Read the books ,listen to the advice ,take what you need out of it! I have the best boat in the world---bar one! She wouldn't suit you ,however.
 
Hi,some good advice here..can I just add my 3cents worth? I am pretty new to the chartering scene with a view to livaboard in the near future, this year was my second stab at it out of Corfu, first year we had a Bavaria 49 which was great and ticked a lot of the boxes,it also went backwards a treat, which I found very usefull in some of the smaller harbours we visited. I could have happily lived onboard.

This year we hired a Gibsea 51,way too big didn't go backwards at all,iffy sailing, and I couldn't wait to get off the thing. if I was going to buy a livaboard it would have to be under 40ft loa,i noticed lots of biggish boats for sail on my travels, a couple of biggish moodys which I liked, but are they suited to hot climates?..so take your time and enjoy the first happiest time of your boating adventure...hope this helped a bit.
 
If I was looking for a liveaboard boat definately under 12 mtres including all the paraphanalia sticking out.Good engine with all roud Access proper fuel wáter installations.I would also go for a wheelhouse somewhere to be /sit to observe life goning on .Proper space to take a 8/9 foot dinghy.
 
Some good advice above. As others have said, marina charges once over 12m can be extortionate and cost of maintenance, such as new sails or engine, likewise. If you have £50,000 to spend, I would suggest looking at boats nearer to £40,000 - £45,000 as the rest can quickly disappear when updating gear. Updating and adding gear, we have spent around £20,000, most of which was allowed for when purchasing. We could have bought a new eurocrap boat for the same overall price but preferred the older second hand Moody.
 
Wow what a great response, Tranona, we have looked at a few charter boats, my concern was how they have been treated. Not everyone has the same respect as us, I have seen some horrendous behaviour as have probably all of you. My thinking was that a privately owned boat would (not guaranteed) be better looked after but I hear what you are saying. Will keep an open mind.
TQA, not sure about steel and Hunter Passage is a lovely boat, we have looked at them but cant find any for sale in Europe and we have decided trying to start our live aboard life on the other side of the Atlantic might be pushing it and as for sailing her back.. non starter. We will keep an eye out.
Ludd I totally agree, I think the 47 is probably to big, we are now looking more towards 40-42 ft mark. Not a fan of marinas but yes I am sure we will end up in one at some point especially when we come home for a visit. What is the typical pricing structure for marinas in the Med? Do they charge by the meter or in groups, ie. 10-12 and 12-15 etc.? I have a library of books that I have been avidly devouring for many years, hence I am here now 
The general opinion is for 12 meters of less, are the costs that much less then going for 13? This is going to be our new home and while it needs to be affordable it also needs to be comfortable enough for us to live on. I have seen numerous cockpit tents, mostly on US boats, they seem like a good idea turning the cockpit into another usable room during the cooler months. Anyone got any experience of these, any ideas on costs? Please keep the opinions, knowledge coming, you can never have enough knowledge. Thank you
 
rolfbudd, don't get too sidetracked by the 12mtr thing, most of the marinas in the med charge by the square mtr, yes they do have charging bands but the overlap does not really have much of an impact, my 12.86 LOA has the same charge per sq mtr as an 11 mtr LOA. That said over 13.7 mtrs (45ft) you run into an "enhanced" set of regulations - which you may choose to ignore many do.

IF you want to be in Med then you will live on the boat most of the time not in it, if you see what I mean, for us the centre cockpit layout does not provide enough amenity. Large aft cockpits with walk through transom's make life much easier for living on board and mooring up stern to short handed.

As you are new to sailing my advice for what its worth is, take your time, look at lots of boats, kiss a lot of frogs - if you see what I mean.
 
rolfbudd said:
Wow what a great response, Tranona, we have looked at a few charter boats, my concern was how they have been treated. Not everyone has the same respect as us, I have seen some horrendous behaviour as have probably all of you. My thinking was that a privately owned boat would (not guaranteed) be better looked after but I hear what you are saying. Will keep an open mind.
Click to expand...

At the sort of budget you have you will be looking at older boats if you want a privately owned boat. However, it would be misleading to think they are automatically better looked after. Ex charter boats are often much better looked after - remember, they have to be in good running order week in week out so are usually kept in good condition. If you choose a boat that has been in one of the less demanding sailing areas like the Ionian and run by a reputable operator it is likely to be as good if not better than a similar privately owned boat. I have a boat that was chartered for 7 years and it was always kept in top condition. I actually owned it from new, but went that route having been so disappointed with what was available on the used boat market for similar money - most of the private boats I saw needed significant sums spent to bring them up to my expectations. So, do keep your open mind and go and look at a few boats to get a feeel for what is available.
 
rolfbudd said:
Not a fan of marinas but yes I am sure we will end up in one at some point especially when we come home for a visit. What is the typical pricing structure for marinas in the Med? Do they charge by the meter or in groups, ie. 10-12 and 12-15 etc.? I have a library of books that I have been avidly devouring for many years, hence I am here now 
The general opinion is for 12 meters of less, are the costs that much less then going for 13? This is going to be our new home and while it needs to be affordable it also needs to be comfortable enough for us to live on. I have seen numerous cockpit tents, mostly on US boats, they seem like a good idea turning the cockpit into another usable room during the cooler months. Anyone got any experience of these, any ideas on costs? Please keep the opinions, knowledge coming, you can never have enough knowledge. Thank you
Click to expand...

Marinas - some jump from 12 to 15m so big difference in price. OK, bigger is nicer in some ways but we find our 11.5m centre cockpit with good aft cabin is plenty big enough for a couple to live on and comfortable for 2 visitors as well, with 2 x ensuite heads.

Bimini is a must in the sun and so are solar panels, ideally gantry mounted and tiltable, the alternative is a generator. Cockpit tent is very useful and not difficult to make (materials around 150 - 200 euro) if you have a suitable sewing machine but, anything up to 1500 euro to have made.
 
Hi
The reason I drew your attention to that steel boat was

1 it is steel if you hit a whale/container/reef/ other boat it gives you the best chance of survival.
2 it has the wheel on the bulkhead [good for cruising] and not in the middle of the cockpit.
3 built in rear gangplank essential for med style stern to mooring.
4 SERIOUS davits
5 inside wheel station.
None of the above apply to a typical ex charter boat. That boat was set up as a cruising boat.

Yes steel can be a pain to maintain but if a panel rusts through it usually does so slowly and you get time to buy another pump while arranging to have a new panel welded in WHICH IS AS STRONG AS THE ORIGINAL WAS.

I suppose the Passage is a rare bird in Europe. quite a few in your price range on my side of the pond though.
 
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